New 07.00.01.00 Public Beta Update Available Now!

[Shannon V. OKeets]

I used the link in the first post and downloaded the file WorldInFlames-UpdateComp-v07.00.00.00.zip. Then I renamed my World in Flames folder and ran the update. A new World in Flames folder was created but when I double-click on MWIF.EXE, I get a user account control dialog asking if I want MWIF_2019 to make changes on my computer. After I click on "yes", the dialog disappears and I get nothing. Task Manager does not show MWIF running.

So yeah, there does appear to be a problem with this update.

What is MWIF_2019 anyway?

Possibly I made an error in thinking the file is a complete install. Maybe it updates files in the existing folder. I'll try that next and report back.

The name of the executable I create when I compile/build MWIF.exe is MWIF_2019.exe. I rename it to MWIF.exe when I upload to the beta testers and customers. As you might expect, I have numerous version of the executable, and MWIF_2019 is the current one I compile/build.

[paulderynck]

The zip file does do an update to an existing install, rather than being a complete reinstall. I don't recall seeing the active control dialog before this but otherwise the game seems to be running normally now using version 7.0.0.

[MaximKI]

Hey everyone,

I realize there may have been some confusion in the communication on how to install the public beta.

Just like any update, to properly install the public beta update you'll need to have the game already installed on your system. If it's already installed on your system, the only that you would need to do is to download the "Beta Update v07.00.00.00" installer found in the File Downloads section for World in Flames on your My Page HERE and then run it. The public beta installer is not intended to install the full game on your system.

If you do not have the game installed you will need to do the following:
1. Download and install the game using "Installer v3.00.01.0 WorldInFlames-SetupRelease-v03.00.01.00.zip" found in the File Downloads section for World in Flames on your My Page.
2. Download and run the "Beta Update v07.00.00.00"

Hope this clarifies the installation process. If there are any further issues, please let us know.

[Joseignacio]

My mate and I were both successful.

If I may make a guess, it may be related to some problems of old when patching the game. Then, when installing the game, if you had selected a different route to the offered by the default installation (for example c:\games\MIWIF instead of C:\Program Files (x86)\Matrix Games\World in Flames) the installer didn't identify successfully the older version and installed the update alone in the default route. So the update was not in effect.

[Neilster]

I tried Joseignacio's suggestion. I moved and renamed files but the update still said I didn't have the game installed So I moved my saved games to a desktop folder and did a complete reinstall before running the update. This has worked. I then put my saved games in their correct folders.

Be careful with this saved game stuff. Be careful to save saved games under logical folder names and carefully add them again. I didn't bother with the autosaves for each scenario, as that adds a lot of complexity.

Can someone remind me how to set up a game against the AI in Barbarossa? These are my options. I tried Hot Seat but I was playing the Soviets too.

Mode of play.jpg (615.77 KiB) Viewed 1680 times

[rkr1958]

I tried Joseignacio's suggestion. I moved and renamed files but the update still said I didn't have the game installed So I moved my saved games to a desktop folder and did a complete reinstall before running the update. This has worked. I then put my saved games in their correct folders.

Be careful with this saved game stuff. Be careful to save saved games under logical folder names and carefully add them again. I didn't bother with the autosaves for each scenario, as that adds a lot of complexity.

Can someone remind me how to set up a game against the AI in Barbarossa? These are my options. I tried Hot Seat but I was playing the Soviets too.


Mode of play.jpg

Apparently only the version for the beta testers allows one to start a game against the AI (Barbarossa). That's a 4th option not available in the public beta release.

999-AI-Opponent.png (104.97 KiB) Viewed 1674 times

[Zovs]

It’s been over a decade so why not just make a beta installer that installs everything beta where you can point it to any install location and everyone can download?

MWiF is end of life so to speak and so is WITE2 which is way newer and that is exactly what they do, they can get more exposure and fix things quicker this way.

[Neilster]

I tried Joseignacio's suggestion. I moved and renamed files but the update still said I didn't have the game installed So I moved my saved games to a desktop folder and did a complete reinstall before running the update. This has worked. I then put my saved games in their correct folders.

