4 player game (Orm, Peskpesk, jjdenver and Mayhemizer)

[rkr1958]

MWiF is by far the best wargame that I've ever owned or played. The only burr in the saddle, and it's a very irritating one, is production. I think I've mastered it as well as anyone has, like a few other die-hards here. But, I think this burr and the time taken to master it has turned away a LOT of potential MWiF players and future buyers. This has to be obvious to the "powers that be" and if is, I find it baffling that this important issue hasn't been addressed with gusto and reworked. To me it's simple, give the player the FULL option to route resources to factories. By all means keep, or even improve, the current AI routing algorithm, just give us the option to turn it off and do production ourselves. [:@]

By the way, I understand the argument that their may be edge cases that the rules might be violated if the players have that option, but in my opinion having a rule in production violated occasionally is preferable to what we have now which requires a LOT of time optimizing production and then having to redo that optimizing again because the program decided to change a route, or worse change what resource it's send in trade, that it didn't need to change. [:@]

Sorry for the rant and hijacking your AAR ...

[Orm]

ORIGINAL: jjdenver


EDIT: I think I see another problem created by following these 5 steps. FF was lending FIC res to SU. But if an NEI oil is sent to Canberra then it's not possible to ship the res to production for SU, and SU is not in a good position to lose a BP right now.

No, this was not an issue. The resource couldn't be sent to USSR because there were only 2 Allied CPs in the Persian Gulf and both of them were used to transport the 2 CW resources to USSR. No other route to USSR was open.

MWIF enforce that traded resources are delivered, if possible. If there was a route for any French resource to reach USSR, then the program would have enforced the delivery of it. Hence, making the use of CPs needed for other purposes impossible.

Besides that, it wouldn't have affected BPs anyway. Only saved oil.

[Orm]

ORIGINAL: peskpesk

There appears to be a Gladiator cvp stuck in Liverpool. It can't be selected and shows up as an empty box on the unit window (see attached pic). Anyone know how to "unstick" it so it can be used?

Obe possibility Check IF they have got Sentry attribute set, IF so try to remove it.

This is worrisome.

It does not appear to be on sentry.

It appears like that when the turn ended so it didn't happen during the end of turn. Maybe it can be fixed by editing?

[peskpesk]

Yes we have a problem, the CVP Gladiator appears to be both in Liverpool and in loaded on the CV Illustrious.
I think we need a Edit to fix the problem.

[jjdenver]

Any idea how to fix it with an edit? It seems it cannot be fixed?

[Mayhemizer_slith]

Has anyone fixed anything related to those units?

[peskpesk]

Hmm, maybe somthing like Edit to move the CVP to the force\destroyed pool and give CW a build point and a pilot.
But it's not so fun for CW.

[Courtenay]

A duplicated unit is bad news; it indicates that some data structure got more or less corrupted. If it is more, a simple edit might not fix the problem. There could be a cascade of bugs resulting from this. I hope not, but I am worried about the state of the game.

[Orm]

ORIGINAL: Mayhemizer

Has anyone fixed anything related to those units?

Not that I am aware.

I checked old saves. And the first save I found with this buggy CVP was the one that had the Archangelsk oil edited. Save number 142.

141 didn't have the bug, but 142 has. As far as I can tell. So my current suspect is that it happened when the oil was added to Archangelsk. But what do I know? Nothing. [:)]

[Mayhemizer_slith]

ORIGINAL: Orm

ORIGINAL: Mayhemizer

Has anyone fixed anything related to those units?

Not that I am aware.

I checked old saves. And the first save I found with this buggy CVP was the one that had the Archangelsk oil edited. Save number 142.

141 didn't have the bug, but 142 has. As far as I can tell. So my current suspect is that it happened when the oil was added to Archangelsk. But what do I know? Nothing. [:)]

If so, it’s weird. All I did was change number of oils on that hex...

[Courtenay]

I have seen MWiF do strange things with units before; it probably didn't have anything to do with the edit. However, I have always been suspicious of any game where that happened.

