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ORIGINAL: Quixote

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

Question about USMC 43 Squads...

I notice that I'm beginning to get them into my pools, as of 12/42. However, none of my USMC regiments have a scheduled TOE upgrade if I click "Show soft" in the LCU List screen - it shows a "-" for that column, and looking at the TOE of the units shows that USMC 42 Squads are in the TOE at present. Do I need to combine the USMC units into USMC Divisions in order to get the upgraded squads in my TOE? That would be a shame, as I like the regiment-sized invasions for targets such as Maloelap, Jaluit, etc... and I'd like to move on those once I have Essexes, etc.

You don't need to combine units to get the upgrade. I upgraded a regiment-sized unit in San Fran to USMC 43 squads very recently (within the last two or three weeks) with no problems.

Hrm, that's good to know. I'll check it out as I get more squads in the pools. Thus far, I've used 218 squads (base forces and the like, I assume), with 44 in the pools - despite a build rate of 54 and only 23 days of availability. Perhaps the 218 have occurred from upgrades to base forces.

Maybe it's that the standard "USMC Rife Squad" builds through 12/42? I don't know. All of my USMC regiments look like this:



I haven't turned them to upgrade allowed because the LCU List screen doesn't indicate to me that the TOE is due to be upgraded.

Also noticed that the 1942 Combat Engineers just began arriving in pools, with the same situation as the USMC 43 squads. Do they auto-convert to the new device like rifle squads do as I upgrade units?

What's going on here? Why hasn't he built this up more?

Can't say for sure without asking him - [:D] - but IJ players are faced with far less engineering resources than Allied players. Might be he's just got those scarce resources at work someplace else, especially at this early date.

ORIGINAL: witpqs

What's going on here? Why hasn't he built this up more?

Can't say for sure without asking him - [:D] - but IJ players are faced with far less engineering resources than Allied players. Might be he's just got those scarce resources at work someplace else, especially at this early date.

That's exactly what confuses me. He's been building like crazy everywhere else on the map. But not here. The Solomons are at their SPS or higher, for the most part. The Gilberts and Marshalls are built up a bit. The Kuriles are well-built. He's been building on Sumatra, Luzon, Mindanao, the Celebes, Timor... why is Java so sparse?

He can't have forgotten about it, can he? Or think that it's currently unreachable for me?

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

ORIGINAL: witpqs

What's going on here? Why hasn't he built this up more?

Can't say for sure without asking him - [:D] - but IJ players are faced with far less engineering resources than Allied players. Might be he's just got those scarce resources at work someplace else, especially at this early date.

That's exactly what confuses me. He's been building like crazy everywhere else on the map. But not here. The Solomons are at their SPS or higher, for the most part. The Gilberts and Marshalls are built up a bit. The Kuriles are well-built. He's been building on Sumatra, Luzon, Mindanao, the Celebes, Timor... why is Java so sparse?

He can't have forgotten about it, can he? Or think that it's currently unreachable for me?

I was unclear - my point is that he is not building there because he is building in all those other places. He is using all of his engineers and has no more. I presume that what little building that has taken place on Java is due to whatever base forces that are there (just a few built-in engineer squads).

ORIGINAL: witpqs

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

ORIGINAL: witpqs



Can't say for sure without asking him - [:D] - but IJ players are faced with far less engineering resources than Allied players. Might be he's just got those scarce resources at work someplace else, especially at this early date.

That's exactly what confuses me. He's been building like crazy everywhere else on the map. But not here. The Solomons are at their SPS or higher, for the most part. The Gilberts and Marshalls are built up a bit. The Kuriles are well-built. He's been building on Sumatra, Luzon, Mindanao, the Celebes, Timor... why is Java so sparse?

He can't have forgotten about it, can he? Or think that it's currently unreachable for me?

I was unclear - my point is that he is not building there because he is building in all those other places. He is using all of his engineers and has no more. I presume that what little building that has taken place on Java is due to whatever base forces that are there (just a few built-in engineer squads).

Yeah, I got it [:'(]. I'm just wondering why he's made that decision.

Question about air unit logistics...

