Matrix Games Forums

ORIGINAL: BillBrown

OK, Naval Shipyards. I have a small positive difference. Should I expand some of them and accelerate some of the CVs?

Accelerate the carriers, probably turn off the super heavy battleships. They are very difficult to use. If you want, you can build the Yamato in 44 when ship points free up a bit.

One of the most important tasks Japan can do, after building Frank and Sam and not trashing your economy.

"...probably turn off the super heavy battleships. They are very difficult to use."

Why do you find them difficult to use? Not very many ports can repair them or something?

If you are thinking of a second day strike at Pearl, sweep only, and then bomb on the following day.

You might finish off a slow battleship for each extra days strike.

You have a lot of demands on the KB, and you need to figure out if it is worth it or not. A good AFB will realize the KB is there and potentially cause you problems elsewhere. A raid on Marshalls and shipping there, or perhaps swinging up to Wake, or moving to Rabaul.

My opponent, Walter, always laments a second day PH strike as not worth it in terms of planes and especially pilots lost.

ORIGINAL: larryfulkerson

"...probably turn off the super heavy battleships. They are very difficult to use."

Why do you find them difficult to use? Not very many ports can repair them or something?

Torpedo bait, fuel hogs, difficult to rearm in stock scenario, and difficult to repair.

They do change how the AFBs play a bit, which is a bonus that is very hard to measure.

Best used only escorted by six or so good destroyers.

ORIGINAL: witpqs

My opponent, Walter, always laments a second day PH strike as not worth it in terms of planes and especially pilots lost.

Plus there is the very real possibility the Americans surge their navy at you...they are expendable.

Factors for a 2nd strike, more damage and possible sinkings to already damaged ships, once sunk, unlike the real war, they can't be refloated and rebuilt to pester you later.

Factors against a 2nd strike: Leaves you vulnerable to him sending several sorties of undamaged or lightly damaged ship TFs to try and confront you at night. I did that as the Allies and sank 2 CVs and damaged 2 more. My opponent never recovered and the game ended in less than 6 months. Far more loses to your air groups then benefits, as PH is a major repair facility and can keep many heavily damaged ships afloat and alive, until they can be pumped out and moved to the west or even east coast for long term upgrades and repairs.

Things to look for to help decide which to choose: How many CLs were damaged and were any BBs undamaged or lightly damaged? The more CLs you damage the less he will have to sortie against you during the night if u seek a 2nd day attack and since you have only 2 renovated BCs as escorts with big guns, if he has 2 or 3 undamaged or lightly BBs he might risk them escorted by CLs and the few DDs left . How damaged are the airfields and how many planes, especially fighters did you destroy. Since destroyed reports are better than the hundreds that are normally listed as damaged, usually far above the actual number than existed. If there are a high number of destroyed fighters then it might be worth the effort and lead with a sweep or two if possible.

I have done 2nd day attacks and found them disappointing but if you plan to invade PH or some HI Islands then it will be worth it.

I find sending some or all the KB along the west coast to be a fun adventure especially since he has ships in the shipyard 2 BBs in Seattle and other upgrading. Also you make get lucky as he might try to rush convoys out before you send some subs from around PH off the west coast. Sending the KB will mess with that effort as he tries to rush out supplies and reinforcements to isolated weakly help bases like Palmyra, Canto, Christmas Islands.

If you do it will be an anxious turn for you both.

Oh well, I did do a second day attack, we will see what happens. The turn has been sent. It will be a couple of days until I get the turn back.

I did not turn off the super BBs this turn, but I might next turn.

ORIGINAL: Lowpe
Accelerate the carriers, probably turn off the super heavy battleships. They are very difficult to use. If you want, you can build the Yamato in 44 when ship points free up a bit.

To each their own. I accelerate all carriers due before the end of 1944 (including the CVEs) and stop the 1945 iterations. Sc. 2 OOB (Shinano) is a different CV than Sc. 1, so isn't as massive a NavSY suck. I build the Yamato and Mushashi-particularly the former-just to get 'em off the queue for NavSY points.

Yamato can be devastating to other heavy SCTFs and is a worthwhile combatant. Anything but the most superficial damage turns her into a real yard queen, so she's more limited in her mission profile than-say-the Kongos. I've used Yamato to thoroughly abuse the RN in the IO in late 1942-early 1943. She has more of a qualitative edge versus the early war RN especially, rather than against the Iowa class BBs in 1944+. So getting her out and about earlier gives you some tactical options that you would pass up by not building her until late war.

If there's a paucity of NavSY points for CV acceleration, go back in and (monthly-semi-monthly) turn off late war submarines, and xAKs-especially those xAKs that don't convert to TK/AO. That will save you some sturm and drang on your NavSY production too.

ORIGINAL: BillBrown

Oh well, I did do a second day attack, we will see what happens. The turn has been sent. It will be a couple of days until I get the turn back.

