Matrix Games Forums

Falling off the end of the list. Time to bump it for the new people.

Cheers, Neilster

One thing which I think is very important for the CW (and france) is to know which battles to fight ...and which NOT to fight, in order to cut-your losses! Below I present two strategic decisions to NOT fight ...both of which I have carried out in my at present IRL game and which Im still quite happy about.

CASE 1:
SITUATION
Axis stated the game by sep/oct - nov/dec to build face up Ge CV and lay down both a Ge & It TRN and Amph ...in mar/apr Ge moved into Belgium and at end of turn managed to get a shot at Lille which he took and ended the turn ...

THREAT
Playing with the 2d CRT and with Lille goon the road to Paris is way open, our (wallies) big fear now was that Ge during M/J would destroy the french army in the clear terrain infront of Paris, blitz past Paris to the spanish border to put Ge in a position to lauch an attack on Spain already during the 1st or 2end impulse of J/A ...with the potential worst case scenario being an early fall of Gibraltar in time for either a 41-barbarosse or a 40/41-sealion with the combined Ge/It fleet...

RESPONSE
As it happened the wallies won the initiative in M/J and the axis declined to reroll ...we then retreated the French army from the Belgien border back into Paris or behind the Seine leaving only a few units in Strasbourg, Mets and a corps to create a ZOC lock ...while the CW units retreated towards Bordeaux and mountain hex adjacent to Spain.

REASONING
The move "behind the Seine" pretty much gave up Paris ...BUT this move also ensured that Ge would have a very hard time getting to the spanish border without both installing Vichy AND collapsing it (very expensive in USE!) ...AND even in this case Ge would not be able to start J/A anywhere near the Spanish border atleast winning us a few precious impulses and getting the CW units in a blocking position in the mtn hex next to Spain ...as a added benefit this move to defend behind the Seine also ensured or atleast would make it much harder for Ge to prevent France from LL 5-8 bp to CW during the M/J turn ....

CASE 2:
SITUATION
In J/F 41, Ge has shown its not going to be a 41 barb ...Ge hasnt yet attacked Spain but is looking at it hungrily at it and the UK ...in Egypt CW is clearly supperior with 2 mechs, HQA and a couple of Inf and Ter units ...but Ge has started to transport the first HQA, Arm and Mech units to Libya/Egypt ...Japan is starting to build lots of divs and looks to be preparing itself for a possible M/J attack.

THREAT
The CW position in Egypt is quite strong, but in 41 should Ge choose to employ the full power of Luftwaffe CW cannot hope to hold unless the position is reinforced significantly ...which will not only leave India, Indian Ocean and South Africa way open in case of a Jp attack, but also (playing with limited oversea supply) and "worse" threaten the supply of the army of Egypt ...and its just sooo expensive getting a bunch of mech, hqa and AC *stomped* facedown out of supply ....

RESPONSE
We had already build a suplypoint which was on its way to Egypt ...and taken care to NOT attack Iraq with USSR in order to leave the CW army a "backdoor" out of the middle east ...ei. from Iraq it would then be able to rail to Murmansk provided USSR was the active! (or stay put in Iraq depending on situation.) - As it happened CW choose in J/F to evacuate the whole Egypt army with 5 TRNs.

REASONING
Evacuating Egypt ...ensured not only that our army there would live to fight another day ...but also that we did NOT have to send more troops there...ensuring that instead of weakening our defenses vs. Japan we could strengthen them ...and still send a Mech & HQA to UK/Portugal to deter Ge from doing a Sealion or attack on Spain.

................................
Both cases above IMO were great succeses since in choosing to NOT FIGHT the wallies took charge of the game by closing our "downside" risk ...and taking away part of initiative of the axis ...ei. the situation in the IRL game now is that 41 is over and both Ge and Jp has effectively been denied any major successes ...while CW has conserved its strenght for the fight in 42 ...ei. Ge has been denied crushing either CW or USSR on "its own in 41" ...and will now have to fight the combined might of both CW, US and USSR in 42 !

Anyway this was all just to make a point that its important to make the AI understand when NOT to fight ...and choose to make a "strategic" withdrawal.

Christian, your examples are both really good, and not that rare occurences in a typical WiF FE game.

You're right that the AI should know when NOT to fight, to fight another day. This is something that you need to know how to do, nearly with any major power.
Giving up Egypt in your case, allows for keeping the British army alive, and this is real good play.

