Matrix Games Forums

ORIGINAL: HansBolter

I have yet to airdrop an entire division in this game.
How many squadrons are assigned the task?
How long will it take?
How much will reach the destination before an LRCAP intercept starts to attrite the effort?
Where are the best and worst possibilities of heavy LRCAP intercept?
What other factors matter?

At this stage in the game, it's not actually that hard. You can airdrop everything that can be airdropped with ~250 transport planes or thereabouts, and those numbers are easy to get with just a little effort. The main constricting factors are:

1) Airfield size/stacking
2) Having the division at said airfield in the first place

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ORIGINAL: HansBolter

I have yet to airdrop an entire division in this game.
How many squadrons are assigned the task?
How long will it take?
How much will reach the destination before an LRCAP intercept starts to attrite the effort?
Where are the best and worst possibilities of heavy LRCAP intercept?
What other factors matter?

Every transport you can put your hands on-three to four hundred at least. You really want the bulk of the divsion to go in on the first wave to take advantage of the shock effect.

The aim is to gain surprise so that LRCAP is not a factor. However, an landing like that should be preceded by sweeps and massive bombing attacks, as well as putting your own LRCAP over the target. This should wear out the LRCAP if it happens to be present. The bigger threat is massive AA concentrations. Heavy bombing to ensure disruption. If there is air combat between fighters as a result of a supply or para drop, I have seen massive losses on both side but there is never a combat animation.

If 100% prepped and supported by a massive bombing effort, a high experienced division can defeat a full Japanese brigade on any clear terrain city hex.

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

Moppo would not be useful to you from a strategic bombing perspective, as it would be constantly harassed. However, you could probably farm that for VPs as well. Just not as many as an aerial campaign with 2Es/4Es and fighters.

How so? With the potential for level 9 port and level 9 airfield and 4 hexes from 6 major bases (not including that heavy urban city)... I don't see how it could be harassed effectively. Mosquito bites and pin-pricks, sure... but I think the positives outweigh that. Canoe can put up too much CAP and too many mines. It would make a great springboard to get to other Korea bases....and also it can start knocking down the 8k Manchuko Garrison requirement and possibly activate the USSR "much sooner", possibly bringing the war to an end much much faster than just strat bombing would do.

Dan, I would like to express once again my appreciation for the time and effort that you spend on this AAR. I am in January 1944 on my very first PBEM. I have learned so much from this AAR and the discussions that take place within its pages. Thank you sir, for the fine efforts. And thanks to the Peanut Gallery for their contributions as well.

Ace (in reply to Loka): Under the peculiar circumstances of this game, I would've taken Moppo had it been vacant. Loka is right that Moppo is vulnerable to strong enemy attacks by sea and air due to proximity to the Home Islands. But the threat would be considerably diminished with Death Star on patrol.

Dave: Thanks to all of you for reading and offering helpful or encouraging comments. I appreciate the Forum and all forumites, even on the occasions I come across snippy. Best game ever. Best gaming community ever.

Either way you go, you can nuke Japan from Formosa

I think going to Korea would continue the excitement of the match. It would create a fun schwerpunkt for the end game in which you could crush Japan once and for all. It would be more "interesting" then mopping up the back areas of the DEI/Nam/Malaysia (you know that's just going to be a boring "bomb bomb bomb invade deliberate attack, next base please" without much "fear factor" in it.)

ORIGINAL: AcePylut

Either way you go, you can nuke Japan from Formosa

I think going to Korea would continue the excitement of the match. It would create a fun schwerpunkt for the end game in which you could crush Japan once and for all. It would be more "interesting" then mopping up the back areas of the DEI/Nam/Malaysia (you know that's just going to be a boring "bomb bomb bomb invade deliberate attack, next base please" without much "fear factor" in it.)

I agree with you, but it just doesn't seem right for the audience to tell the director how to make the movie!
CR is extremely solid in his planning and tight execution of ops, but a "knight's gambit" type of move is not in his comfort zone unless he knows how good his odds are.
I am very happy to watch what solid play looks like and watch the spectacular gambles in other AARs.

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy
watch the spectacular gambles in other AARs.

Hmm., Horrywood? Cough. Cough.

I understand the feeling very much - invade Korea and things remain hot and exciting; back off and things may be comparatively dull.

Into the medium term, there is no doubt now that I'm going to focus on China and Hainan Island. Indochina, Malaya and Java will follow. Somewhere down the road, Korea or Hokkaido may figure in.

The war in China should be interesting; but to me the most interesting aspect of the game to Forumites is when, where and why John will commit KB.

I used to read Sports Illustrated regularly. It was an incredibly well written magazine back in the '90s. I found that my taste in articles was counterintuitive. Rather than enjoying reading about the Yankees and the Cowboys and the Lakers, I most enjoyed reading about teams/franchises for whom the wheels had come off.

Why? I dunno. But I'm going to try to knock the wheels off the Empire, so that it comes to a whimpering sad end.

