Matrix Games Forums

ORIGINAL: witpqs

Fatigue is too high for good results, but 222 down to 3 is like a few guys just walked into the enemy.

Presume the commander during the battle was less able than the permanent commander.

A whole division is more than I tested on a 6,000 limit island. At 222% of base load IIRC supply usage was = 91 times normal, just sitting there. Look in Tracker to see the base load of the unit (LCU page, scroll all way to the right), you can not see the base load of units in-game.

What shape is the unit in (disablements)? Maybe you can deliberate attack this turn? With supplies good, but after the penalty eats them all they will fight at 25%.

If needed, split the division leave the best 1 (or possibly) 2 part(s) in place, withdraw the rest to reduce the supply penalty. Rest what is there. Bad if KB has time to show up.

Does enemy have any forts? Are division's engineers still combat ready?

Likely they will fight much better this turn and of course after rest. Shock attack very risky as it might wreck the division leaving no alternative to retreat.

From another thread: for bombardment put one float plane group on daytime recon (doesn't matter if they fly) and another on nighttime recon. One group on recon either time is supposed to suffice to improve bombardment but speculation is that code might care if day or night, so have both since you can't always predict when bombardment goes in. Do bombard if possible on same turn as attack.

Interesting and disturbing. The attacking force is correct (actually a bit light--I didn't bring an amph brigade, tank battalion, or combat engineer regiment) to take a 6000-limit island. The supply usage definitely sounds excessive. It should be about 400 tons per day to sustain heavy offensive operations by a full-scale assault, and that's what I packed on about a dozen xAKs. The garrison is following separately on transports. This is the first time I've ever run a major assault in WitP-AE, so I used my professional experience with the USMC to task organise it.

The division currently has 150 AV. There shouldn't be any supply penalty--if there is, it's ahistorical.

The KB is off Sarawak, so I have some time.

The bombardment group stood off.

You misunderstand about the supply penalty. It's an abstraction to keep unrealistically huge forces from camping on small islands/atolls. We have not seen developer confirmation on this point yet, but it seems very likely that the supply penalty is applied after combat. That means supply unloaded during the turn are there to be used, but accumulating supplies on land is the problem. Of course, unloading supplies every turn means being exposed to CD guns if they are operating.

I think it's a pretty good abstraction, assuming that supply unloaded during the turn is still there for combat.

In your situation, if you haven't any more supply to unload then your only options are to attack without supplies or withdraw.

ORIGINAL: witpqs

You misunderstand about the supply penalty. It's an abstraction to keep unrealistically huge forces from camping on small islands/atolls. We have not seen developer confirmation on this point yet, but it seems very likely that the supply penalty is applied after combat. That means supply unloaded during the turn are there to be used, but accumulating supplies on land is the problem. Of course, unloading supplies every turn means being exposed to CD guns if they are operating.

I think it's a pretty good abstraction, assuming that supply unloaded during the turn is still there for combat.

In your situation, if you haven't any more supply to unload then your only options are to attack without supplies or withdraw.

I have about 25000 supply left on ships.

I can comment on game mechanics but I can't give advice because I'm reading both sides!

ORIGINAL: witpqs

I can comment on game mechanics but I can't give advice because I'm reading both sides!

Then you know I invaded because it was in the pre-war plan timetable.

Sure.

How are you proceeding?

ORIGINAL: witpqs

Sure.

How are you proceeding?

The Chief of Staff of the Navy is extremely concerned about the problems encountered at Kwajalein and is monitoring the situation closely. Admiral Welch (commander of the Battle Fleet) will have some explaining to do when he returns to Pearl Harbor. The possibility that the forces deployed against Kwajalein may have to be withdrawn is being considered.

March 28/29 1942

Commonwealth rear guards abandon Rangoon, retreating north.

Assault on Kwajalein makes slow progress.

March 29/30 1942

A bombardment pause.

The KB is reported seven hexes west of Palau, so next turn it can be expected at Ulithi. Time to start preparing to pull out the ships.

March 30/31 1942 (strange...)

Oosthaven falls.

Americal divisional attack reduced to 1-2

I still have supply unloading...