Be careful with this saved game stuff. Be careful to save saved games under logical folder names and carefully add them again. I didn't bother with the autosaves for each scenario, as that adds a lot of complexity.

Can someone remind me how to set up a game against the AI in Barbarossa? These are my options. I tried Hot Seat but I was playing the Soviets too.


Mode of play.jpg

Apparently only the version for the beta testers allows one to start a game against the AI (Barbarossa). That's a 4th option not available in the public beta release.

999-AI-Opponent.png

It's strange because I'm not a beta tester but I was able to start a Barbarossa against the AI before I updated. It would hang in the first combat resolution phase (from memory) but I at least had the option. Luckily the updated version accepts a saved game which is poised at the 1st impulse German ground strike phase.

I've played the German impulse, performed combat resolution and the AIO seems to have moved sensibly. It's now Impulse #3 Axis ground strike. So I'm regularly saving and hopeful things keep going.

I had basically done an historical Soviet setup, deployed forward and stronger in the Ukraine than the centre/north. Bad luck computer. No rational setup for you. This scenario is hard enough for the Jerries anyway and my guess is the AIO will make better decisions than Comrade Stalin.

[CanInf]

yay!! thanks

[MaximKI]

Hey everyone, a new public beta is now live! See OP for details.

[CanInf]

running it now!! thanks!

[kschindl]

Still looking for an AI implementation. It says in a future release and this is already v 7. Anything on the road map or did i miss something as there is no new game with AI available.

[Angeldust2]

No, there is no AI implementation. There is an attempt to develope a kind of scripted computer opponent, but only for the introductory Barbarossa scenario and only for the Soviet side. There is some effort on this "AI implementation" since 3 years and if there is any progress, it is very slow and almost insignificant, especially regarding the very low level of ambition of such development.
In summary, there will never be a working AI for the real game (Global War scenario) and the ressources (time, effort) put in developing a most basic and limited computer opponent for just one side in just the least complex introductory scenario are wasted.

MWIF is still a great game and can be played perfectly well with multiple players, either online or offline, using some workarounds. The ressources wasted on trying to develope a computer opponent would be much better spend on
- bug fixing
- implementing still not fully coded optional rules
- making one-map scenarios playable
as it was announced and promised by Erik Rutins some years ago.

Now I have a question for you, kschindl and others, who are asking from time to time for an AI opponent. What are you hoping for? What would a hypothetical working computer opponent give you, what could not be provided by a human opponent much better? I just don't get it and I would really love to understand your reasonings or expectations. What am I missing?

[paulderynck]

An opponent that can be soundly beaten and won't flip the board over, or throw dice at people.

[Neilster]

Now I have a question for you, kschindl and others, who are asking from time to time for an AI opponent. What are you hoping for? What would a hypothetical working computer opponent give you, what could not be provided by a human opponent much better? I just don't get it and I would really love to understand your reasonings or expectations. What am I missing?

I live in Tasmania so there are very few potential MWiF players around my time zone. So I'd like a competent AI I can play when it's convenient for me. It's not even necessarily about the time zone. Many people are too busy or have unpredictable demands on their time to have a set time to play another person/s. An AI is always keen to play when I can.

[Angeldust2]

This argument I do understand well. I agree, it would be nice to have a computer opponent, which is as capable as an average human opponent, using the exact same rules and not needing to be boosted by some artificial bonuses. Unfortunately I am not aware of ANY strategy game of at least moderate complexity, which offers such a feature.
MWIF will never have such an advanced, challenging AI. MWIF will even never have a basic, only mediocre AI for the Global War scenario either.
But MWIF can be played very well off-line, with two players doing their impulses sequentially, not needing the immediate presence of your opponent. The interaction between players during an impulse is mostly non-existant or very low. Sometimes you can guess the reply of your opponent, if he is prompted for something and do not even need to wait for his response.
Neilster, I, based in Europe, have finished scenarios playing guys from Australia and Canada using whatsapp chat and sending files back & forth. If you are serious about playing MWIF, I would start to play you, right now, before Easter. The different time zones (+12h?) seem no big issue to me.

[JamesHunt]

I understand that you don´t want to show off an non-refined AI to the public but I guess most interested in this game can handle WIP mechanics with sensitivity.