But, there is one thing I do not understand : Where did this army went ? You mentionned Iraq, but how is the British army supplied when going to Iraq ? It needs to be supplied, both to go there, and also to conquer it. Only with the supply unit ? If it is the supply unit, you need for the turn to be long enough for the supply to last long enough for the British to walk there, and conquer it. And when it is conquered, how are they in supply there ? From India through Kuwait ? These are just questions I ask to enlighten me, they are no criticisms [:)]

ORIGINAL: Froonp

Christian, your examples are both really good, and not that rare occurences in a typical WiF FE game.

You're right that the AI should know when NOT to fight, to fight another day. This is something that you need to know how to do, nearly with any major power.
Giving up Egypt in your case, allows for keeping the British army alive, and this is real good play.

But, there is one thing I do not understand : Where did this army went ? You mentionned Iraq, but how is the British army supplied when going to Iraq ? It needs to be supplied, both to go there, and also to conquer it. Only with the supply unit ? If it is the supply unit, you need for the turn to be long enough for the supply to last long enough for the British to walk there, and conquer it. And when it is conquered, how are they in supply there ? From India through Kuwait ? These are just questions I ask to enlighten me, they are no criticisms [:)]

Actually my name is Claus ...

The army from Egypt was eventually evacuated from Egypt using TRNs ...so a wp inf went to Aden, a 6-6 Mech went to India another inf to the "3-seaarea minor port in the Indian Ocean", a inf-div to another minor port in Indian Ocean and HQA, another Mech and eng-mot-div to South Africa ...to go on to Europe later. - I WAS contemplating to go to Iraq ...in which case I would have been supplied immidiately by suplypoint and later through USSR who would then have attacked either Jp or It to become active ....

I'm curious what the Axis did in that game then ... sit back and watch?

The Axis spinning it's wheels in 1941 leads to Axis defeat. In 1941 Germany has the dominant force on the board and if they don't use it to expand their economy and/or take Gibraltar they are doomed. They might create a mighty sitzkrieg force but the Allies can break those by the end.

[The latest rule is that Germany and the USSR have to be at war for the Allies to trace supply through Russian territory or vice versa.]

Actually my name is Claus ...

Sorry Claus, I don't know why I thought it was Christian.

ORIGINAL: trees

I'm curious what the Axis did in that game then ... sit back and watch?

The Axis spinning it's wheels in 1941 leads to Axis defeat. In 1941 Germany has the dominant force on the board and if they don't use it to expand their economy and/or take Gibraltar they are doomed. They might create a mighty sitzkrieg force but the Allies can break those by the end.

[The latest rule is that Germany and the USSR have to be at war for the Allies to trace supply through Russian territory or vice versa.]

we have currently just finished S/O 41 ...Part of the story is that JP had previously been beating CH to a pulp so that by the end of 40 CH was down to just the commie city in the north and the nationalist city in the south-western mountains both of which were threatened ...at the same time we the allies were quite hard pressed on USE vs. JP ...we especially had a big tension problem since our entry was low and we had either rolled high and not gotten a chit or pulled a 1 or 0 into the tension pool ...and by end of 40 we had about 16 total entry vs. JP and no more options to pick to try to gain tension ...before S/O 40 we thought CH could hold out until a USSR "surprise" offensive could come crushing down on JP in 41 (we play with JP / USSR 39-autorenewed in 40-pact ...) however JP had a bit too much luck (2 x 18 dicerolls) in S/O ...blasting through the chinese lines ...so that by N/D CH was trying to trick the JP player into taking a few extra attacks ...while waiting for the juisy 41-chits to go into the USE-pool before surrendering...to make a long story short, year later (almost) end of S/O 41 JP is BIG...

JP attacked in J/A on a 10% global "fine" impulse ...blasted through 4 CW corps in Malaya and grabbed a bunch of islands in the east pacific while landing in NEI ...during S/O 41 JP took out NEI ...but still has made no incursion into the Indian Ocean ...where due to us wallies considering this theather the crucial one in the "Pacific war" (to prevent JP and GE from linking up!). Current defenses in the Indian Ocean from east to west consists of Burma (INF +2 MIL +2 TER), India (MOT + MECH + 2 TER + MIL + GAR), Ceylon (MIL), "double minor port" (Bel TER), "Triple minor port" (INF), Aden (wp INF + TER), Somalia conquered from IT (zip), Madagascar (MIL putting ZOC on both ports!), "double minor port in Portuguese congo(?) (TER) ...and South Africa (MIL, MECH, TER) ....