My opponent is doing a lot of air group resizing. Obviously, taking replacements and upgrading units consumes supply. I can't find anywhere in the manual that details exactly how much supply. Does anybody know how that is determined? Is it based on any or all of the following?

- Plane type: F, FB, DB, MB, etc.
- Number of engines: 1, 2, 4?
- Maximum load of the plane
- Plane durability? Some other attribute?

Which is it?

Basically, I know he has multiple 81-plane IJNAF fighter units. If those were normally 27-plane Sentai, or even 42-planes, and he's running 70% or 80% CAP on them every day for 2.5 years, he's looking at 4K-5K extra supply burned just on CAP duty for those planes over those 2.5 years. Not that much, really, but it adds up - especially if he has 10 units doing so. I suspect the real supply cost would be in taking replacements for these units, and upgrading them. I suspect it's around 10 supply per plane, but can't confirm. Does anybody know?

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

Question about air unit logistics...

My opponent is doing a lot of air group resizing. Obviously, taking replacements and upgrading units consumes supply. I can't find anywhere in the manual that details exactly how much supply. Does anybody know how that is determined? Is it based on any or all of the following?

- Plane type: F, FB, DB, MB, etc.
- Number of engines: 1, 2, 4?
- Maximum load of the plane
- Plane durability? Some other attribute?

Which is it?

Basically, I know he has multiple 81-plane IJNAF fighter units. If those were normally 27-plane Sentai, or even 42-planes, and he's running 70% or 80% CAP on them every day for 2.5 years, he's looking at 4K-5K extra supply burned just on CAP duty for those planes over those 2.5 years. Not that much, really, but it adds up - especially if he has 10 units doing so. I suspect the real supply cost would be in taking replacements for these units, and upgrading them. I suspect it's around 10 supply per plane, but can't confirm. Does anybody know?

Just did some tests. Interestingly, I could not get any Supply numbers to budge when I took Patrol Plane replacements. Pulling planes into group reserves takes the same amount of supply as taking replacements. But PA-type squadrons did not use supply when taking either reserves or replacements, that I could see. I looked at all bases within a 15-hex radius, and nothing, nada, zilch - none of them moved whenever I clicked the arrows.

Here are the costs for the rest and the airframes I tested it with:

12 supply
Fighters (A5M4, Ki-27b)
Fighter-bombers (Ki-45) interesting that this only takes 12 supply...

15 supply
Torpedo planes (B5N1, B5N2)
Dive bombers (D3A1)
Float planes of all types (A6M2-N, E13A1, E7K2)

18 supply
Recon (C5M, Ki-46)

30 supply
Transports (Ki-56, Ki-57, H6K2-L) so patrol plane transports aren't buggy...
Level bombers (G4M1, Ki-51) interesting that a Sonia costs as much supply as a Betty

0 supply?
Patrol plane replacements?


Obviously I didn't test on all types, but I suspect that it's by plane type rather than any other value, and that it would hold true across all services/nations.

You are simply looking for something to fill your time until you get brave and go after the lower Gilberts again. You can take it, and defend it better than most places in the centpac.

You are incorrect I think, Ailinglaplap in the Marshalls is also 30K stack - depending upon you mod.

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

Question about air unit logistics...

My opponent is doing a lot of air group resizing. Obviously, taking replacements and upgrading units consumes supply. I can't find anywhere in the manual that details exactly how much supply. Does anybody know how that is determined? Is it based on any or all of the following?

- Plane type: F, FB, DB, MB, etc.
- Number of engines: 1, 2, 4?
- Maximum load of the plane
- Plane durability? Some other attribute?

Which is it?

Basically, I know he has multiple 81-plane IJNAF fighter units. If those were normally 27-plane Sentai, or even 42-planes, and he's running 70% or 80% CAP on them every day for 2.5 years, he's looking at 4K-5K extra supply burned just on CAP duty for those planes over those 2.5 years. Not that much, really, but it adds up - especially if he has 10 units doing so. I suspect the real supply cost would be in taking replacements for these units, and upgrading them. I suspect it's around 10 supply per plane, but can't confirm. Does anybody know?