Is it possible to make the current AI available also for non-betatesters? Perhaps with a warning "wip, may be broken, etc) and only include it in the open beta update so that in case a regular customers turns up buying and expecting everything working out of the box flawless will not be bothered by the WIP AI.

Thanks

[jaeenox]

I understand that you don´t want to show off an non-refined AI to the public but I guess most interested in this game can handle WIP mechanics with sensitivity.

Is it possible to make the current AI available also for non-betatesters? Perhaps with a warning "wip, may be broken, etc) and only include it in the open beta update so that in case a regular customers turns up buying and expecting everything working out of the box flawless will not be bothered by the WIP AI.

Thanks

100% agree with this. With the beta testers stating that they rarely ever hear from the programmer, what could this hurt? There are maybe a dozen people that regularly post in the WIF forums. The game is dead, if anyone is silly enough pay $100 for it when it is on sale for $20 regularly, that is their fault. Let the few of us still interested have access to everything.

[Joseignacio]

Anyone can post whatever he feels like, but I would like not to see so much wishful thinking here, asking for impossible things instead of being practical and asking for possible things.

Anyone who has played board WIF, or enough MWIF for the matter, knows perfectly well that it is impossible at this time to make an AI for a game with such complicated rules, so many different units that allow different strategies (like MAR or PARA for example) which permit invasions, paradrops by surprise, naval support, air combat..., not to speak of complicating the situation with optionals, which affect directly to strategy and tactics greatly, like "In The Presence Of The Enemy".

Besides, according to the comments of some of the best informed in the forum, there is few communication between Steven and the Beta Testers, and even at smaller maps like the introductory Barbarossa, which is very limited in scope and mainly about land combat and only two powers, the AI doesnt advance, and nowadays after one or two years is still far from complete. In spite of Steven experience in AI in his previous career, and his great interest in developing one for MWIF.

So, calling for advances on this matter, which does not go forward and it is clearly undoable, is also calling for diverting resources for other matters that should be possible, like more scenarios, resolving the growing bugs number, et al.

[pzgndr]

it is impossible at this time to make an AI for a game with such complicated rules, so many different units that allow different strategies (like MAR or PARA for example) which permit invasions, paradrops buy surprise, naval support, air combat...

Impossible? I think I did a pretty good job scripting events and AI for my Advanced Third Reich mod for Strategic Command War in Europe, to have a challenging computer opponent for both Axis and Allies. And I think I'm doing a pretty good job programming the AI for Empires in Arms to have a challenging computer opponent for seven Major Powers. So I kinda chuckle to myself when I read comments like this. Now, it may not be "impossible" but it certainly is tedious and time-intensive to continually iterate between scripting/coding and playtesting. I was at it for YEARS with A3R and I've been at it for YEARS with EIA. It's doable. It just takes lots of time, time most developers cannot or will not spend working to improve their AI. I do it as a hobby effort, it's like puzzle solving for me. And, I must say, it also takes lots of time that impatient players don't have either. Many EIA players checked out long ago and there's only a handful left who keep up with the official releases and my fairly frequent beta versions and hotfixes. I keep going. The funny thing is that I am actively continuing code development for EIA and practically begging players for feedback so that I can finalize this game with bug fixes, game enhancements, and AI improvements. I check in here on the WIF forum and it's like an opposite situation. Whatever. I do what I can and I'm enjoying my retirement "job" doing what I want to do without any deadlines. It is what it is. Personally, I wonder what Steve's situation is these days and what the future of WIF might be if he checks out completely. Frank Hunter checked out and his Campaigns on the Danube and possible sequel games are in limbo, probably lost. I offered to try working on his code if I could get it, but Erik Rutins had no contact with Frank either. It's a shame. EIA might have been lost if I hadn't offered to work on it and Marshall Ellis provided me his source code. Frankly, I'm getting tired of the code development but perhaps there's someone else out there who could work with Steve to continue work on WIF or take it over from him. Time will tell. I hope Steve is well and returns to WIF. If not, Matrix Games owes us some sort of status update on what the future plans may be, either abandoned in place or pass the torch to somebody. We shall see.