Generally speaking Ge took more casualties during 41 than CW ...or atleast the same or so ...Ge is now preparing for a barb-42 with a simultanious throust from Jordan to Russian held Iraq (...with a threat of JP surprise invasion in Persia playing in my mind). Anyway things look bright US just got into was vs. JP in S/O 41 and will most likely be in total war, after which USSR will become active from attacking IT, from N/D 41 ...so looking forward to 42-barb (actually Im playing USSR, but helping "a bit" with CW until Im active).

I have tried a new strategy this time build 2-3hex forts just infront of the Dnerpr trying to achieve 3 goals:
1) slow the battle down so my airforce of 13 fighters/8 tacs doesnt get run over facedown on the ground.
2) Prevent Ge from getting the 3 ukranian resources for "free" / without applying "significant strategic weight" thus weakening him elsewhere allowing the CW & US to land and open fronts...with their multitude of Amphs, TRNs and Paras...
3) Prevent Ge from reaching a good defensible line behind the Dnepr / (see above)

Anyway, its an interesting game, but I think Ge will be in a world of trouble unless JP can somehow "force" the allies to take more than just screenings action vs. her ...otherwise Ge will feel the pressure of simultanious fighting the full weight of CW, USSR, US (incl. 80% of navy) and FF ...Due to NOT fighting for France we managed to "save" most of the LS, one HQ, the entire airforce and an Inf-d and a Mtn-d ...


EDIT:
Ps: I hope Im right in the fact that my opponents dont read this forum ! ? [X(]

Well it is always fun to consider a given WiF game. It's easy to play Devil's Advocate with a game you are not playing. I'm still wondering, what did the Germans do in 1941? Flounder in Spain? Duke it out in the Algerian mountains? Launch a vigorous Battle of the Atlantic? Was the Russian army up on the border shutting down any possible Barbarossa? (Probably not possible after excursions to the Middle East and thoughts of intervention in the Far East). Now you mention Russia being in Iraq...the CW evacuated Egypt and the Axis couldn't get four corps into Jordan/Syria fast enough to align Iraq, I'm guessing. Why doesn't the Axis just simply xxx censored by NKVD agents xxx Perhaps US Entry was so bad because of two Russian DoWs losing two good entry chits? If US entry was bad you might have wanted to play wounded duck in the Indian Ocean, tempting the Japanese to attack to help accelerate US Entry but I see that happened anyway.

I'm not so sure just giving Egypt to the Axis is always so great ... where else can you put British MECH and HQ-A to such good use? Early in the game you can't afford losses but by 1941 you have to get in the way of Axis, unless your convoy lines are shaky. I always tell my allies on either side, they are just cardboard pieces, if you don't risk losing some you can't win the game. Assuming the 2d10 and Blitz Bonus two MECH in Suez, or one MECH and one HQ-A (two Axis armor units sent to Egypt?) are still a tough defense, even moreso with Defensive Shore Bombardment. If the Germans were on the way to Egypt, bailing out before they are adjacent to Suez just frees up their action limits to do other things. With black print units the risk of Japan cutting their supply is there but I would trade some replaceable British tanks for accelerated US entry any time.

Probably this is a discussion for the Russian AI thread but I am intrigued by the idea of forts in the Ukraine. xxx possible intell coup for CBoehm's opponents snipped out here xxx I think I know what I would do as the Germans though.

I like to build a fair amount of Russian FTRs but not too many pilots, to try and field the best planes possible, not easy with the big Russian FTR pool. With only three air missions per land impulse it is difficult for the Russians to manage their air force until they can use O-Chits for Super-Combineds, or Air Impulses using all HQs to re-org planes and then an O-chit to re-org the HQs. The Sturmoviks aren't that useful until on the strategic offensive later in the game. I do like to make progress on drawing the two 1942 LND-3's with rockets (doubled vs. tanks) though.

ORIGINAL: trees

Well it is always fun to consider a given WiF game. It's easy to play Devil's Advocate with a game you are not playing. I'm still wondering, what did the Germans do in 1941?

