Matrix Games Forums

There will be a group of wargamers who love complex , details and historical and there are a lot of games out there to satisfy them

IMO this is not true - there are a group of gamers who want historical AND simple - but alas we only get one or other.

There's so much computing power in a PC these days that IMO there is plenty of rom for doing complex stuff in hte background and presenting hte player with fairly simple mechanisms at hte UI.  No-one has really tried it yet tho although IMO Guns of August is getting there.

Really that is actually very interesting comment ..
I find the Civil War and Napoleonics to be the best challenges .. WW I is very close in the same framework ..
Simple structure .. Very Tactical and also very hard to master .. The AI .. maybe in 1000 Years will be able to accomplish this .. [&o]
 
At least in Ire time ..
And there are lots of us who really enjoy the detail .. Thats why wee keep buying games .. To see who has the best .. Then wee play .. lol
To see who is able to really effect the actual mechanics .. [X(]   Problem solving hepls ..  [;)]
Oh Dear .. Was that my outloud voice .. [:'(]
IDG

Actually I consider WiTP Grisby only descent work.  I must however admit it is too complicated and slow for serious play.  I have and had a sincere desire to play that area but after a week or so I was really not anywhere in the game I gave up.  My fault in this case and not his far as I can tell.
 
SMK is correct I think many of us want historical and simple.  The solution is probably to allow players to turn on and off different factors.  Say you have no interest in supply you turn it off or let the computer handle it.  Same with air, navy building whatever.   This allow as much detail as you like without requiring you to really do anything.   I would say even all the player to change his mind and turn it back on or off. 
 
Not a WWI fan so I didnt buy Guns of August glad to hear it has a good presentation.  I did buy the one before it American Civil War blue and grey I think it is called.  I spent many days trying to figure it out and complication was just too much for me so I have never even completed a turn.  I play Campaign in North Africa consider one of the most complicated games made but it is nothing compared to Civil War.

Targul .. you ever play TSS .. BGG ..
Teerible Swift Sword .. SPI
Battleground Gettysburg .. Talon I guess ..
Excellent games .. And also WV by SPI .. Wellonton's Victory ..
IDG
 

In fact I just got AACW Blue and Gray , my attempt to involve with complex wargame

One thing I can comment at the moment , it is a complex game but without much micro management - the tutorial is very good in getting you into the game - though the interface need time to get use to

targul , you can try the Shiloh scenario ( 6 turns ) and there is a excellent AAR on this scenario

Cheers

Thanks Hero but I have put that one in the rubbish pile and I dont have sufficient desire to pull it up and look  at it again.

ORIGINAL: SMK-at-work

There will be a group of wargamers who love complex , details and historical and there are a lot of games out there to satisfy them

IMO this is not true - there are a group of gamers who want historical AND simple - but alas we only get one or other.

There's so much computing power in a PC these days that IMO there is plenty of rom for doing complex stuff in hte background and presenting hte player with fairly simple mechanisms at hte UI. No-one has really tried it yet tho although IMO Guns of August is getting there.

Hi @smk , just went to the Gun of August forum , read some of the AAR , look good , never have WWI yet ...is it a very complex game ?
tempted hmmm...already bought few games this month ..and the SC2 expansion is coming up ...sorry if this getting out of topic ..

Cheers

ORIGINAL: heroes99

well me and my buddies buy this game because it is simple to get into and fun to play

There is a lot of suggestion to improve this game which is good but please dont turn it into another WiTP which until today I have not even complete a turn after few years of buying it

Is not that WiTP ( War in the Pacific ) a bad game infact is a very good if you are the type for it , you can see from the forum , there a lot players who still play the game until today , just that I cant go to the developer and tell them please make the game simpler , less historical so that I can get into it

There will be a group of wargamers who love complex , details and historical and there are a lot of games out there to satisfy them

So let CEAW be what it meant to be and let work together to focus on how to improve the game in terms of reporting bugs / game interface and not trying change it to another type of game

Finally , yes I wlll be still playing this for time to come

Thanks and your input is valuable. The feedback we get from forums is not a random sample of the CEaW players since the most dedicated players are the ones that post mostly on forums. So, some ppl do 1000+ posts a year, some post 5 posts a year and some are just forum lurkers that read or not even read the forums very often. It is a balancing act really, if we were to please the hard core players that are more vocal we would get a better reputation on the forums but it would also mean more ppl leave in silence leaving a smaller but more niched game.

