Page 8 of 12

RE: R&D advance airframe(w engine) and plus engines?

Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 5:12 pm
by sanderz
ORIGINAL: sanderz

Hi

In the document there is a section on Air Production with some suggestions as to what to turn off or increase.  Trying to get my head around whats best to do (PDU on).

For the A6M5 Zero you change it to the A6M3 Zero which is fair enough as with the other factory you have 2 x 30 R&D.  Is the thinking here that you will just change the factories over to the new models on their standard arrival dates and that it is more important to have the A6M3 early than the A6M5?

I see the A6M5c has armour (though at the expense of other stats) - does this armour make this plane a lot better than the standad A6M5.  If not i can see why that would be another reason not to rush the A6M5.

Also - is it worth rushing the Sen Baku (which is the upgrade to the A6M2) as it upgrades to the A6M5b and i'm assuming there will be a large number of the old A6M2 still around? 


thanks
EDIT - Why increase the Ki44-iia Tojo, there are no new airgroups and nothing upgrades to it as far as i can see - what am i missing here? Or is it that whilst nothing is on the upgrade path you can convert other planes (the Oscar?) to it?





RE: R&D advance airframe(w engine) and plus engines?

Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 5:22 pm
by PaxMondo
ORIGINAL: sanderz

EDIT - Why increase the Ki44-iia Tojo, there are no new airgroups and nothing upgrades to it as far as i can see - what am i missing here? Or is it that whilst nothing is on the upgrade path you can convert other planes (the Oscar?) to it?
With PDU On, almost all (all?) of the IJA fighter groups can upgrade to the Tojo.

Econ 101 - Draft 2

Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 11:29 pm
by n01487477
ORIGINAL: sanderz

Hi

In the document there is a section on Air Production with some suggestions as to what to turn off or increase.  Trying to get my head around whats best to do (PDU on).
Remember this doc so far is focused on PDU ON, Realistic ON. I'll do off later.
For the A6M5 Zero you change it to the A6M3 Zero which is fair enough as with the other factory you have 2 x 30 R&D.  Is the thinking here that you will just change the factories over to the new models on their standard arrival dates and that it is more important to have the A6M3 early than the A6M5?
No, my thinking is that once the M3 R&D factories are fully repaired, I'll move them up the line ASAP.
I see the A6M5c has armour (though at the expense of other stats) - does this armour make this plane a lot better than the standard A6M5.  If not i can see why that would be another reason not to rush the A6M5.
Haven't done enough test comparisons, but by that stage armour or none, there's carnage. I set up to rush the M5 or M5b(with slightly better weapons). But honestly, all of them are pretty av. compared to what you'll be facing. The A7M2 is good - but way too far away and not on an upgrade path.
Also - is it worth rushing the Sen Baku (which is the upgrade to the A6M2) as it upgrades to the A6M5b and i'm assuming there will be a large number of the old A6M2 still around? 

thanks
I wrote this:
There is no damage or cost associated with moving a fully repaired R&D facility to the next upgrade option as defined by the editor. The advantage with non-realistic is that fully repaired production plants can be moved along this path at no cost too.
Which is why building the A6M2, and then switching it to the Baku and then the M5b is a good option for non-realistic(straight away), but can’t be achieved with realistic R&D.
So what I'm saying is don't research the Baku, playing Realistic Off - build a few more M2 factories, when fully repaired, switch them to the Baku and in the same turn, to the M5b and voila - you're researching that! Can get it a year early if wanted.

RE: Econ 101 - Draft 2

Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2011 4:32 pm
by sanderz
Another question on the document.

"So turn everything off, except those that are currently building and then we’ll (you’ll) determine what you want. The purple and blue graphic will tell you that turning off all those merchants give you a HI windfall."


By turning off "everything except those building" i assume you mean just the "Queued" ships. But if i do this none of the figures at the top of the screen change. I can't see how i am saving any HI.

However, if i accelerate these queued ships then the "calculated points" does change, it increases by 1 x Durability.

Also, where in Tracker is the "Ship delay and HI graph"?

What am I missing here?