10/27/44

Ningpo Front: I'm hoping that the opening week of the Ningpo campaign left John misinformed. The Allies took Ningpo using two dvisions and an Aussie brigade. Since then, three more divisions and lots of artillery have come ashore. I don't think John knows what I have yet.

John has two divisions at Shaohing. If I can bust through there, I think John's position around the Shanghai sector will be seriously threatened. First attack in probably two days. But BB West Virginia/BB Valiant TF will bombard tonight.

10/27/44

Amoy Front: One of us has badly miscalculated here. I think it's John. The planned Allied retreat to the coast during Operation Peep Show convinced John my guys were on the run. He's afraid on my bombers, so he's been cautious, but finally talked himself into advancing and attacking. The results have not been good for him. The attacks weakened his army and my 2EB and 4EB are working over his stacks. I think his army is going to weaken to the point that my guys will blow through. Then his line will collapse, much as the one in Burma did a early in the year.

If the Allies do bust through in the Amoy Front - I think it'll be about 10 days or so - then the Japanese position in China should become tenuous. The impact should spread to the Changsha and Shanghai fronts.

Or so I think.

10/27/44

Inverse Sir Robin: KB East is making its way towards the DEI again. The Heart of the War is the East China Sea but my stubborn opponent doesn't see it my way.

John's radical points conserving strategy hasn't worked, I think. I think there's merit to conserving points but not if, by doing so, it materially expedites the Allies getting into position for strategic bombing.

We'll know a lot more by the end of the year. But John is playing a weird Sir Robin strategy. I presume that Chickenboy is giving him fits.

ORIGINAL: AcePylut

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

Moppo would not be useful to you from a strategic bombing perspective, as it would be constantly harassed. However, you could probably farm that for VPs as well. Just not as many as an aerial campaign with 2Es/4Es and fighters.

How so? With the potential for level 9 port and level 9 airfield and 4 hexes from 6 major bases (not including that heavy urban city)... I don't see how it could be harassed effectively. Mosquito bites and pin-pricks, sure... but I think the positives outweigh that. Canoe can put up too much CAP and too many mines. It would make a great springboard to get to other Korea bases....and also it can start knocking down the 8k Manchuko Garrison requirement and possibly activate the USSR "much sooner", possibly bringing the war to an end much much faster than just strat bombing would do.

Even E's and SC's can bombard the place. Just because AF9 has no stacking limits doesn't mean stacking level doesn't apply to damage taken from bombardments.

Moppo just isn't worth it unless the IJN is completely neutered. It's not yet.

Well I was thinking that the base would have hundreds of fighters on CAP, hundreds of mines, multiple SCTF’s “in the hex” to interdict and disrupt incoming bombardments, subs, and too many troops for any possible counterattack. As so, I’m trying to pretend to be Japan in late ’44, and trying to figure out what they could really do beyond a few bites here and there. All that really exists that imho might be a threat is the KB and a 5000 plane Kami attack. I would almost welcome an attack from these two angles, because, well, the Kami’s are one-shot weapons and if he does that, there goes that threat for a while. The only real threat is the KB, and per Dans search, it doesn’t appear to be anywhere close to being a threat.

5000 Kamikazes? I thought there were only a dozen or so kamikaze squadrons so the number can never exceed a few hundred?

10/28/44

Fancy Pants: B-24Js stubbornly refuse to fly from Manila, giving John's little army at Chachow another reprieve - and hopefully a brief one. IJ air attack from Shanghai against shipping at Ningpo gets chewed up.

Seems strange that Osaka's HI and LI have suffered so badly from the fires but only one aircraft (Tony) plant has taken damage.
In Tokyo and Nagasaki the damage is spread around a bit more.

I'm learning a lot from this AAR. I'm pleasantly surprised by the victory points generated by manpower bombing. I still say 'Shanghai' but just getting close enough to strat bomb is more important now (to me).

I like Wenchow because it generates supply - at least you get some return from the garrison.

Lowpe said the strat bombing learning curve was tough. He was right.

Lokasenna urged, "Bomb at 2k! The losses are worth it." He was right.

Targeting Manpower definitely seems the way to go. I'm taking pretty heavy losses now at 2k (sometimes 3k or 4k) - in fact, the losses aren't sustainable. At this rate, I'll run out of B-29s in about a month. But the hits scored at 2k are dramatically higher than at 8k or 10k or more. Dramatically. Enough so that the attrition/point scored is probably considerably lower.

And there's hope. I'm hoping that getting the B-24Js flying from Ningpo will take a big part of the load.

And the newer, fast, longer-range B-29s start coming online in three days. I probably won't get them in the war for at least two or three weeks but they'll make a big impact before the year is out, I think. (It takes a long time for B-29s that arrive at East Coast to make West Coast and become airworthy and make the hops to Midway to Formosa).

I probably need to score another 30k to 40k strategic points to get within striking range of auto victory by year's end. That may be possible but it's going to be hard. If auto vic is the objective, I probably need to forego the DEI and pour all resources - supply, men, ships, aircraft - into Formosa and the China campaign. That's the most efficient, will open up ground war possibilities, and keeps my schwerpunkt intact as my air force turns its full attention on Japan.