Matrix Games Forums

Serious proposal 1 :

Serious proposal 2 (variation on the red flag with cross) :

Edit : With the red that should be less red, something in the middle of post 161 & this one.

Times are REALLY SLOW when you start debating the color of the flag in a game....

Very true. But isn't it cool to have this level of input ? Amazing.

ORIGINAL: Froonp

Serious proposal 2 (variation on the red flag with cross) :

Edit : With the red that should be less red, something in the middle of post 161 & this one.

Patrice's two suggestions use my very crude version of the cross in the center. For the voting you can assume that the cross will be cleaned up and not so raggedly done.

Very true. But isn't it cool to have this level of input ? Amazing.

Amen Stretch

ORIGINAL: Froonp


The German Political Police caught a load of the brand new games when they entered Germany last year, and destroyed hundreds of these, and made the local ADG man under political investigation. They suspected him of being pro nazi. [:(] You like it or not, but the German Political Police takes it seriously.

I hope you were joking about the ADG German situation.

It does seem a bit extreme for the political police (of course, it has another name) to pursue a private individual for something like that, but if it were a political party they'd be in trouble. In case you find it unlikely that a Western, democratic state would have an organ of secret police...well, Germany does, to my knowledge. Long live freedom of speech [&o]

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets

ORIGINAL: Frederyck
The counters look wonderful. Excellent job! I have one question, though. The MOTs have their small filled in circles "the wheels" only tangentially touching the rectangle above. On the real life counters, it looks like they are somewhat more overlapping. Is this an effect of the larger images on screen?

I can move them up a pixel. That will probably look better.

But "real life counters"? Ya gotta stop talking to them, man! Soon they'll be talking back.[;)]

My precioussss counterssss...

ORIGINAL: Greyshaft

ORIGINAL: stretch

I nominate this one..

posted by JanSorensen

I like it but I suggest that the centre cross is superimposed on a white circle otherwise I fear the top of the cross will be lost in the black background

I second greyshaft and vote for this one.

ORIGINAL: Alexander Seil

It does seem a bit extreme for the political police (of course, it has another name) to pursue a private individual for something like that, but if it were a political party they'd be in trouble. In case you find it unlikely that a Western, democratic state would have an organ of secret police...well, Germany does, to my knowledge. Long live freedom of speech [&o]

Secret Police is yet another issue. I'd expect about every so called western country has one or more of those (I've had a few runins with folk whom I assume (their ID is obviously protected so can never be sure) to belong to the local branch).

ORIGINAL: c92nichj

ORIGINAL: Greyshaft

ORIGINAL: stretch

I nominate this one..

I like it but I suggest that the centre cross is superimposed on a white circle otherwise I fear the top of the cross will be lost in the black background

I second greyshaft and vote for this one.

I vote for this flag as well.

Since we are dealing with territory conqured by Nazi Germany. I think we should use a Nazi flag.

http://www.historicalflags.biz/nazi_flags.htm

ORIGINAL: Mziln

Since we are dealing with territory conqured by Nazi Germany. I think we should use a Nazi flag.

http://www.historicalflags.biz/nazi_flags.htm

An interesting website.

I still stand by my position that the game will ship without swastikas, but that the players will be able to replace the flags for any and all countries by simply providing their own bitmap for same. The program will stretch/shrink the bitmap flags to the size required for display on the screen. That means the player can provide the flag as a bitmap with any rectangular dimensions.

ORIGINAL: Greyshaft

ORIGINAL: stretch

I nominate this one..

posted by JanSorensen

I like it but I suggest that the centre cross is superimposed on a white circle otherwise I fear the top of the cross will be lost in the black background

This one is best, no question. Need the cross or something that people think as a powerful "German" symbol. Too bad you can't go with the swastika, though. We'll just have to get used to it. I wonder if I'll care enough to learn how to modify the flag myself. Will these mods be easy to make?

Peter

I'm still not sold on the the white circle suggestion, though. Let's see how they look side-by-side and on the map.

IMHO while I have no afinity for the symbol of nazism, without swastikas I feel the game will lack some of the historical accuracy normally associated with WiF. If your going to use flags, at least use the correct ones. I guess I have to ask -Could you not include it as a game option at least?

ORIGINAL: macgregor

IMHO while I have no afinity for the symbol of nazism, without swastikas I feel the game will lack some of the historical accuracy normally associated with WiF. If your going to use flags, at least use the correct ones. I guess I have to ask -Could you not include it as a game option at least?

I would be astonished if someone didn't post a replacement flag that players could download and use. But the game won't contain any swastikas.

And matter of fact, my personal opinion on the matter doesn't matter. Sort of like whether it's better to drive on the left or right side of the road -if you don't go with the flow, you suffer the consequences.

Regardless if we like it or not, there are cultural and legal sensitivities that must be respected from a business point of view. When Hearts of Iron originally came out, it did so without the Swastika. Ahistorical? Yes. Legel to sell in Germany? Yes. The game's community however made available many game upgrades and enhancements that included more accurate flags all for free via download. I am sure this community will also assist in this aspect and help anyone in need with switching the flag.

On a related note, how much modding will be the game allow? Will there be a packaged scenario builder? This does seem to be very popular past time amongst many gamers.

ORIGINAL: Glen Felzien
Regardless if we like it or not, there are cultural and legal sensitivities that must be respected from a business point of view. When Hearts of Iron originally came out, it did so without the Swastika. Ahistorical? Yes. Legel to sell in Germany? Yes. The game's community however made available many game upgrades and enhancements that included more accurate flags all for free via download. I am sure this community will also assist in this aspect and help anyone in need with switching the flag.

On a related note, how much modding will be the game allow? Will there be a packaged scenario builder? This does seem to be very popular past time amongst many gamers.

Nope. No scenario builder. I wish there were one. Each of the 11 scenarios that will come with the game (as per WIF FE) has something completely unique to it. Sometimes only certain countries are in play. Sometimes, the Russians are in the middle of moving factories. Other examples are: mandatory declarations of war, neutrality pact between USSR and Japan, conquered countries, liberated countries, aligned countries, France split into Free France and Vichy, only half the world map in play with the Commonwealth providing and removing naval units for the not-in-use portion of the world map.

There are units in production, reserves that may or may not have been called out, ships that have been replaced (upgraded), the list seems virtually endless when trying to set up all the different parameters to start a scenario. Who's at war with whom, production multiples and when they change, US Entry choices taken, US Entry actions already rolled for.

I spent most of November trying to finish all the scenarios and there are still loose ends for most of them. CWIF only had 3 scenarios completed and they were the easiest to set up. The spreadsheets that come with WIF FE for unit placements at the start of the scenarios are 18 pages long in small type. That was the easy part to encode (most of October).

Building special software so the players can modify these 50 or so scenario bits and pieces certainly isn't going to happen for Product 1. To design, code, and debug it would take a very long time (add 6 months to the release date). No one I know wants to wait that long.

The Allies.

I have fixed the wheels and the status bar alignment.

Note only the british are in supply (and the Chinese supply unit).

I move the HQ names to the right a touch because of a weirdness when zooming out.

Stilwell is a lighter green.

This is at zoom level 8.