Just did some tests. Interestingly, I could not get any Supply numbers to budge when I took Patrol Plane replacements. Pulling planes into group reserves takes the same amount of supply as taking replacements. But PA-type squadrons did not use supply when taking either reserves or replacements, that I could see. I looked at all bases within a 15-hex radius, and nothing, nada, zilch - none of them moved whenever I clicked the arrows.

Here are the costs for the rest and the airframes I tested it with:

12 supply
Fighters (A5M4, Ki-27b)
Fighter-bombers (Ki-45) interesting that this only takes 12 supply...

15 supply
Torpedo planes (B5N1, B5N2)
Dive bombers (D3A1)
Float planes of all types (A6M2-N, E13A1, E7K2)

18 supply
Recon (C5M, Ki-46)

30 supply
Transports (Ki-56, Ki-57, H6K2-L) so patrol plane transports aren't buggy...
Level bombers (G4M1, Ki-51) interesting that a Sonia costs as much supply as a Betty

0 supply?
Patrol plane replacements?


Obviously I didn't test on all types, but I suspect that it's by plane type rather than any other value, and that it would hold true across all services/nations.

That is very interesting. I have found that the IJ can build as many planes they want but that the 25,000 supply at the base, and the supply required to replace platforms limits the IJ.
Bombing and bombard takes it toll on supplies as does the rare torp hit in 1942-1943 on xAK's moving supplies. Moving this kind of supply out to the outlying LOC takes it toll too
that in 1945 I believe it is supply that limits the IJ and not oil or HI ..

What really gets me is the relatively huge cost of the level bomber replacements. 30, compared to 12 for the Nick. And the Nick is a better bomber than the Sonia, or even the Lily in some cases! Really weird.


I really think that Patrol units are bugged, and not using up supply when replacements are taken.

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

You are simply looking for something to fill your time until you get brave and go after the lower Gilberts again. You can take it, and defend it better than most places in the centpac.

You are incorrect I think, Ailinglaplap in the Marshalls is also 30K stack - depending upon you mod.

I admit that I feel I am probably a bit timid in regards to reactions by KB. I don't think I can set up my stuff in the proper way to react to such a thing, and I read that white paper that was posted a while back about the inner workings of the USN in regards to CV operations - namely, in regard to CVs being tied to amphibious landings. It really does cut to the heart of the matter. If your VF squadrons are pulling triple duty (CAP, LRCAP, and escort) it just doesn't work. You need to cut at least one of those out. CVEs fill that hole. I don't feel I have enough of them just yet.

Part of it is that I lost a fair number of APs and AKs early on, defending SOPAC against early IJN advances. I believe that it saved Noumea for me, but it cost me about a dozen commissioned assault ships. Ouch.

I know KB is based at Truk. I got intel, via sub attack, in mid-December that Hiryu (at least) was transiting to/from the HI. I just don't know whether it was to or from. The timing is right for it to be rejoining KB at Truk. Another week and I have 40% working torpedoes. Then I'll be much more comfortable using my subs as an advance cordon. Launch 6, 2 "hit" and 1 duds. Still 1 does damage. Better than launch 6, 2-3 hit, and none do damage...

The trouble is that MM is using Nells extensively for Nav Search, and my TFs routinely get detected in a 90-120' arc from NE to SW of Tabiteuea, within 15 or 20 hexes. It's a critical base if I want to take Cent Pac as a route of advancement, right? I guess I could try to skip it and go straight for Mili, but all those seem to be similarly defended. Maybe I could try a CV raid to probe the defenses? I debated sending my CVs at Kwajalein, but instead I sent them to New Zealand en route to the Indian Ocean...

Or am I totally wrong? It's not that Tabiteuea itself presents a tough nut to crack. It's that I don't think I can get within 2 days of it without KB meeting me there. And that I certainly can't take right now. The CVs might live, but it would be at the cost of CVEs and amphibs. Losing such ships (and their VPs) would be my one allowable error, leaving me none to give in all of 1943, I think. Idunno.

Present VPs for reference:



My gains are largely from retaking NW Australia, or base building. Somewhat from bombing LCUs at Horn Island, or from air losses. But I'm close to the 3:1 ratio. I need to be trading far better than that if I want the 2:1 during 1945. I need a 1:1 or better, IMO, from 1943 onwards...