I did not turn off the super BBs this turn, but I might next turn.

Didn't get back here in time to say that your first day's strike against PH was a very nice one. Well done. I've got to imagine that, in addition to the two confirmed BB sinkings, that at least three others are in extremis.

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy

ORIGINAL: Lowpe
Accelerate the carriers, probably turn off the super heavy battleships. They are very difficult to use. If you want, you can build the Yamato in 44 when ship points free up a bit.

To each their own.

Absolutely![:)]

Two types of shipyard production, so turning off those xak will only help with escort carriers. Turning off subs will help with warships thou, and most people shut off the SST, especially those first 10.

ORIGINAL: Lowpe
most people shut off the SST, especially those first 10.

Why the first 10 SSTs? I've decided to build 8, and they're the first 8. What am I missing?

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli

ORIGINAL: Lowpe
most people shut off the SST, especially those first 10.

Why the first 10 SSTs? I've decided to build 8, and they're the first 8. What am I missing?

I personally like them, and do build all SST for Japan. But small capacity versus cost and very limited range makes them questionable and most player would rather accelerate something else with guns or flight decks.

8 or 10 I guess depends upon mod/scenario..but the first class is rather poor. [&:]

ORIGINAL: Lowpe
Two types of shipyard production

Of course. I inadvertently conflated these two in my post, so thanks for the clarification for the new readers.

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli

ORIGINAL: Lowpe
most people shut off the SST, especially those first 10.

Why the first 10 SSTs? I've decided to build 8, and they're the first 8. What am I missing?

I personally like them, and do build all SST for Japan. But small capacity versus cost and very limited range makes them questionable and most player would rather accelerate something else with guns or flight decks.

8 or 10 I guess depends upon mod/scenario..but the first class is rather poor. [&:]

Thanks, Lowpe. I'll take a close look at them and pick some better ones to build.

Even though they have a rediculously small cargo hold they can still move a little and I was planning on using whatever SST's I get to help out with the logistics until the late war period when the SST's are the only vessel that will get supplies out to the units on the cutoff islands. And there aren't really that many of them. I was thinking about cutting off the shipbuilding after about mid-44 to save the RES.

This image is one I stold from my AI-Jap opponent to spy on how things are going and it appears that the AI is going to try to build all their SST's too. For whatever that's worth.

ORIGINAL: GetAssista

ORIGINAL: jdsrae
My answers to the above questions led me to using the Akasi class as my AKE of choice. It can rearm all but Nagato and Yamato classes in forward areas.

Lima class AKEs can rearm everything everywhere

Are you sure the Lima can rearm Yamato?
I will check, but when I prepared that table I couldn’t find a single AKE that has capacity > Yamato main gun.
Lima can rearm Nagato which the Akasi can’t, but that’s only 2 ships.
So if people do convert a few Lima AKE they don’t need many and they should be moved around the map to where they are using the Nagatos.

ORIGINAL: jdsrae

ORIGINAL: GetAssista

ORIGINAL: jdsrae
My answers to the above questions led me to using the Akasi class as my AKE of choice. It can rearm all but Nagato and Yamato classes in forward areas.

Lima class AKEs can rearm everything everywhere

Are you sure the Lima can rearm Yamato?
I will check, but when I prepared that table I couldn’t find a single AKE that has capacity > Yamato main gun.
Lima can rearm Nagato which the Akasi can’t, but that’s only 2 ships.
So if people do convert a few Lima AKE they don’t need many and they should be moved around the map to where they are using the Nagatos.

This was discussed in a thread not long ago and (IIRC) the conclusion was that the Lima's could rearm the Yamato in DBB scenarios or something along that line, because in stock the capacity of the Lima AE is not enough to reach the official ream level of the Yamato Class BBs. As in so many things for this game: "It depends ..."

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli




Why the first 10 SSTs? I've decided to build 8, and they're the first 8. What am I missing?

I personally like them, and do build all SST for Japan. But small capacity versus cost and very limited range makes them questionable and most player would rather accelerate something else with guns or flight decks.

8 or 10 I guess depends upon mod/scenario..but the first class is rather poor. [&:]

Thanks, Lowpe. I'll take a close look at them and pick some better ones to build.

You want to build 10 of these?

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli




Why the first 10 SSTs? I've decided to build 8, and they're the first 8. What am I missing?

I personally like them, and do build all SST for Japan. But small capacity versus cost and very limited range makes them questionable and most player would rather accelerate something else with guns or flight decks.

8 or 10 I guess depends upon mod/scenario..but the first class is rather poor. [&:]

Thanks, Lowpe. I'll take a close look at them and pick some better ones to build.

IIRC there's one class that arrives as SST that can immediately convert to regular SS but get Kaitien instead of torps. The rest of the SST cant convert and are semi unarmed