Many thanks

RE: Econ 101 - Draft 2

Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 12:29 am
by n01487477
ORIGINAL: sanderz

Another question on the document.

"So turn everything off, except those that are currently building and then we’ll (you’ll) determine what you want. The purple and blue graphic will tell you that turning off all those merchants give you a HI windfall."


By turning off "everything except those building" i assume you mean just the "Queued" ships. But if i do this none of the figures at the top of the screen change. I can't see how i am saving any HI.
Ok - well future HI with queued and Blue print ships. Under the beta you can turn off or stop any ship now. Actually having thought about it more; from the standpoint of what I'd do (which is more micro-managing) - I'd leave everything as is and as they are about to go into build mode - turn them off.

The reason for this is that once you stop or halt queued or blue print ships they no longer get the free date movement closer to build. Queued(Stop) and Blue print(stop) work differently too and I should outline that.

Still some of those Merchants - I'm never going to want or use.
However, if i accelerate these queued ships then the "calculated points" does change, it increases by 1 x Durability.
HI cost increases * 1 Durability; Time reduces by 2 days instead of 1 per turn.
Also, where in Tracker is the "Ship delay and HI graph"?

What am I missing here?

Many thanks
Optimum on the Ship Production screen. My version is 1.9 though.

Cheers

RE: JEcon 101 setup pre-final Doc

Posted: Sat Dec 03, 2011 9:02 pm
by jon_r
Having trouble getting the saved games at the top of the thread to load. Running 1.04.1106i. When I load the files WPAE5 or WPAE6m I get a File Failed to Load Error. No problems opening the very helpful .pdf also offered through dropbox. Any suggestions?

Thanks,

Jon

RE: JEcon 101 setup pre-final Doc

Posted: Sat Dec 03, 2011 9:12 pm
by jon_r
Please disregard above post -- had neglected to load newest beta ... works like a charm now.

Thanks,

Jon

RE: JEcon 101 setup pre-final Doc

Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 11:27 pm
by n01487477
Have a week off this week so I'm looking to finalise.

Anything else requested?

RE: JEcon 101 setup pre-final Doc

Posted: Sat Dec 17, 2011 12:12 am
by Mac Linehan
Damien -

All of your comments and answers above are exact and easily understood. I really appreciate your willingness to take the time and make the effort to clarify a very complex aspect of the game.

Thank You, Sir!

I can but quake at the feet of the Master...

Cricket Mac

RE: JEcon 101 setup pre-final Doc

Posted: Fri Dec 30, 2011 9:27 pm
by n01487477
Any other suggestions ? 

RE: JEcon 101 setup pre-final Doc

Posted: Fri Dec 30, 2011 10:30 pm
by ny59giants
The only question that may confuse players is air production. When doing R&D on an airframe, they will not repair much the further away they are due (an airframe due in '45 will not repair often in '42). An engine that is not due for production until '45 will start to repair after every expansion. So if you double your engine factory from 30 to 60, after 30 days and 30k in supply it will be repaired and then start accumulating Developmental Points so once it gets to the magic 100 points, it will move forward a month. It is easy to move engines forward by months, if not year which makes little sense to me, but I'll stay off that soap box. [;)]

RE: JEcon 101 setup pre-final Doc

Posted: Fri Dec 30, 2011 10:33 pm
by n01487477
Yeah - Santez wanted me to re-write that and having you echo that concern - I might as well.

RE: JEcon 101 setup pre-final Doc

Posted: Mon Jan 16, 2012 1:26 pm
by sanderz
ORIGINAL: n01487477

Yeah - Santez wanted me to re-write that and having you echo that concern - I might as well.

hi - bumping this and looking forward to the next update [:D]

RE: JEcon 101 setup pre-final Doc

Posted: Mon Jan 16, 2012 1:56 pm
by cohimbra
+1

RE: JEcon 101 setup pre-final Doc

Posted: Wed Jan 18, 2012 10:28 am
by sanderz
ORIGINAL: ny59giants

The only question that may confuse players is air production. When doing R&D on an airframe, they will not repair much the further away they are due (an airframe due in '45 will not repair often in '42). An engine that is not due for production until '45 will start to repair after every expansion.