I think your assessment of Tabi is correct. You will need it to advance up that route. Level 6 AF and you can stage 4Es with full bombload...that will make it tough for him to defend the rest.

It might be possible to island hop all the way up from Ellice islands though? Can his search reach that far down? You would need Nanumea. After that its just a 4 hex jump that can be done under LBA. He could still intervene but it would be a smaller commitment risking less assets for now.

I've thought about it, but I think it might be better to just rush in and grab Tabiteuea. If I pussyfoot around just south of there, he'll reinforce and he'll really know something is coming. That said, I've taken long, slow advances in the New Hebrides area so far, and if anything it's seemed to make my next move unpredictable to him - the when, at least, though not what I was doing next.

The trouble with Nanumea is that it's SPS 0/0. Arorae does have SPS 2 for the AF, but none for the port. I suppose I could throw up some airfields on the Ellice islands themselves - they're closer to Canton. With 2-3 air groups on CAP there I could provide a relatively safe staging area? But the more I think about that, the more I wonder why would I even bother?

I wish I could get some solid sig int on what's on the island. A while ago I got hits on an Ind. Mixed Brigade or an Infantry Group on the island, which is easily handled by an Allied division or some USMC regiments plus armor... My concern is that if I grab Tabit too soon, he'll be able to simply suppress it forever unless I stick around with CVEs or CVs that KB can come slaughter. He has level 2 AFs on Tarawa, Makin, and Nauru. I suppose Ndeni is now AF 5 and is only 15 hexes from Nauru. I can make that island untenable for him at least.


CVs currently just east of New Zealand. I'm still going to try a raid in the Java area, I think. I'll hold the CVs at Melbourne until I decide. He's got subs outside of Sydney and I don't want him seeing where my guys are.

Went over my stockpiled sig int tonight. Game currently stands at 1/4/43 - I finally have 40% working torpedoes!

Gleanings from the sig int, confirming aerial recon of a few bases: the Gilberts and Marshalls are very lightly held on his part. Significant troop investments in the Solomons, as well as seemingly in the southern DEI (without the airfields or air forces to match). In order from west to east -

Nauru: 4 units. 2 JNAF units, though one may have been cycled out (doubtful)
Ocean Island: 2 units. 1 JNAF, the other a construction company (old intel - last aerial recon showed 2 units and about 15-18 auxiliary aircraft [Jakes])

Tabiteuea: 5 units. 24th Air Flotilla, 3rd Ind. Mixed Brigade, 48th Naval Guard, 2 Const Co (probably moved out), 1 AA Bn, 1 FA Rgt
Tarawa: 2 JNAF units. Unknown total number of units.
Makin: Unknown
Jaluit: 1 JNAF unit, 1 JNAF Coy, 1 Naval Guard (can't fit much more than that for stacking)
Mili: 3rd Garrison Unit, 1 JNAF unit. [Starting naval fortress.]
Majuro: No intel...
Maloelap: 11th Air Fleet (interesting), Naval Fortress. [Likely also has naval guard or something here]
Wotje: Wotje Base Force, 1 Naval Guard, 1 JAAF AF Bn. Small stacking limit here. [Also comes with 14x 4" and 6x 5" CD guns...]

I'm wondering if a massive, simultaneous landing (even using xAP and xAK) could take them all. Complicated plan, and I'm sure some efforts would fail or need to beat feet back to Hawaii or Canton, but...he's leaving them really lightly defended. His aircraft focus seems to be on the Coral Sea area. I have units 100% prepped for all of the above targets, and they should be enough to overwhelm what sig int and aerial recon have shown to be there, particularly in the case of Nauru, Ocean, and Tabiteuea. Tarawa, Makin, and Mili are more dicey, while Maloelap could be interesting due to the naval fortress and small stacking limit.


In New Guinea and the Coral Sea...

Milne Bay: 2nd Garrison unit, 13th JAAF Base Force
Port Moresby: Guards Mixed Brigade. Known 4 units here.
Merauke: 2nd JNAF Coy, possibly nothing else.
Shortlands: 1 Naval Guard, 1 Const Bn
Munda: Empty? Not built up.
Tagula Island: Indpt SNLF Coy, but 4 units sighted
Kiriwina: 2 Const Bn, 1 JAAF Bn. 4 units sighted - other probably a Naval Guard?

