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Les the Sarge 9-1: Thanks. There was quite a few other things, but my post was getting a bit windy. Beware of one thing though, the doughboy factor! When I first started playing it I was quite repulsed as those infantry looked so doughboyish, but the tanks weren't too terribly bad, and as I say some of them had to have looked as good or better than their SPWAW counterpart. The sounds, particularly if you don't get that soundpack I mentioned, can also turn you off real quick. But as bad as those deficiencies may shock you, it's at least interesting from the standpoint of how completely differently combat is handled, and of course the campaigns/maps/OOBs are interesting to look at the differences.

Over the past 1 1/2 years I've been switching back and forth between SPWW2 and SPWAW. I guess because I'll play one of them long enough that some irritation will drive me back towards the other one again. Too bad all the better points of each couldn't be made into the ultimate SP. It would be nice to have a version that was inbetween. If CL treats campaigns seriously, then of course it has a major edge on the current SP's.

BTW, huge hint here for CA and CL. It would be nice, real nice if the OOB database would be in alphabetical order, instead of whatever order it's in (probably unit number like in SPWW2), and update that order as new entries are posted. It can be real fun trying to find all the Italian 100mm FH's and comparing which one is better, when if they're like a lot of units they're scattered a lot of time. Of course if you could just click on virtually every screen, even in the purchasing screen, the unit in question in the database, then that would eliminate the necessity for alphabetizing.

After reading all the treads on this post all I can say is you are a Steel Panthers fan or you are not.

I play SPWaW, SP3 Moderna, SPMBT and SPWaW. And love them all, they all have there own ups and down but all in all great games and all for free now thats a good deal.

It seems some poeple forget that SPWaW is the only SP that made it to the Windows Native enviroment thanks to Matrix.
The other SP never did, Dos and that's it. They are all great games in there own ways and the appreciation for the folks that put there time "also for free" to improve the SP serie is fenomenal and not one ever ask for a cents, done it all because they love the game, my hat is off to all these gents.

Like Grenadier mention, nice to start SP3 or SP3 Moderna and play one of Wild Bill's campaigns or scenarios I love it and many other scenario designers that did scenarios for these older version of SP and you will see that a lot of them are here today on these forums.

I never understood why all the bashing goes on between groops, maybe it's a lack of appreciation or maturity but for me I am a Steel Panthers fan and always will be and I can't ever say thank you enough to all that improve these game just for the love of the game.

I thank you a million times for the great games.

Tankhead, I agree with your post 100%. We shouldn't knock each others games because in a scense we are creating animosity within our own gaming community. The players who play SPMBT will also be the ones to also play CL Modern/Central Front, so it does no good to slam one game over another. I don't have SPMBT yet, but I will be glad to play it since it has improvements over the original SP2. We are only hurting our own gaming community by slamming other games, and this is also the market that Matrix will need to draw on to help make their games profitable. So if you don't like a game, offer suggestions to help improve it, or just don't play it.

I said enough on the patch thread so won't repeat it here,

but,

the only wargamer, that's a dumb wargamer, is one the gets another wargamer angry enough to not play a wargame against him in the future eh.

I would rather play a crummy wargame against someone, than a perfect wargame alone.

I have seen this same group vs group hostility in cardboard wargames as well.
The end result, people like myself, walk out on the whole lot when the bickering spoils the experience.

It got me to wander off and stop wondering what was happening with the current state of the game, for Global 2000 the current name for the evolved and merged Advanced Third Reich and Rising Sun games.

Then no one wins.

Gentlemen,

Combat Leader may be everything Matrix says it will be. I hope it is and more. But when will we see the first modern module? Next year some time? Those of us who are playing SPMBT may be operating on the theory that 'a good plan today is better than a perfect plan tomorrow.' And look at the nations in SPMBT. It would be unthinkable to make a modern warfare tactical game and not include the US Army, or the Soviet Union. But how often do you see Chile, or Mozambique, or Cyprus, or El Salvador?

And will Combat Leader concentrate on Pact vs Nato, the Middle East and Vietnam? Or will there be something for the Little Wars fans.

troopie

Troopie, I like your use of Patton's quote to ehance your point! It does make perfect sense. At least we will have something till CL
Central Front. A modern game in the hand is worth two games in the bush.

Live and let live,

Im a steel panthers fanatic,there I said it,first step to recovery right? lol

I like SPMBT,I like any steel panthers,only thing I don't have installed is SP1.

Les,No need to bash the ole dos stuff,

Its still a gas.

your fancy XP machine just doesn't like eating that code,ehh?

Late updates... I was on vacation, so I didn't get to play around too much. ("Road trip!") Came back and snagged the patch - I'll only note that what I read specified that SPMBT v1 was a*beta*, so.... <shrug> after patching, I didn't see a lot of difference, other than sound FX dring the opening splash screen. <G> I still get the odd "HQ teleportation" effect (as US, when retargeting FASCAM - next round my HQ appears in the enemy backyard). Played arond some more, and found an oddity, at least - US defend versus French assault, 2002. A whole load of mech infantry and MBTs versus a company or so of M1A2s, no prob. (I've whomped North Korea a lot with that kinda setup.) Except... them big bad Abrams will *quite* consistantly fire HEAT against the tanks, and SABOT versus the APCs. <!!> A qick test (same setup but with Ivan instead of Yankees) showed roughly the same, but the T-90 HEAT (125mm) seemed a helluva lot more effective against the reactive armour of the FrogTracks. <shrug> Relatively minor, I gess, especially for a beta. I shold post to the SPMBT list/forums abopt it, but then I'd have to try and catch up some there, and I can't hardly keep up *here*. <heheheh>

All in all, SPMBT in my opinion isn't too shabby. CL <drool><drool> is in the future still, so for more modern weirdness this'll work. (Gotta wait for the Canada OOB, tho. Beautiful map it gave me for US vs. CA in Alberta, but no units except the "placeholder" HQ. (I used to live in Montana, and that gullied plain was *perfect* for the non-mountainous sections of Montana/Alberta/the Dakotas/Wyoming....)

One more quicky post here, for the mo'... I'm on lunch. <G> Slapped in the US armoured force vs. Viet Cong ambush scenario, alternating with playing "Brave Men on Betio" in SPWAW; either one, with defalt settings, can be a little tricky in spots but winnable as US, as the briefing recommends - but, *d@mn*, it gets ugly if you take the "enemy" side! <heheheh> Both games, the best the US did was a draw - on Betio (SPWAW), they still had a ton of Marines with a few tracks (one M4, one M3 <?>, and a few LVTs left) and most of the victory locations, but they paid *big* for 'em. (Pity stayed my hand... pity I was out of ammo. <EG>) In the Nam, no forces even got to the third victory hex (just across the little bridge), and in the last (late last night) game, I got to see 1) one of the UH-1B gunships (2 7.62 minigns, 2 rocket pods) taken out by friendly fire <!!!>, and 2) the *other* gunship get nailed by my mortar barrage <!!!>.

All in all, I'm still a WWII kind of guy, tho, so SPWAW is the first to play... ooops, I'm gonna be late, seeyaz!

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My guess is MBT....