Matrix Games Forums

ORIGINAL: GetAssista

ORIGINAL: brian800000
Conceptual question...how do you attack an island or other base outside of your fighter range? This is before a zillion CVEs show up.

If you have CVs/CVEs - move in with their CAP protecting the amphibious assault TF.

If no CVs in the theatre and the island is isolated - bombard with cruisers, they are faster than BBs and make holes in the landing strip just fine. Plus bomb the airfield with 4Es. When enough bombing/bombarding is done move in.

If no CVs and the island is just one out of several airfields in the sector - wait until you have CVs/CVEs.

Yeah, KB is lurking somewhere out there in all those scenarios and you have to do it fast. Unless it is 44+ and you have a Death Star already

I guess the moral of the story is that CVs need to be exposed to LBA? The exception being if all the airfields can be closed by CLs?

I guess the moral of the story is that CVs need to be exposed to LBA?

A JFB's wet dream. I wouldn't expose my CV's to LBA unless I were certain of two things.

1) No/few (WRT my own) enemy CV's were in the region.

And/or

2) I had overwhelming force.

Otherwise, fighting LBA from the sea is a losing proposition.

ORIGINAL: brian800000
I guess the moral of the story is that CVs need to be exposed to LBA? The exception being if all the airfields can be closed by CLs?

Yes, why not? Look through Allied AARs, they follow the same pattern in the 2nd half of the war - concentrate your CVs and cover invasions.
It's not like your amphib invasions are against size 10 Tokyo airfield, telegraphed well in advance to allow Japan concentrate its air. Islands are small, many of them are not even being built up so as to save supply and not give Allies a quick springboard later. In the Pacific theatre size 4 airfield is considered large. Also, LBA is not as effective against CVs compared to naval air.

LBA is not as effective against CVs compared to naval air.

Really? I always thought a Val was a Val and a Kate was a Kate. And let's not even mention the Netties.[:D] Eh, who knows?[;)]

ORIGINAL: rustysi

LBA is not as effective against CVs compared to naval air.

Really? I always thought a Val was a Val and a Kate was a Kate. And let's not even mention the Netties.[:D] Eh, who knows?[;)]

I suspect it's more a result of pilot experience shifting on both sides. Early in the war Japan has a tremendous pilot experience advantage. As the war goes on, many of those pilots are lost and replaced with much lower exp newbies, while new air groups that arrive for the Allies start with higher and higher experience levels. Japanese players will tend to collect their highest experience pilots in CV air groups compared to LBA groups, but even they will not match the high overall experience that Japan's CV groups start the war with. By the time of the Allied advance later in the war, they are just facing lower experience groups overall, more LBA rather than CV air as the Japanese player is more cautious with risking their CV's.

This is not a question, but something to share...I had a squadron of 12 torpedo bombers set to attack...which they heroically did, though tragically in range of enemy CAP. My own escorts didn't fly. All 12 planes in the squadron were lost.

Stuff like that happens from time to time. Check the settings for your escorts. If at 100% CAP they won't fly escort. If your escorts already flew then they will not fly a second time....GP

ORIGINAL: brian800000

This is not a question, but something to share...I had a squadron of 12 torpedo bombers set to attack...which they heroically did, though tragically in range of enemy CAP. My own escorts didn't fly. All 12 planes in the squadron were lost.

That's better than Torpedo 8 Squadron at Midway, so historically accurate.

ORIGINAL: Uncivil Engineer

ORIGINAL: brian800000

This is not a question, but something to share...I had a squadron of 12 torpedo bombers set to attack...which they heroically did, though tragically in range of enemy CAP. My own escorts didn't fly. All 12 planes in the squadron were lost.

That's better than Torpedo 8 Squadron at Midway, so historically accurate.

I'm not sure how they did better considering none came back and they didn't hit anything.

In reality, I'm guessing Torpedo Squadron 8 did better but was undone by malfunctioning torpedoes.