Well ...Ge didnt really do that much ...just as he was building up vs. Suez in J/F we evacuated ...and he didnt get complete control of the channel before M/A ... From S/O CW had been very busy building units in UK / Portugal ...CW hadnt really taken any real casualties and had managed to get 15bp from France ...and only lost the London MIL and a Belgian INF in France in the defence of the river infront of Bordeux. - I think it was in M/A that Ge tried an invasion of Portugal, an endeaver which really required a double-move to work ...- turn end on 4, which didnt succed and the bridgehead was bottled in ...HQA and eng-mot-d (mot loss counter) was brought up from South Africa ...trying without luck to strike and put the Ge's out of supply ...Ge finally mounted a evakuation in J/A ... In M/J Ge had setup to collapse Vichy (neutral) and had a significant force ready to race into Algeria while simultaniously he tried sailing an invasion fleet to invade Marocca ...unfortunately the brits were awake and his TRN w. MAR was aboarded ...and the whole "lets collapse Vichy" operation was cancelled ... otherwise GE didnt really do that much in 41 except engage in intensive sub/naval warfare which didnt really lead to much as the CW had airpatrols in most seaareas as well as min. 2 x 3-factor LS in 4-boxes ...and plenty of HQ to reorg aborded cps ...(sure we accepted reducing convoy chain so as to keep a decent cp reserve ...). Massive intensive fighterbattles in Bay of Biscay.

S/O 41 Ge has captured Malta and Greece ...

USSR ....the plan had been a "surprise" attack vs. JP to reliev CH ...to do this USSR had organized buils to max reinforcement-garrisonfactors in M/J ...ARM, MECH, MTN, INF, AC ...since we decided that CH was too far in the ropes and there was no hope of saving them ...and in the ligth of a CH collapse USSR did not really want to go to war with JP ....USSR instead setup to press Ge on garrison which was successful in the sence that he was forced to activate hungary costing him 1 resource and a 42-MOT (AFAIR)

...and about defensiveness of Egypt, No IMO Egypt trying to defend vs. a non-barb Ge in 41 with JP breathing down your neck (supply from India) and a big luftwaffe which will just strike all your units ...reorg on air ...invasions behind your front ...attacks with HQ support ....

I just think the Axis leaned into your punch a little too much. Having Russia take the Middle East can damage US Entry, but the Japanese obliged by going to war somewhat early. Abandoning Suez without getting Japan to attack early could hand the Middle East to the Axis but the Russians were already there and the Japanese attacked early anyway. The beauty of WiF, pretty much different every time. There still should be a fairly dangerous '42 Barbarossa coming up, with help from the Yugoslavs, and the Allies won't be as able to distract the Axis as easily in the Med with only Gibraltar (the status of French North Africa looms large), twin-engined Me-110s and a NAV horde can get scary, and it sounds like you'll need your CV's in the Pacific...I hope to hear how it all turns out. Without the Germans crossing into Spain I wouldn't give away so much of the British Empire quite so easily, if they don't go by 1941 the UK is safe and I think you should start fighting. Another great thing about WiF is that superior forces can't always automatically win battles, they have to roll the dice; if you don't make them roll those dice they do automatically win. Playing the Axis I would love to see the CW running away in 1941, but you have a good point about the Japanese threat after a collapsed China.

What's odd about this discussion is I keep seeing games where the Axis ignore Africa.

Anyway here are some big questions for mid-game CW strategy; let's say the CW help up it's honor in France, struggled in the Med but maintained a few bases, fought the Battle of the Atlantic and eventually guaranteed full British production, they can now build offensive units and take the fight to the enemy ... should the CW try Churchill's 'soft underbelly' attack? Should the Allies convert the Med to a CW only theater while the US goes into Western Europe on it's own? Or should the CW attack Norway in 1943? Or give 'Bomber Harris' a blank check to build LND-4's and FTR-3's and HQ-s to re-org and pick air impulses, etc.?

ORIGINAL: trees

I just think the Axis leaned into your punch a little too much. Having Russia take the Middle East can damage US Entry, but the Japanese obliged by going to war somewhat early. Abandoning Suez without getting Japan to attack early could hand the Middle East to the Axis but the Russians were already there and the Japanese attacked early anyway. The beauty of WiF, pretty much different every time. There still should be a fairly dangerous '42 Barbarossa coming up, with help from the Yugoslavs, and the Allies won't be as able to distract the Axis as easily in the Med with only Gibraltar (the status of French North Africa looms large), twin-engined Me-110s and a NAV horde can get scary, and it sounds like you'll need your CV's in the Pacific...I hope to hear how it all turns out. Without the Germans crossing into Spain I wouldn't give away so much of the British Empire quite so easily, if they don't go by 1941 the UK is safe and I think you should start fighting. Another great thing about WiF is that superior forces can't always automatically win battles, they have to roll the dice; if you don't make them roll those dice they do automatically win. Playing the Axis I would love to see the CW running away in 1941, but you have a good point about the Japanese threat after a collapsed China.