Ground combat at Kwajalein Island (132,115)
 
Allied Deliberate attack
 
Attacking force 5350 troops, 211 guns, 121 vehicles, Assault Value = 146
 
Defending force 2160 troops, 44 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 26
 
Allied adjusted assault: 8
 
Japanese adjusted defense: 11
 
Allied assault odds: 1 to 2 (fort level 3)
 
Combat modifiers
Defender: forts(+), disruption(-), preparation(-), experience(-)
Attacker: leaders(+), leaders(-), disruption(-), supply(-)
 
Japanese ground losses:
      116 casualties reported
         Squads: 10 destroyed, 10 disabled
         Non Combat: 4 destroyed, 4 disabled
         Engineers: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
 
 
Allied ground losses:
      217 casualties reported
         Squads: 7 destroyed, 8 disabled
         Non Combat: 3 destroyed, 9 disabled
         Engineers: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
 
 
Assaulting units:
    Americal Infantry Division
 
Defending units:
    65th Nav Gd /1
    Maizuru 2nd SNLF
    Nimur Naval Fortress
    64th Nav Gd /1
    6th Fleet
    Kwajalein Base Force

March 31/April 1 1942

Nothing significant happens. The Americal Division rests. The KB is observed at Truk.

April 1/2 1942

Japan captures Nanyang.

The slower Japanese carriers show up at Singapore.

April 2/3 1942

Not a great deal of action.

April 3/4

Only minor operations.

April 4/5 1942

My opponent comments: "An interesting spin of the situation in nearly all fronts."

A convoy delivering troops to Rabaul encounters an invasion convoy, supported by Betties from Truk

Morning Air attack on TF, near Rabaul at 106,125
 
Weather in hex: Overcast
 
Raid detected at 120 NM, estimated altitude 12,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 42 minutes
 
Japanese aircraft
      G4M1 Betty x 60
 
 
 
Japanese aircraft losses
      G4M1 Betty: 1 destroyed, 14 damaged
 
Allied Ships
      DD Morris
      CA Australia
      AP President Hayes, Torpedo hits 1,  on fire,  heavy damage
      CL Perth
      CL Leander
      AP William Ward Burrows
      CL Phoenix
      CA Canberra, Torpedo hits 1
      DD La Triomphant, Torpedo hits 1,  on fire
      CL St. Louis
 
 
Allied ground losses:
      5 casualties reported
         Squads: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
         Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
         Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
 
 
Aircraft Attacking:
      36 x G4M1 Betty launching torpedoes at 200 feet
               Naval Attack:  1 x 18in Type 91 Torpedo
       1 x G4M1 Betty launching torpedoes at 200 feet
               Naval Attack:  1 x 18in Type 91 Torpedo
      22 x G4M1 Betty launching torpedoes at 200 feet
               Naval Attack:  1 x 18in Type 91 Torpedo
 
 
 
---------------------------------------------

Afternoon Air attack on TF, near Rabaul at 106,125
 
Weather in hex: Moderate rain
 
Raid detected at 120 NM, estimated altitude 11,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 42 minutes
 
Japanese aircraft
      G4M1 Betty x 52
 
 
 
Japanese aircraft losses
      G4M1 Betty: 1 destroyed, 22 damaged
 
Allied Ships
      CL St. Louis
      DD La Triomphant,  on fire
      CL Achilles
      AP William Ward Burrows, Torpedo hits 1
      CA Canberra
      AK Procyon
      AK Arcturus, Torpedo hits 2,  heavy damage
      CL Leander
      CL Phoenix
 
 
Allied ground losses:
      40 casualties reported
         Squads: 1 destroyed, 2 disabled
         Non Combat: 1 destroyed, 1 disabled
         Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
 
 
Aircraft Attacking:
      29 x G4M1 Betty launching torpedoes at 200 feet
               Naval Attack:  1 x 18in Type 91 Torpedo
      22 x G4M1 Betty launching torpedoes at 200 feet
               Naval Attack:  1 x 18in Type 91 Torpedo

Morning Air attack on TF, near Kavieng at 105,123
 
Weather in hex: Moderate rain
 
Raid spotted at 25 NM, estimated altitude 19,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 6 minutes
 
Japanese aircraft
      F1M2 Pete x 2
 
 
 
Allied aircraft
      B-26 Marauder x 13
 
 
No Japanese losses
 
Allied aircraft losses
      B-26 Marauder: 1 damaged
 
Japanese Ships
      BB Mutsu
      xAK Eiko Maru #2
      CL Katori
      PB Ikunta Maru
 
