Matrix Games Forums

In the South, the panzers break out to the northwest. SS Wiking Division kicks a Soviet airborne division out of Kharkov and captures the city. Meanwhile, 9th Panzer Division is just one hex from cutting off the Soviet South Front.

Comment: I could have sent the Wiking to complete the encirclement, it had the MPs, but I opted for a shot at Kharkov instead, as there was a lot of industry left.

Don't know what happened really, suddenly I broke through on every front. Don't know if you have the expression "ketchup effect" in English, we have it in Swedish, you shake and shake and nothing happens, and then suddenly there comes a whole lot! That is what it felt like. Here is a summary of industry destroyed this turn. And there is more in the other two hexes at Moscow that will have a hard time to evacuate.

Losses turn 13. Still not very impressive, but I guess that will pick up the next few turns.

Wow nice developments for you. Well played! This will be a great read over the next few months.

It boggles my mind however that players leave cities in a position to be overrun.

Just wow. Terrific job Tarhunnas! Even if you wind up taking a beating/losing some units, losing that much industry should hurt the Russians a lot I would think. To put it in perspective, that is about 10% of the Russian armaments that just got put out of action. You also still have a couple of turns to clean up the pockets yet and get your line fairly short coming into mud except in the south around the Crimea. The river line will be fine during the mud, but winter could pose an issue there.

Well played sir! [&o]

I would be resigning as the Soviet here.

ORIGINAL: Flaviusx

I would be resigning as the Soviet here.

Is it really that bad?

As I see it, unless Tarhunnas has a serious brainfart, he has a lock on a minor victory, minimum. These losses in rail cap, manpower, and industry are deep and probably irrecoverable. It's unlikely he can outright knock out the Soviets from the war, but the Soviets aren't getting Berlin here.

ORIGINAL: Flaviusx

As I see it, unless Tarhunnas has a serious brainfart, he has a lock on a minor victory, minimum. These losses in rail cap, manpower, and industry are deep and probably irrecoverable. It's unlikely he can outright knock out the Soviets from the war, but the Soviets aren't getting Berlin here.

OTOH the Russian losses are still VERY light. And the Germans are going very deep in the center and the south. There are a lot of possibilites for a really nasty Soviet Blizzard Offensive. As you say, if Tarhunnas rolls with the attack and perserves his force, we are looking, at the worst, at something like the Somme on the Dnieper in 44. At the best, he has a shot at AV in 43. I do believe that this supports the early contention that a Sir Robinisky Defense is very risky against a good player

Over all, most impressive Tarhunnas. [&o]

BTW, I still keep reading the the Germans might as well resign after Turn 1 because they don't have a prayer now that HQ Buildup is nerfed [8|]

Wow that a lot of industry. That's what 41 barb is all about.

ORIGINAL: Tarhunnas

Don't know what happened really, suddenly I broke through on every front. Don't know if you have the expression "ketchup effect" in English, we have it in Swedish, you shake and shake and nothing happens, and then suddenly there comes a whole lot! That is what it felt like. Here is a summary of industry destroyed this turn. And there is more in the other two hexes at Moscow that will have a hard time to evacuate.

Pompack, I anticipate Soviet losses will pick up markedly in the next few weeks before mud hits and these pockets get consumed. Germans have a full month of clear weather to chew up the Soviets, and they are past most of the easily defensible terrain. The Soviet for his part is now trapped in a terrible feedback loop where he has much industry within reach of the panzers and at the same time needs to massively redeploy his army; all this on a rail network that is severely weakened.

But, honestly, what matters in the long run isn't these casualties. It's the replacement situation. In this case, an abysmal one. You cannot grow the Red Army very easily with these kinds of losses, nor can you shift it around quickly with a rail net that is now down to 60% of its original efficiency. These are strategic, long term losses.

However, I'm glad to see this game proved once and for all, I hope, that Sir Robin isn't the answer. It never was. We testers knew this long ago and I never took the Sir Robin nonsense seriously.

I agree with Flavio about the Sir Robin strategy. I have never seen a tester that used this strategy last long at all.

As for giving up though, i wouldn't yet. The Soviet army is pretty resilent despite taking a severe beating. We'll just have to see what it looks like come blizzard time. As a German player, I would keep the pressure on all the way until blizzard too.

Very nice. From my exp if you take Leningrad/Moscow/Tula/Kursh/Orel ect ect to Rostov the Russian winter O is really poor. The german losses will be low and once summer hits your panzers will be at full strength and you rip through whatever line he puts up, if you have 2 large spearheads.

I have to agree with Flaviusx, with the losses of industry ect its over unless T really screws up during the winter.

You probably did not bag as much stuff under 1.04.22 as before it, but its more then enough for at least a minor win.

Nice job.

Pelton

ORIGINAL: Tarhunnas
Don't know what happened really, suddenly I broke through on every front. Don't know if you have the expression "ketchup effect" in English, we have it in Swedish, you shake and shake and nothing happens, and then suddenly there comes a whole lot!

Haven't heard the expression, but the concept is certainly understandable. And I'm sure something many people older than say about 15 has likely experienced.

Closest we have (that I can think of) is 'the dam breaking'. Cracking, groaning, trickles of water, and then suddenly: WOOSH!

Turn 14. Not much new happening. Most activity in AGC turns on rescuing the exploiting Panzers. It is possible to open a supply route to all of them except 10th Motorized, now surrounded in the northern suburbs of Moscow. It is not possible to reseal the pocket however, but I hadn't really expected that. The place is crawling with angry Soviets. Like poking a stick in ant-heap. Might be possible next turn though...

In the South, the pocket is closed, but most of the Soviets were able to escape the trap. The Wiking was surrounded in Kharkov, but a supply path has been opened.

Losses are depressingly low... eh Soviet losses that is.

Turn 15.

In the Moscow area, there is a new breakthrough north of Moscow. Advancing motorized units capture Ivanovo, with its industry still in place, and almost Vladimir (didn't have the MPs to enter the city after kicking out the defenders). However, it was not possible to reseal the encirclement, and many of the Moscow defenders are oozing out eastwards. Overall, I feel I did some mistakes and didn't use the opportunities as good as I could have.

In the South, about 10 Soviet divisions are encircled southwest of Kharkov. Otherwise not much happening. I will have to turn southeast to capture the Donbass cities next turn, but Q-Ball has built up a very strong defense there.

The area north of the Criema is feeling like a problem about to happen, I do not really trust the Rumanians to hold that front if the Sovs start to feel offensive down there.

ORIGINAL: Tarhunnas
The area north of the Criema is feeling like a problem about to happen, I do not really trust the Rumanians to hold that front if the Sovs start to feel offensive down there.

I generally don't trust the Rumanians to hold my coat in 1941! Poor morale and equipment, many units under strength, generally not good. I have no idea if they are fairly represented in the game or not, although this is one of the weakest representations I have seen in any game.

Oddly in the winter I find their mountain brigades quite useful, but I let them sit and refit until October or Novemeber (except for the first few weeks of the campaign of course) so they get their morale up and are in the high 90s TOE wise when they hit the front.


Very impressive advancement to be certain. How's the supply situation?