USE wise ...yes it WAS low but after collapse of CH in J/F 41 ...the situation got rectified so that M/A US did Relocate Fleet, in M/J 1. gearup, in J/A 2. gearup (would have regardless of JP attack, so his timing was actually perfect. (if not his rediness, due to him suddenly being non-active from end of J/F).

well about access to med this will be no problem trust me!!! - Vichy has purposefully been left neutral so Ge could not reinforce it ...unless Ge collapse Vichy the allies will walk straight in ....and trust me I do mean we will keep atleast half of the US CVs in Europe ...as well as most if not all BBs and maybe half LS ...and 2-3 amph & 6 TRN or so ...and 80-90% of airforce. All MAR, Para, HQs etc. ....I would be very surprised if the wallies cannot mount 1-2 invasions per turn.

In the game our group has just started, the European Axis seems bent on Gibralter (first turn builds were AMPH and marines). By opting for a 'slow Poland' strategy, they are making fast inroads, ready to conquer Belgium in '39.

A feature of our counter-strategy is to occupy Bayonne with a CW unit or units, so that it doesn't fall into Axis hands when Paris falls. This hex is in the mountains (if defensive shore bombardment is used, it's a hard nut to crack) and it is adjacent to Spain, slowing Axis progress with its ZOC. If the Axis takes time to attack Bayonne, time is gained for Gibralter to be bolstered, and if Bayonne is not captured, the threat is for a beachhead to open up when the Americans come into the war.

Has anyone tried a Bayonne strategy in response to a threatened drive on Spain and Gibralter? Perhaps such a strategy could be of use for the CW AIO.

ORIGINAL: coregames

In the game our group has just started, the European Axis seems bent on Gibralter (first turn builds were AMPH and marines). By opting for a 'slow Poland' strategy, they are making fast inroads, ready to conquer Belgium in '39.

A feature of our counter-strategy is to occupy Bayonne with a CW unit or units, so that it doesn't fall into Axis hands when Paris falls. This hex is in the mountains (if defensive shore bombardment is used, it's a hard nut to crack) and it is adjacent to Spain, slowing Axis progress with its ZOC. If the Axis takes time to attack Bayonne, time is gained for Gibralter to be bolstered, and if Bayonne is not captured, the threat is for a beachhead to open up when the Americans come into the war.

Has anyone tried a Bayonne strategy in response to a threatened drive on Spain and Gibralter? Perhaps such a strategy could be of use for the CW AIO.

I did, and it is efficient. I'd say that this is a must done.

Generaly, everything that makes Germany loose time (impulses) in its way toward Gibraltar, is good for the Allies. However, this is a road full of heavy losses for the CW. Air units, Land Units and Naval Units, nothing is spared.
Parenthesis : I for one would like to see how it comes out, if the CW reduces its losses, even if this speeds the German conquests, so that when the German turns its offensive elsewhere (Russia), the Wallies are stronger to hit them in the back.

In this "defend strong" strategy, one good idea is also to try to defend the Garonne River with French units (and CW units on the shore as usual), to force Germany to Vichify and Collapse. Germans managing to attack Spain without Vichyfying & Collapsing are in a too good position to let them do that.

Then, Bayonne should be defended strongly.

And then they should hang on to Bilbao strongly too, because the German hates to leave this kind of CW pocket on his back.

Like I said in the parenthesis above, losses will be high because the German eventually will overcome each of these defensive positions, and all will be lost, so it may be interesting to manage to find the "right moment" to withdraw (re-imbark troops and leave the field). Finding this "right moment" is the hardest.

Also, I tried to hang around Malaga / Cadiz, and it worked quite right, but here it is even more difficult to withdraw.

Then, after Gibraltar falls (it always falls to a determined German), the CW should hang onto Morocco & Tangier, whose defense must already be strong even before Gibraltar falls, otherwise it might fall in the impulse just after Gibraltar fell.