 
 
Aircraft Attacking:
       3 x B-26 Marauder bombing from 15000 feet *
               Naval Attack:  3 x 500 lb SAP Bomb
       3 x B-26 Marauder bombing from 15000 feet *
               Naval Attack:  3 x 500 lb SAP Bomb
       4 x B-26 Marauder bombing from 15000 feet *
               Naval Attack:  3 x 500 lb SAP Bomb
       3 x B-26 Marauder bombing from 15000 feet *
               Naval Attack:  3 x 500 lb SAP Bomb
 
CAP engaged:
Mutsu-1  with F1M2 Pete (2 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
      2 plane(s) intercepting now.
      Group patrol altitude is 11000
      Raid is overhead
 
 
 
---------------------------------------------

Morning Air attack on TF, near Kavieng at 105,123
 
Weather in hex: Moderate rain
 
Raid spotted at 17 NM, estimated altitude 18,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 4 minutes
 
Japanese aircraft
      F1M2 Pete x 1
 
 
 
Allied aircraft
      B-26 Marauder x 3
 
 
No Japanese losses
 
No Allied losses
 
Japanese Ships
      CL Katori
 
 
 
Aircraft Attacking:
       3 x B-26 Marauder bombing from 15000 feet *
               Naval Attack:  3 x 500 lb SAP Bomb
 
CAP engaged:
Mutsu-1  with F1M2 Pete (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
      1 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
      Group patrol altitude is 11000 , scrambling fighters to 15000.
      Time for all group planes to reach interception is 7 minutes
 


Invasion of Java supported by the slower Japanese carriers
Amphibious Assault at Kalidjati
 
TF 145 troops unloading over beach at Kalidjati, 50,99
 
Japanese ground losses:
      197 casualties reported
         Squads: 31 destroyed, 0 disabled
         Non Combat: 5 destroyed, 0 disabled
         Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
      Guns lost 1 (1 destroyed, 0 disabled)
 
 
 
19 troops of a IJA Infantry Squad accidentally lost during unload of 124th Infantry Rgt
20 troops of a IJA HMG Squad lost in surf during unload of 56th Div
17 troops of a IJA Infantry Squad lost overboard during unload of 56th Div /3
17 troops of a IJA Infantry Squad accidentally lost during unload of 56th Div /4
17 troops of a IJA Infantry Squad lost overboard during unload of 56th Div /5
19 troops of a IJA Infantry Squad lost in surf during unload of 4th Div
20 troops of a IJA HMG Squad lost in surf during unload of 4th Div /2
17 troops of a IJA Infantry Squad lost in surf during unload of 56th Div /6
19 troops of a IJA Infantry Squad lost from landing craft during unload of 4th Div /4
17 troops of a SNLF Squad accidentally lost during unload of 32nd Nav Gsn Unit
17 troops of a SNLF Squad lost in surf during unload of 83rd Nav Gd
8 Aviation Support troops accidentally lost during unload of 22nd Air Flotilla /2
10 Support troops lost overboard during unload of 32nd Nav Gsn Unit /2
19 troops of a IJA Infantry Squad lost in surf during unload of 4th Div /5
13.2mm T93 AAMG lost from landing craft during unload of 9th Base Force /3
17 troops of a IJA Infantry Squad accidentally lost during unload of Imperial Guards Div /1
19 troops of a IJA Infantry Squad lost in surf during unload of 4th Div /6
8 Aviation Support troops lost overboard during unload of 9th Base Force /4
17 troops of a IJA Infantry Squad lost in surf during unload of 56th Div /7
17 troops of a IJA Infantry Squad lost overboard during unload of Imperial Guards Div /2
8 Engineers accidentally lost during unload of 1st Naval Const Bn /6
8 Aviation Support troops lost in surf during unload of 9th Base Force /6
20 troops of a IJA HMG Squad lost overboard during unload of Imperial Guards Div
18 troops of a IJA Engineer Squad lost in surf during unload of Imperial Guards Div /4
17 troops of a IJA Infantry Squad lost from landing craft during unload of Imperial Guards Div /5
17 troops of a IJA Infantry Squad lost in surf during unload of Imperial Guards Div /7
17 troops of a IJA Infantry Squad lost overboard during unload of Imperial Guards Div /7
 
