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RE: War in the East Q&A
Posted: Tue Dec 06, 2011 6:25 am
by Apollo11
Hi all,
Is this game / simulation flawed?
IMHO not!
Why do people think it is flawed?
Because many still think that Germany could have won against Soviet Union and / or that Japan could have won over USA in historic WWII!
This is, IMHO, fundamental mistake many player make and this is where all "issues" came from... [;)]
The very second Germany attacked Soviet Union in WWII the Germany lost the war - similarly the very second Japan attacked Pearl Harbor the Japan lost the war!
No serious modern historian would tell otherwise either!!!
So why do we still play Japan in UV / WitP / WitP-AE and / or Germany in WitE?
Because we know that it is lost cause but we want to be better than history!
The winning is not in absolute victory - that was historically impossible - the winning is beating the history (i.e. being better than the history)!
Thus, the winning for Japan in UV / WitP / WitP-AE is not conquering the Pacific - the winning is keeping the USA further away from home islands in 1945 and not allowing devastating B-29 raids on Japanese cities (including the A-Bomb attack)!
Similarly, the winning for Germany in not conquering the Soviet Union - the winning is keeping the Soviets as far east as possible from Berlin!
Leo "Apollo11"
RE: War in the East Q&A
Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 9:29 pm
by sajer
I think people that read my post get the wrong idea. They always go back to REAL history and say this could not have happened or this could not have happened. What I am saying is that an icon that could give you a brief (alternative or not) war update would be awesome.
These ( alternate war reports) would influence the game. By a multitude of ways. Having German or Soviet industry, oil or synthetic fuel rise or fall. Also having reinforcements - not written in stone - so you can see it for the ENTIRE war by scrolling down on the reinforcement screen (air and land). But having (maybe) alternative circumstances delay of expedite these divisional movements to the Eastern Front.
Of course the out of theatre reports could follow history (EXACTLY). But it's the NOT KNOWING that creates the anticipation.
Also you could have a variable date for development of certain units (i.e. Tiger Tanks, BF 109 G, etc..)
You see what I'm trying to say is that these unforseen variables would apply to BOTH sides (Soviet or German).
This would add an uncertainty to the game and keep players in a constant questoning of how the war is going (out of theatre). Of course having an impact on the War in the East. I think it would be awesome.
Of course this is just my opinion.
RE: War in the East Q&A
Posted: Sun Dec 11, 2011 8:40 pm
by Seminole
I thought I had seen an explanation of this before, but I'm having trouble finding it.
Can someone explain to me the discrepancy I see between the losses listed in the event log file and the losses info screen?
I'm trying to track how the Red Army is performing week to week against the Wehrmacht, but I'm not sure how those numbers jive.
Which should be considered the more reliable indicator?
RE: War in the East Q&A
Posted: Sun Dec 11, 2011 9:09 pm
by gingerbread
Go with the losses screen.
If you want a more accurate tracking, adjust as follows:
Do this at the start of your turn:
men, KIA =
men, cap divide by .92 since 8% of total convert to Hiwis
men, dis divide by .995 since 0.5% were returned during, but were lost at start of, logistics phase
Add these 3 to get a running total of lost men and compare with last turns ditto. That will be your losses during last week with start of logistics phase as flank or tick if you are an analogue time measurer
Guns =
AFV add the numbers that were repaired (see event log) to losses to get comparison value as per men
RE: War in the East Q&A
Posted: Sun Dec 11, 2011 9:50 pm
by Seminole
So what are the numbers I'm seeing regarding losses in the event log file?
It would be _really_ nice if the losses from the losses info screen (and production screen for that matter) was written to file same as the event log.
RE: War in the East Q&A
Posted: Sun Dec 11, 2011 9:59 pm
by gingerbread
Just ignore info about losses in event log.
RE: War in the East Q&A
Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 12:03 am
by Seminole
Can anyone tell me what the losses in the event log are derived from?
RE: War in the East Q&A
Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 6:35 am
by Apollo11
Hi all,
ORIGINAL: sajer
I think people that read my post get the wrong idea. They always go back to REAL history and say this could not have happened or this could not have happened. What I am saying is that an icon that could give you a brief (alternative or not) war update would be awesome.
These ( alternate war reports) would influence the game. By a multitude of ways. Having German or Soviet industry, oil or synthetic fuel rise or fall. Also having reinforcements - not written in stone - so you can see it for the ENTIRE war by scrolling down on the reinforcement screen (air and land). But having (maybe) alternative circumstances delay of expedite these divisional movements to the Eastern Front.
Of course the out of theatre reports could follow history (EXACTLY). But it's the NOT KNOWING that creates the anticipation.