Thanks Patrice, I will pass these tips on to our CW player. I'm sure Steve will apply them too in the AIO.

ORIGINAL: Froonp

....Then, after Gibraltar falls (it always falls to a determined German), the CW should hang onto Morocco & Tangier, whose defense must already be strong even before Gibraltar falls, otherwise it might fall in the impulse just after Gibraltar fell.

I agree ...basically half the spanish army should setup in south of the GIB ...CW + remaining spanish units should then just concentrate on defending a few coastal mountain "pockets"....inland where GE can cut out of supply or simply gangup on units in clear terrain I would focus simply on a few key units setting up a ZOC defence while retreating towards GIB or one of the "pockets"...

On a sidenote...I usually always buils a 1hex fort in GIB...on turn 1. ...sure it might not get into play, sure GIB might fall anyway ...but 2bp for something that might make GIB survive against 1 or 2 extra landattacks is well worth it! (and if it means that just 1 less loss is incurred then its ok too)

On a sidenote...I usually always buils a 1hex fort in GIB...on turn 1. ...sure it might not get into play, sure GIB might fall anyway ...but 2bp for something that might make GIB survive against 1 or 2 extra landattacks is well worth it! (and if it means that just 1 less loss is incurred then its ok too)

I agree too for the Gib Fort.

1-2 hexsides of forts can also be considered, timed for S/O 41 at the latest for Singapore.

1 AMPH launched in S/O 39, and a second in N/D 39, and sent to second cycle as soon as possible is also to be considered, to be able to "have teeth" as soon as possible too.

These 3 things are mandatory in my view of the CW production (The second cycle can be postponed if it is clear that Gib will be the target, as it will be of less use then -- i.e. it will not bring "teeth" to the CW, only extra supply possibilities).

ORIGINAL: Froonp

On a sidenote...I usually always buils a 1hex fort in GIB...on turn 1. ...sure it might not get into play, sure GIB might fall anyway ...but 2bp for something that might make GIB survive against 1 or 2 extra landattacks is well worth it! (and if it means that just 1 less loss is incurred then its ok too)

I agree too for the Gib Fort.

1-2 hexsides of forts can also be considered, timed for S/O 41 at the latest for Singapore.

1 AMPH launched in S/O 39, and a second in N/D 39, and sent to second cycle as soon as possible is also to be considered, to be able to "have teeth" as soon as possible too.

These 3 things are mandatory in my view of the CW production (The second cycle can be postponed if it is clear that Gib will be the target, as it will be of less use then -- i.e. it will not bring "teeth" to the CW, only extra supply possibilities).

I agree ...although I usually build a TRN on turn 1, and then lauch an AMPH in each of turn 2 and 3 ...to be followed up
later by a Para ...so that by M/J 41 CW has 2 amph + 1 para ...so as you say "have some teeth" to bite GE in the behind ...if he goes for USSR [:D]

The AI for the CW is a bear! Good CW play is essential for Allied victory, and they have the hardest job!

Defending the convoy lanes should be the number 1 priority imo. Resources allow the war economy to go at full strength. I like to prepare the CW convoy routs around the horn if possible, until Italy is defanged.

Kill her fleet and you kill her ability to stop your movements or reinforce Africa. Her transports and fast cruisers are my targets for port strikes as the CW

Strategic Bombers and NAV can protect convoy lanes or attack Italian resources or fleet units and are worth every penny.

It has been my experience, that if England fails to protect her convoys she usually gets invaded by the Germans or the Germans/Italians take out Spain and Gibralter at the least.

Good luck on the AI for the CW![X(]

I must admit I will be VERY surprised if an ai can be created that can dish out any kind of challange to an experienced player ....

The WiF Discussion List has had interesting comments posted recently.
I asked the contributors their permission to crosspost it here, for the game's interest.
Here they are :

**************************************************************************************
De: "claus Böhm" <claus_boehm@hotmail.com>
À: <wifdiscussion@yahoogroups.com>
Objet: RE: [wifdiscussion] CW tips and strategy from « hardened veterans »
Date: mardi 6 mars 2007 23:07

a few tips...

Make sure to place all three US entry chits vs. Ge ..so even if USE rolls go
against you ...you can have a threat of attacking Italy and taking out a
transport or two ...