Meanwhile at Kwaj

Ground combat at Kwajalein Island (132,115)
 
Allied Shock attack
 
Attacking force 4556 troops, 211 guns, 114 vehicles, Assault Value = 83
 
Defending force 1838 troops, 51 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 12
 
Allied adjusted assault: 2
 
Japanese adjusted defense: 7
 
Allied assault odds: 1 to 3 (fort level 2)
 
Combat modifiers
Defender: experience(-)
Attacker: shock(+), leaders(+), leaders(-), disruption(-), supply(-)
 
Japanese ground losses:
      152 casualties reported
         Squads: 3 destroyed, 2 disabled
         Non Combat: 6 destroyed, 4 disabled
         Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
      Units destroyed 1
 
 
Allied ground losses:
      416 casualties reported
         Squads: 4 destroyed, 33 disabled
         Non Combat: 5 destroyed, 33 disabled
         Engineers: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
      Vehicles lost 13 (2 destroyed, 11 disabled)
 
 
Assaulting units:
    Americal Infantry Division
 
Defending units:
    65th Nav Gd /1
    Nimur Naval Fortress
    Maizuru 2nd SNLF
    64th Nav Gd /1
    6th Fleet
    Kwajalein Base Force

The 33rd Japanese Division roughly handles a brigade trying to sneak in behind the Japanese forces in Burma

Ground combat at 56,51
 
Japanese Deliberate attack
 
Attacking force 12815 troops, 120 guns, 32 vehicles, Assault Value = 444
 
Defending force 2044 troops, 10 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 95
 
Japanese adjusted assault: 196
 
Allied adjusted defense: 11
 
Japanese assault odds: 17 to 1
 
Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), fatigue(-), experience(-)
Attacker: leaders(-)
 
Japanese ground losses:
      176 casualties reported
         Squads: 1 destroyed, 6 disabled
         Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 13 disabled
         Engineers: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled
 
 
Allied ground losses:
      778 casualties reported
         Squads: 54 destroyed, 33 disabled
         Non Combat: 20 destroyed, 4 disabled
         Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
      Units retreated 1
 
 
Defeated Allied Units Retreating!
 
Assaulting units:
    33rd Division
 
Defending units:
    BFF Brigade

Action at Davao

Ground combat at Davao (79,91)
 
Japanese Deliberate attack
 
Attacking force 8940 troops, 56 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 277
 
Defending force 3857 troops, 26 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 129
 
Japanese adjusted assault: 124
 
Allied adjusted defense: 7
 
Japanese assault odds: 17 to 1
 
Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), leaders(+), disruption(-), preparation(-)
 experience(-), supply(-)
Attacker:
 
Japanese ground losses:
      39 casualties reported
         Squads: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
         Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 4 disabled
         Engineers: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
 
 
Allied ground losses:
      173 casualties reported
         Squads: 2 destroyed, 9 disabled
         Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 14 disabled
         Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
 
 
Assaulting units:
    65th Brigade
    III/66th Naval Guard Unit
    3rd JNAF AF Unit
    24th JAAF AF Bn
 
Defending units:
    102nd PA Infantry Division

April 5/6 1942

Not a great day for the Allies in Burma. I'm still trying to figure out how the 5th Division beat me to Prome. The Chinese are coming.

The KB bumped into a damaged AP south of the Shortlands. I suppose high speed steaming works wonders. Time to make tracks.

Japanese forces hold off attacks at Prome and capture Kalidjati. Invasions at Semarang and Rabaul. US Fleet finishes refueling and rearming and heads back to Kwaj. KB encounters a disabled AP in the night and retreats.

April 7/8 1942

Japanese capture Rabaul.

KB attacks Port Moresby.

Four Japanese divisions land at Semarang and capture it on the bounce. I'm just curious--did either side in the Pacific ever land four divisions in a single assault landing?

April 8/9 1942

Another curiosity: a full-strength, supplied, relatively-elite Chinese division defends with a combat strength of 0 at Toungoo. The KB fails to fly again. Has my opponent forgotten to reammo?

April 9/10 1942

Heavy combat but nothing decisive. KB invisible, which probably means near Kavieng. SS Trusty and AK Procyon lost.

Relief convoy for the Americal Division in transit.