Also you could have a variable date for development of certain units (i.e. Tiger Tanks, BF 109 G, etc..)
You see what I'm trying to say is that these unforseen variables would apply to BOTH sides (Soviet or German).
This would add an uncertainty to the game and keep players in a constant questoning of how the war is going (out of theatre). Of course having an impact on the War in the East. I think it would be awesome.
Of course this is just my opinion.
I know what you are saying... I didn't misunderstand you...
But Gary (via Joel) told us long long long time ago (remember that, most recently, he made UV / WitP and influenced WitP-AE) that his games are based on history as much as possible... thus what you wish for might not happen...
Leo "Apollo11"
RE: War in the East Q&A
Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 5:20 pm
by ETF
1) Ok first week of December 41 as the soviets. My German opponent seems to be withdrawing about 2 hexes a turn. Any ideas on how to hurt him as much as possible. Seems like I am just following him
2) Have lots of planes on the lines but little action is happening. What doctrine setting should I be changing to get some air time for my planes. Even when manualing trying to bomb something few planes fly.
Thanks so much!
What to do with all the BT7M's
Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 5:24 pm
by ETF
What to do with all the BT7M's.....
I have almost 1200 of them. Why can't we sub these to fill the gaps for medium tanks? I understand from my WITP/AE days that we should not have access to production, but why not able to shift tanks around to fill gaps in the historical production. Loved that option with the orginal GG games in the early 90s.
RE: What to do with all the BT7M's
Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2011 3:44 am
by randallw
Armor can only replace types in their same class: light tank for light tank, medium tank for medium tank, heavy assault gun for heavy assault gun, etc.
RE: What to do with all the BT7M's
Posted: Sun Dec 18, 2011 8:16 pm
by randallw
Heliodorus keeps bringing this up, and the devs haven't seemed to respond to it, at least recently. Why do the Axis have a multiplier for AP expenditure on reassigning units to a different HQ?
RE: What to do with all the BT7M's
Posted: Sun Jan 08, 2012 1:13 pm
by schmolywar
Is there a way to see the detailed combat resolution messages after youve received a turn from your pbem opponent?
RE: War in the East Q&A
Posted: Sun Jan 08, 2012 6:12 pm
by ETF
Anyway to update A/C on the "c" command list. Say want to convert the I15's to YAK1's?
Doable or do I have to do via mouse clicks haha.
RE: What to do with all the BT7M's
Posted: Sun Jan 08, 2012 6:14 pm
by ETF
ORIGINAL: schmolywar
Is there a way to see the detailed combat resolution messages after youve received a turn from your pbem opponent?
There should be a replay as in in WITP....hard to figure what went on sometimes.
RE: What to do with all the BT7M's
Posted: Sun Jan 08, 2012 6:32 pm
by Wild
Agreed. Don't know why they thought it was a good idea not to include a replay.
RE: What to do with all the BT7M's
Posted: Sun Jan 08, 2012 7:44 pm
by ETF
ORIGINAL: Wild
Agreed. Don't know why they thought it was a good idea not to include a replay.
Defies logic IMHO. It is worth the Coding time. I would give up other features for it.
RE: What to do with all the BT7M's
Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 1:40 pm
by pompack
ORIGINAL: Wild
Agreed. Don't know why they thought it was a good idea not to include a replay.
I certainly would like that as well, but the "why" is really quite simple: It's not a replay in WitP, it's a re-creation. Saving a true "replay" would increase the size of the save by at least a factor of ten and probably a lot more. It works in WitP because if you save the initial conditions and the seed you will always (except for Sync Bug issues) get the same result. The problem in WitE is that it is not a simple Move-All-Resolve-All as it is in WitP but instead is a Move-Resolve-Move-Resolve ... etc.
In order to "recreate" a WitE turn you would need to save the initial conditions and log every keystroke and mouseclick of the turn (providing a lot of information about the opponent's thought processes as you watch each unit or status screen he examines) or save the initial conditions/seed for every combat action. It's do-able but it would be a lot of code labor as well as a time and storage impact for each turn.
RE: What to do with all the BT7M's
Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 1:50 pm
by elmo3
ORIGINAL: Wild
Agreed. Don't know why they thought it was a good idea not to include a replay.
One reason could be so people who PBEM don't have to stare at the screen with nothing happening while potentially a hundred or more units are moving out of your sight due to fog of war.
Edit - And sorry for going off topic. The purpose of this thread is to ask questions about the game
as it exists, not debate what might have been or why things were left out.
RE: What to do with all the BT7M's
Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 2:57 pm
by Wild
Thank you Pompack and Elmo. Those are good reasons, i never thought of the potential problems.Guess we will just have to live without the replay feature.