ORIGINAL: brian800000

This is not a question, but something to share...I had a squadron of 12 torpedo bombers set to attack...which they heroically did, though tragically in range of enemy CAP. My own escorts didn't fly. All 12 planes in the squadron were lost.

TBs have abysmally slow cruise speed, thus upping the chance of non-coordination with escorting fighters. See Devastator and USN Buffalo cruise speeds, and weep.

Okay, a new question…In part about hexside control and in part about mandatory shock attacking.

The AI has committed a very large force to the siege of Singapore, and it is not going to succeed. My strategy is to amphibiously land a force behind Singapore, and then move down the Malay peninsula to ultimately kill the besiegers as they lack supply (not sure this is possible against the AI, but anyway).

The hexside control question: if I attack Singapore from Johor Bahru, I would think that at that point I control the hexside between Singapore and Johor Bahru, and the AI army besieging Singapore would have no way out unless they take the hex, while I could move LCUs between the hexes at my discretion. However, until I attack Singapore from Johor Bahru, I can’t move my Singapore units to Johor Bahru, while the AI can attack me in Johor Bahru from Singapore. Is this right?

However, I know there is a mandatory shock attack when moving from Johor Bahru to Singapore. Does that apply even if I own Singapore?

ORIGINAL: brian800000
The hexside control question: if I attack Singapore from Johor Bahru, I would think that at that point I control the hexside between Singapore and Johor Bahru, and the AI army besieging Singapore would have no way out unless they take the hex, while I could move LCUs between the hexes at my discretion. However, until I attack Singapore from Johor Bahru, I can’t move my Singapore units to Johor Bahru, while the AI can attack me in Johor Bahru from Singapore. Is this right?

The rule is simple - you cannot cross enemy-owned hexsides from within that hex. So your premise is right.

ORIGINAL: brian800000
However, I know there is a mandatory shock attack when moving from Johor Bahru to Singapore. Does that apply even if I own Singapore?

If you have enough troops in Singers compared to Japs you will not trigger methinks. When in doubt, send small expendable unit first.

Thanks!

However, would taking Johor Bahru be enough to take the hexside and to trap the Japanese army in Singapore? Or does control stay with the last side to pass over the border?

ORIGINAL: brian800000

Thanks!

However, would taking Johor Bahru be enough to take the hexside and to trap the Japanese army in Singapore? Or does control stay with the last side to pass over the border?

Capturing the hex changes all 6 hexsides to your side.

ORIGINAL: brian800000
However, would taking Johor Bahru be enough to take the hexside and to trap the Japanese army in Singapore? Or does control stay with the last side to pass over the border?

You will capture all hexsides for Johore Bahru hex. But Singapore hex is different, and hexsides there are not affected by your capturing JB. Remember that each border between hexes on the map involves 2 hexsides, not one. Those hexsides are even drawn separately on the map if you look closer

Interesting...so if I capture Johor Bahru, I assume this means that supply is cut off from Singapore for me (and Malaya for the bad guys)...

But we will still be able to attack each other (the army besieging Singapore could lift the siege and attack Johor Bahru).

However, if I cross into Singapore from Johor Bahru, the besieging army is completely cut off and supply will flow for me between Malaya and Singapore. Further, the bad guys won't be able to leave without conquering Singapore.

Is this right?

I think you have it right, Brian.

But crossing the river from JB to eliminate the enemy retreat hexside will trigger a shock attack on your part, so make sure you want to do this.
While you have possession of the JB hex, his troops cannot retreat that way anyway. There has to be a valid supply path that his troops can follow and your troops block that at JB.

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy
While you have possession of the JB hex, his troops cannot retreat that way anyway. There has to be a valid supply path that his troops can follow and your troops block that at JB.

They cannot retreat if they lose a battle in Singers. But they can perfectly march from Singers to JB as long as their internal hexside is not controlled by the enemy. It's just that AI never does this kind of maneuver.

Presumably, crosssing back into Singapore would allow me to proceed up the Malay peninsula with less troops saying behind, and supplying them from Singapore.

It isn an interesting question for someone like me that has less than a full grasp of hexside rules.

Thanks everyone.