Take out Portugal on turn 1 ...(or ASAP) since this will give you a nice
extra resource AND the Azores as a nice airbase from which a 11+ AC can
react into the 0-box for convoy protection ...and Portugal is a good staging
point for a defenceforce for Spain and/or Gibralter depending on if GE
prefer to attack through Spain or go for an invasion of Gib...

Dont loose Algier! ...IMO this is more important than sacrificing "too many"
CW units in France ...since if Ge gets control of Algier pre-install of
Vichy ...he can setup a big fastmoving force there before an eventual
collapse of Vichy ...and there is no way you can save Marocco ...once Ge has
airbases in Marocco GIB will eventually fall out of supply and be vulnerably
to fall by invasion...

When defending convoys ...ALWAYS try to have a hunter-force in the 4 box
...so you can have the upside of finding his subs on goodroll / punish him
for a bad roll ...my usual convoy defence consists of a couple of LS w.
total of 3-6-or-10 surfacefactors in the 4 box ...0-box should have AC and
total of 8 or 11 ASW and surface of not less than 10 or so ....end of turn
return all home except the hunterforce which drops to the 3 box ....then
during navel these units move to 0-box gets reinforced with a BB and a crap
LS or two (or even a crap CV without plane which has 1-2 surfacefactors and
1 ASW) ...and new hunterforce takes its place in the 4-box .... - > ALWAYS
keep a "killer" stack of escorts in reserve as long as Ge/It hasnt committed
its subs ...so that if they do commit the-lot in one sea area and dont find
...you can enforce the seaarea enough to make them think twice about trying
to commit again. - another note: its better longterm to kill or damage subs
than save a few cps ...so if forced to choose I will "always" repair LSs
rather than build cps ...

Also...remember its important to always have reserve cp so you can reform
your line even after it gets shot at ...for this its handy to keep Alexander
near a port so if you line gets blown during 1-impulse you can just aboard
....reorg your cp ...and comeback in strength later in the turn. - if need
be sacrifice a few bps production in order to keep handy reserve of cps
....sometimes if you have enough cp its good to put out "too many" cps in
the vulnerable seaareas between UK and US ...eg. 20 instead of 17 or
whatever you would normally have ...since this will both net you a bit of
extra ASW and also ensure that if you get shot at the end of the turn not
every aboarded cp is a lost productionpoint.

Main objective in convoy handling is to ensure that you line doesnt get cut
...its better to accept upfront that you will not be able to get those "far
away" resources home ...sacrificing a few bps ...than it is to run out of cp
reserve ...and end up getting your line cut ...

that was just my 2cents quick and dirty ....rambling of the top of my head
...hope you could use some of it?

Claus


**************************************************************************************
De: "paulderynck" <pderynck@shaw.ca>
À: <wifdiscussion@yahoogroups.com>
Objet: [wifdiscussion] Re: CW tips and strategy from « hardened veterans »
Date: mardi 6 mars 2007 23:44

Besides using HQs to re-org aborted convoys, build all the ATRs you
can. Even the range 5 dope can still re-org 2 convoys in a Naval.

If playing with Oil, build the synthetic Oil and try to set up your
convoy pipeline to enable extra Oil to be saved every turn in the U.K.
Save also the synthetic Oil if you don't need it for production. A
stack of saved Oil can allow you to produce at full or close to full
amounts even if your pipeline takes a hit and that turn ends before
you can fix it.

If Germany goes to war with the USSR, rebase the Sunderland Nav to
Scotland, from where it can fly to the 4-box of the Baltic to raid the
German convoys from Sweden/Finland. In our current game my CW opponent
did this at the same time as the tottering Russians used their
starting O-chit to do a Super and put the Leningrad fleet and subs
into the Baltic. The CW also based Strat bombers with A2S factors in
places where they could get to the Baltic zero box at extended range
and re-initiate Searches, and also so the Russians could just take
Land impulses from then on. Very annoying for the Germans!


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De: "Gudmundur Steinar Jonsson" <gudmundursteinar@gmail.com>
À: <wifdiscussion@yahoogroups.com>
Objet: Re: [wifdiscussion] CW tips and strategy from « hardened veterans »
Date: mercredi 7 mars 2007 00:02

The Indian Army

Use it. It arrives where you need it, it is expendable and it is good
enough to face up to italians in the desert and japanese in mountains.

