Frustrated Convoys

[clestochi]

Actually, the convoys are not frustrated but the CW player managing them is frustrated.

The situation, CW, me, made some errors when laying out the convoy pipes. I am trying to fix it but every time I recompute the the resource I just re routed, a new problem with another resource emerges. It’s like whack-a-mole. I’m fairly sure that I have enough convoys in the right places but every time I make an adjustment a new and strange resource routing emerges somewhere else.

The easiest answer is to just start over and do it right in the first place but I would rather figure out how to fix it.

Does anybody have a process they use to incrementally adjust resource routess. Or have insight on how to make these changes?

Thanks!

Chris.

[paulderynck]

There's a video on doing production.

Generally the process that has worked for me is to establish defaults and override them when needed. You can also use the "route" settings to try and force a resource to go through specific sea zones. That process has had problems over the course of several public beta releases but the latest one is supposed to be better.

There are constraints. Lent resources and BPs must be delivered if possible, which can cause the CP routing software to rearrange things but the game is trying to follow the rules.

There's also been examples posted where a player's frustration cannot be blamed on the program. They turn out to have a CP-routing bottleneck in them that the player had not spotted. When in doubt if the program got it right, post a zip of a saved game from the production phase and see if others can see if that's the problem.

[Centuur]

Being from the old boardgame, I first make sure that I've got the convoys there where I want them to be. Of course, a certain Admiral in Kiel doesn't want them to stay there and that's usually when the problem starts.

The best way to handle the production planning in MWIF is not to bother with it during play. Simply make sure the convoys are sitting in the right sea area at start. The global map with the active Allied convoy settings on is a very good tool to use. If something happens during an impulse, don't go to production planning and try to fix things. It's not usefull, because next impulse things might be better or worse...

Just before preliminary production planning start, I check the global map with the Allied convoys. After that, I use the following order to get things right or as best optimized as possible:

1. Oil resources for all Western Allies. I make sure they get saved or use in production if needed. For these I use default settings.
2. Second are the non oil resources. I now check the map for unused convoys. Those are usually a good point where things are going wrong. If indeed things are wrong (and they will be things wrong, because the program tends to use the Bay of Biscay before it uses the FarOes gap) I redirect the Canadian non oil resources as defaults and use the route system to send them through the FarOes gap. On non oil resource I only use default settings if they are needed.

When doing this, I will NOT close any of the active Western Allies production planning. Only if all are correct, I will close them. I never press recompute and than directly close the CW or France (or the US if it is active). I always first check on the others to see if they are correct. That way, I cannot mess up things for one of the other powers without knowing it...

If things are getting messed up really good (due to heavy convoy losses f.e.), I'll erase all default settings and start again...

[clestochi]

Peter and Paul,

Thanks for the feedback. You are right about Faroes Gap. I’m trying to route Canadian resources there and every time I recompute it, the resource routes thru Bay of Biscay. Not sure why. I just tried re setting all resources to idle and and assign new orders. I’m still having problems. Maybe it has to do with clearing defaults or using overrides?

[AllenK]

I haven't tried this yet in version 3.

Under 2.9.5 I got the Canadian resources routed through Faeroe's Gap successfully but had to manually set each one as the Default route. For whatever reason MWiF wouldn't automatically recognise the availability of CP's in The Gap. This was still progress as for a long time, even the manual routing through The Gap didn't work.

My general approach to convoy routing is to let MWiF do most of it and only intervene when it does something inefficiently. To date, with the exception of the Faeroe's Gap problem (which now seems to be resolving) and when manual routing completely disappeared following one of the Beta updates, it has worked well.

This is qualified by 'worked well' is in relation to my preferred set-up, which may not be either the most optimum or that used by other players. Peter and Paul's advice matches my experience.

[Mayhemizer_slith]

Is there a way to set route for a resource so that program can not change it in any situation?

[Centuur]

ORIGINAL: Mayhemizer_slith

Is there a way to set route for a resource so that program can not change it in any situation?

No. Because that would mean that a rule violation is possible (no convoys available and still the resource arrives)...

[gravyhair]

This single undying issue has made MWiF un-fun, and it's hard to understand why the design choice was made. So bad. 8-/

[paulderynck]

ORIGINAL: Centuur

ORIGINAL: Mayhemizer_slith

Is there a way to set route for a resource so that program can not change it in any situation?

No. Because that would mean that a rule violation is possible (no convoys available and still the resource arrives)...

And also No because it could be the resource or the CPs needed to satisfy a lend when other routes have been interrupted. Lends must get through, if at all possible.

[Mayhemizer_slith]

What is wrong with this?

Newcastle Australia resource don't want to go to empty factory in Montreal.

[Mayhemizer_slith]

CW has
22 factories (red numbers)
12 oil resources (black numbers)
23 non-oil resources (yellow numbers)
White numbers are required CPs to do what I planned

Cyprus res is idle
1x Canada res, 1x Canada oil and 1x Malya res are sent to France/China
1x Malaya res is idle
All Caribbean/US oil are saved to Canada
Burma oil is saved in Burma
2x NEI oils are saved to India and Singapore

2x UK res goes to UK (15 factories left in UK)
2x India res goes to India (no factories left in India)
1x Australia res goes to Australia (no factories left in Australia)
1x Australia res goes to Canada (1 factory left in Canada)
1x Canada res goes to Canada (no factories left in Canada)
1x Australia res and 2x India res goes to UK (12 factories left in UK)
4x Africa res goes to UK (8 factories left in UK)
3x Canada res goes to UK (5 factories left in UK)
2x Caribbean res goes to UK (3 factories left in UK)

I have extra CPs as program agrees, but somehow I can't make production to work as well as I want to.

Did I miss something?

Note to self: send 2 resources from Australia to Canada, it saves one CP (5 to Canada + 3 from Canada to UK vs 9).

[paulderynck]

Could the program be trying to route the Australian resource going to Canada west instead of east?

Also you said the Malaya resource is idle but the production sheet says it is going to the UK. It also says British Guyana is going to Toronto instead of the UK so then Montreal must be fed by the stay-at-home resource.

[Mayhemizer_slith]

ORIGINAL: paulderynck

Could the program be trying to route the Australian resource going to Canada west instead of east?

Also you said the Malaya resource is idle but the production sheet says it is going to the UK. It also says British Guyana is going to Toronto instead of the UK so then Montreal must be fed by the stay-at-home resource.

Yes, I saw those two. I try to manually route that Australian resource.

[Mayhemizer_slith]

Program says that there is not route between Australia and Canada. Resource was going through Pacific. Problem soved by saving one oil less and used to production.

[Shannon V. OKeets]

ORIGINAL: Mayhemizer_slith

Program says that there is not route between Australia and Canada. Resource was going through Pacific. Problem soved by saving one oil less and used to production.

Yay!

---

Seriously, your graphics of the situation rather dramatically illustrate why I kind of despair at ever getting all the convoy routing done to every player's satisfaction. There are too many possibilities to hope for the program to do everything 'automatically'.

I'll have to figure it out for the AI Opponent, but then I only need to satisfy one player - myself.