[Centuur]

Are any of you beta testers? If so, I would suggest to use the debug tool which is available in a beta test version.

If you are at the end of any phase where CW units can be moved and the carrier is in a port, you can simply remove the CVP from the game (save the game first). If you do, both units should be removed from the map and only one will become visible in the removed pool.

After you've done this, you should be able to use debug a second time to put the unit back unto the map and load it on the carrier.

[Mayhemizer_slith]

Can we move on and play impulse until we are at the end of CW naval phase, then post save file here and ask some beta tester try to fix this?

[peskpesk]

Lets try that.

[jjdenver]

Ok we will move. Allies have had a council of war and decided to probably pull Gort out of Suez. The other option is to sail RN to 4 box of Red Sea and try to use shore bombardment to hold Suez while landing another Indian INF. It's a tough decision - we will think about it some more and maybe I have time to do CW naval move in morning.

[jjdenver]

After starting the turn and getting mostly through naval moves, the allies had a talk.

Axis have dropped email saying they are fine to take allied surrender in the game. SU thinks maybe they can fight on to amuse Axis.

But as west allies I feel game is over. In a game where Axis have their shot through 42 or 43 then probably they should continue playing through 44 and sometimes 45 to give allies the chance to come back and do some attacking. However in this game allies never got their shot and there is no chance for allies to do much. I see conquest of SU in the future that can't be stopped. So to me the game is a foregone conclusion and there is not really a moral imperative for allies to continue to give the Axis their chance to attack - the whole game has been Axis beating babies with a hammer. As Axis I know from playing in games like this that at some point it ceases to be fun. At least it does for me. In my last completed game I was playing allies - landing in Japan and attacking through Poland and Italy and low countries when Axis player indicated that he wanted to surrender. When he explained why I realized that yes he had no chance and my "fun factor" had diminished from 44 to 45 as the resistance that Axis could put up faded.

I joined this game in 40 and at the time I told my ally that I thought the game was probably already lost. China was a fait accompli, CW had more problems than a math book, and USE wasn't good. Then I compounded the problem by suggesting SU should attack JP. But SU wasn't in position for this and was only able to launch an ill-prepared attack later in 40. I was stuck thinking about how I play SU which is to be ready to go into Manchuria if JP commits everything to China. I should have considered the _actual_ situation which didn't favor an SU attack because SU was not in position for this. I think this played a critical role in making sure that the small remaining chance for allied victory was flushed down the toilet.

Axis played a great game. I didn't see/read much about the early part of the game but the invasion of Malta then mid-east was excellently done. I thought maybe there was too much splitting of effort by axis in France (Bordeaux) and mid-east to allow Barbarossa to do very well. But of course SU was very out of position and Barbarossa has destroyed 3(?) fact already and gained Moscow in just a 2 or 3 turns while causing truly massive casualties to the Red Army. So again a job well done by Axis.

I can say that in my games as allies I've never lost China but in this game China is basically lost. They have Kunming but the rail line to send a res there is cut and the chicom are about to face big problems in the north. So Japan is also doing very well and will soon accomplish not only recovery of the part of Manchuria that it lost but take most of Siberia in time to turn attention to CW/US.

Since I feel game is done and Axis have indicated surrender is fine I am dropping from the game.

Petteri feels that he can continue to play this one to amuse Axis as long as they are enjoying it so I wish him the best of luck. Maybe in future we will team up in a game with 2D10 and he can play western allies in Europe which is very time-consuming while I can take a lighter responsibility.

Sorry to readers that we could not provide a competitive game. I know from reading many AAR's over the years that reading an AAR like this is not as satisfying as reading an AAR where the tide ebbs and flows and there is mystery over the final outcome.

[Admiral Delabroglio]

Thanks for the AAR. I'll be following the next one.
In J/A 1941, the situation indeed looked bleak for the Allies. Maybe bad weather in S/O could save them.
However, id did not significantly hinder Germany during the first turn of the war against the USSR, and even helped with those annoying marsh hexes.

Best regards