In 1939 build the army and deploy it to egypt. When there it should
fight an italian invasion if it happens or support an attack on tripoli
should the germans decline to support their italian allies.
In late 1940 and early 1941 deploy it to malaya and anywhere else you
are allowed to in the pacific. A crappy 3-3 indian in in Rabaul will
turn the attack from a simple div invasion to a major amphibious
operation. Two indian Mil stacked in Kuala Lumpur or on the Res hex in
Malaya are also very very difficult to kill as they are supplied in the
Bay of Bengal.

A further advantage with the Indians is that should they be killed in
battle, and the japs choose to invade india, they will be re-built just
in time to meet the invasion.

Also, I endorse the convoy management posts on this topic as well. But
I'd like to add, during barbarossa the CW can perform enormous feats for
the allies if they can tempt the germans into a naval or a combined
impulse during barbarossa. Furthermore, keep face up SCS in the Bay of
Biscaye and the North Sea to try to intercept any aborted SUBs during
the Battle of the Atlantic. Furthermore each of the Axis powers has
different vital resources

Germany - Oil and Land impulses
Italy - Res and CP
Japan - BP and NAV

Focus on denying each power these resources.

----------------------------------------------------------
Froonp Comment>
I'd just add that that aborted subs cannot be intercepted by SCS, only sub
hunters (from the CoiF kit) can do that, and that basing CW units in Rabaul
is not possible until the US Entry Option for that has been chosen.


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De: "Kevin Bernatz" <redjac2003@yahoo.com>
À: <wifdiscussion@yahoogroups.com>
Objet: Re: [wifdiscussion] CW tips and strategy from « hardened veterans »
Date: mercredi 7 mars 2007 03:20

Suggestion number 1: make sure you have a French person playing France and that
your IT player forgets to add his 1943 units to his force pool .

Other suggestions: always build a few CP's/turn, even if you don't believe you will need them. The lag time is such that if you can't keep a sizable reserve, then you will be in position to be seriously hurt.
Don't be afraid to produce at < full production inorder to maintain a sizeable CP reserve (at least until new CP's come on-line). A few turns of known reduced production is better than a lot of turns at greatly reduced production because you were running your CP line without reservers.
If he builds heavy CPs, consider adopting a reactive defense (i.e. token air to be in the 0 and 3 box when he searches, but no ships...if he finds, you take your damage and abort from the zone - unless he kills it all, obviously - and then next turn you come back with a mega fleet, daring him to initiate again). Saves you from running the issue of his huge wolfpacks attritting your surface ships for little to no gain against the subs.
LND4s are extremely useful, both as a "threat in being" and for hitting him where he ain't. Until you build up a large asset base, I generally don't believe in risking them (the high a2a US LND4's are another deal though...).
Obviously, be ready to lend lease 5 bp's/turn to USSR, even if it doesnt look like they'll need them. The hammer needs an anvil to be successful.
Your FTRs are your greatest contribution, so don't be afraid to use them, especially if you can get the Axis to fight you on your terms (i.e. where your pilots have > chance of survival). Defend Gibralter relentlessly, but know when to fold'em. Your goal is to delay the Axis and disrupt their time table, not conquer any individual country. You need the big dogs to do that...so be content with shadow boxing the Axis to keep them on their toes, but without losing any big ticket items.
Don't forget the Pacific. You'll need 6 land units in India as soon as you can to negate partisans, as well as 1-2 in Malaya. By the time early '41 roles around, you should look to have a good 4-5 units in Australia, 2-3 in New Zealand, 6-8 in India, 1-2 in Burma and another 2-3 in Singapore/Malaya. If you can spare it, another 1 in Ceylon and Madagascar is nice. You should also have at least 2-3 in South Africa. Plan your building accordingly, since that's alot of units you'll need defending your territory inorder to make Japan work at expanding their empire. The last thing you want to do is give Japan a free ride.
Don't be afraid of losing Gibralter if you can hold Morocco and bleed the Axis dry in the process. With Morocco in Allied hands, it's only a matter of time before Gib. falls again.
Attritting the IT fleet is nice, but it's hard for you to afford a 2:1 or higher attrition rate...so do it intelligently and not rashly. Having a few LBA to soak up anti-air losses can be the difference between an even battle and a great victory for the british IMO.
Finally, work closely with the US. Pay attention to USE and play to get big brother in the game ASAP with the understanding that you'll get loads of BP's, resources and "toys" in return for your generousity with the USE.

-K

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