So say i build 30 R&D factories in 41/12 for the Ki-84a Frank which is due on 44/1 (and that i have enough supplies) then i am not going to see anything near 1 factory repairing per day (like happens with production factories) - however, do you have any idea, given the example of the Frank, how much earlier it would become available.

Damian - Is it possible for Tracker to do some magic calcs that will tell us this info if we input a start date and number of factories to be built - i appreciate it would only be a rough estimate but would still be very helpful for us newbies.
So if you double your engine factory from 30 to 60, after 30 days and 30k in supply it will be repaired and then start accumulating Developmental Points so once it gets to the magic 100 points, it will move forward a month. It is easy to move engines forward by months, if not year which makes little sense to me, but I'll stay off that soap box. [;)]

I know this is just an example but is there any reason why you would ever have more than 30 R&D factories (unless you have them to start with) as i thought the magic number was 30 and you got vastly diminishing returns above that????

Thanks

Sanderz

RE: Econ 101 - Draft 2

Posted: Wed Jan 18, 2012 10:44 am
by sanderz

ORIGINAL: sanderz
For the A6M5 Zero you change it to the A6M3 Zero which is fair enough as with the other factory you have 2 x 30 R&D.  Is the thinking here that you will just change the factories over to the new models on their standard arrival dates and that it is more important to have the A6M3 early than the A6M5?
ORIGINAL: n01487477
No, my thinking is that once the M3 R&D factories are fully repaired, I'll move them up the line ASAP.

I think i am missing your point here - isn't the A6M5 already further up the line?


ORIGINAL: sanderz
Also - is it worth rushing the Sen Baku (which is the upgrade to the A6M2) as it upgrades to the A6M5b and i'm assuming there will be a large number of the old A6M2 still around? 

ORIGINAL: n01487477
There is no damage or cost associated with moving a fully repaired R&D facility to the next upgrade option as defined by the editor. The advantage with non-realistic is that fully repaired production plants can be moved along this path at no cost too.
Which is why building the A6M2, and then switching it to the Baku and then the M5b is a good option for non-realistic(straight away), but can’t be achieved with realistic R&D.

So what I'm saying is don't research the Baku, playing Realistic Off - build a few more M2 factories, when fully repaired, switch them to the Baku and in the same turn, to the M5b and voila - you're researching that! Can get it a year early if wanted.
Implication here is (if i understand you correctly) that the Baku is not that important and not needed early whereas the 5b is a better option.

As a result it seems you can get the 5b earlier than the Baku even though the Baku won't have finished R&Ding and the 5b comes after the Baku. This seems odd.

Finally, when you say switch them in the same turn - does it have to be the same turn? e.g. if you forget to do it on the same turn can you still do it the following day>

Many thanks

Sanderz


RE: Econ 101 - Draft 2

Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 2:50 pm
by cohimbra
bump

RE: Econ 101 - Draft 2

Posted: Sun Mar 04, 2012 10:18 pm
by scout1
Can't you guys add a button to this tool

"Stuff that you should really be doing next turn" ...........

RE: Econ 101 - Draft 2

Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2012 6:26 am
by CarnageINC
Giving this wonderful thread a bump for us new/restarting Japanese players.  I'm sure Larryfulkerson will want to see this to.  Thank you for giving me something to build upon [;)].

RE: Econ 101 - Draft 2

Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2012 6:56 pm
by Mike Solli
Damian, I'm finally working my way through this document. Very nice stuff. So far, one comment:

Page 7 – Resource Storage and Flows – You turn on resource storage at Sapporo. Why not turn it on instead at Hakodate? I like to ship all resources and oil from Sakhalin to Hokkaido (oil from Shikuka to Sapporo and resources from Toyohara to Wakkani). Then I turn on resource and oil storage at Hakodate. That way I can ship both from Hakodate to Ominato – a two hex distance. Increase those two ports to size 7 and you can move a lot of stuff in a short amount of time. It’ll minimize the amount of shipping you need here.