Some of the sig int in both of these theaters is several months old, however I have no reason to believe that much has changed for most or all of these places, given stacking limits on the atolls or aerial recon from the past few weeks.

Also of strategic import - MM has commented several times now on resizing units to size 81 for sweeps/escorting. This could make things messy for me by exacerbating the problem that many Allied players have with aerial battles of attrition. I've done the math and the flip side for him (much more supply consumption) is simply not enough to break him. A couple thousand per unit, maybe, over the course of the war. Plus the cost of upgrades, around 1000 every time he upgrades to a new model.

So I've decided that I should probably fight somewhere where he'll have to contend with airfield stacking limits. This means that I should be focusing on the Gilberts/Marshalls first, I think. I intend to also move on the SE tip of New Guinea since he doesn't have large airfields built up there (size 4 at most), and 200 aircraft can be dealt with. So the near term plan stands as stated in my previous updates, though perhaps getting a bit more ambitious.

The raid on Java or Sumatra may still be on. It will force me to be patient with the moves on the Gilberts/Marshalls, which can only be a good thing as I wait for more LSTs to arrive (about a dozen over the next 2 months). Benkoelen is AF 4, Palembang is 5. Unknown numbers of aircraft based in the area. Noticed while scrolling about the map that he has repaired the Oil at Palembang, though not at Samarinda, Mili, or Tarakan. Crunching his Oil and Supply numbers are going to be my strategic focus this game. I seem to be down militarily, particularly on the ground, and I haven't taken out any CVs yet...but from an earlier email I know his Oil totals are much lower than mine are in my game against Bullwinkle.

Not a fan of that resizing stuff. But you can do it too although you have to wait until early 44 I think. Thats when the USMC FS get their last resize. Some USN squadrons can be resized even earlier if I remember correctly.

I did some resizing but only for training purposes and it turned out I didn´t need to in the end.

ORIGINAL: JocMeister

Not a fan of that resizing stuff. But you can do it too although you have to wait until early 44 I think. Thats when the USMC FS get their last resize. Some USN squadrons can be resized even earlier if I remember correctly.

I did some resizing but only for training purposes and it turned out I didn´t need to in the end.

I can resize now if I want to...some squadrons. The pools don't really support it.

I don't care much if he resizes, it just makes me consider that he probably has 5-7 IJN squadrons of 81. I haven't counted them up yet (many squadrons don't have their final resize until 1944 or 1945), but Rufe squadrons that later upgrade to A6M5 can then resize to 81 as well... I'll count them up now while I watch The Strain, heh.

In any case, if I destroy a lot of the aircraft in the unit, it just takes him 5 weeks to rebuild or else burn ~1000 supply to "de-upgrade" and then another 1000 to upgrade: double the expenditure. He's also going to run out of aviation support, especially if I refuse to meet him near level 8-9 AFs as often as possible. I have many axes of possible advance. The only one that's really been neglected has been the one that uses NW Australia as a springboard to Java as I'm not really interested in a slugfest through the DEI.

EDIT: Apparently you can't look up resizes in Tracker, or else I just don't know how. I'll have to try and remember next time I do a Japanese turn.

Might be viable to resize when the Hellcats comes online though. You will end up witgh thousands of Wildkittens in the pool. I never found a use for them as they are crazy outdated and even the FM-2 version can only do 330MPH when it comes available in 44. [8|] But they might work well for ablative escort. Obviously range will be an issue though...

Playing with PDU OFF means I will have to use them on the CVEs this time around though. At least the VRF squadrons upgrade to Hellcats...

I guess I don't see why you would want to attack everywhere at once in the Marshalls, Gilberts, etc. Seems very risky and harder to protect.

You have plenty of time, no reason for you not to go slow and methodical and safe. imho.

IMO, its gamey to re-size air groups to 81 as Japan. I don't care what it is used for. My rule of thumb is no re-sizing above what is already in play. If Japan has a size 42 IJN fighter group, then that is the largest a re-sizing can go.

Regardless of what Japan has on an island, a bombardment TF will hit it hard enough to disrupt the troops. That is why those old BBs are kept around. [;)]