We intent to improve gameplay and fix balance and bug but not at the cost of complicating the game for the players (micromanagement) so opinion from the more silent masses just confirm this from time to time that we are on the right track [:)]

Think you are way off Firepower but good luck with that philosphy.

I believe people buy many of these games based on the posts in the forums. I certainly know I do. If the forum says it is too compliated I dont buy normally but if they say it is too definitely will not buy it.

There is a balance but it is not necessary to sacrifice a realism or simplisty or complication.

A better approach would be to allow players to determine the amount of complication they desire. Examples would be:

I want Amph allow them to exist. Make a build with benefits and disadvantages so they could be used or your present transports.

Have weather on the map make it optional.

Vichy give it units. Make it an option.

Diplomacy options.

I could go on and on but options are the key to gaining to most from both the game and number of people who will want to play it. This allows all players to choose historical vs ahistorical. It allows people who want to micromanage to choose the level they wish to do that at.

You nor the company should rely solely on your personal desire for simplisty or historical operation but instead you should attempt to satisfy all the demands of your customers. Now we all know that is impossible but the attempt is important.

Honesty in the company response is also critical to long term sales of your products. Example is the argument over playback. I was very vocal on that issue one which I still consider important but once one of you responded with the response that you could not do it because of an earlier design decision that was not changeable now I understood. I no longer complain about that issue but the first responses where really out of line. They implied you wouldnt do playback because you didnt like them but that was really not correct it was because you couldnt now do that.

So far I believe this company is on a good track for long term this game but for there future products being bought But as with all things there is still improvements that can make you more desireable.

I think what Johan trying to said is that they will try listen to every category of players instead of just focus on the majority

Meaning if there is 100 players vs 20 players on some subject , they will not just said ok guys ...we will do what the 100 players want us to do because we will be having better reputation and popular by doing so

I suggest why don't we just start a wish list thread and let players suggest what they want

Let the developer run through it and decide for themselves what things they want to change or add first .

If they decide not to change or add certain aspect of the game , let it be and it is not end of the road , things can be consider in near future

No point having argument like I want this vs NO I cannot give you this vs why you cannot give me this and so on

Finally I do agree on the point to make option available for players to choose the level of details but again here if this going to take a lot fo work , maybe you can consider making an expansion in future .

Again will like to say thanks for giving me and my buddies a lot fun with this game

Cheers

heroes99, I did not mean that we would neglect the majority. What I was saying is, we have to count each individual who bought the game, not just count those who post on forum or even worse to count the posts and letting those who post often have a greater say than those who post more seldom.

ORIGINAL: targul



You nor the company should rely solely on your personal desire for simplisty or historical operation but instead you should attempt to satisfy all the demands of your customers. Now we all know that is impossible but the attempt is important.

Mr Slitherine... my request

neigh, my demand .... trip to Ireland... my horse and I

wee fly... Neigh... wee cruise!

impossible? Neigh... the attempt is important

ORIGINAL: firepowerjohan

heroes99, I did not mean that we would neglect the majority. What I was saying is, we have to count each individual who bought the game, not just count those who post on forum or even worse to count the posts and letting those who post often have a greater say than those who post more seldom.

Hi johan , that what I intend to say in my post or maybe i did not express myself very well ..[:)][:)]

Bragh .. Ta Ire wee go ...
IG

 Hmmm, that was taken with such grace and good humor.[/align] [&o][font="times new roman"]  [/font]I am disarmed, sir[&o][/align]

The Ire will nay disarm ... Ever .. [:-]
More pointy units please .. [X(]
IDG

Ire was here .. [:'(]
IDG

ORIGINAL: ozarkmichael

ORIGINAL: targul



You nor the company should rely solely on your personal desire for simplisty or historical operation but instead you should attempt to satisfy all the demands of your customers. Now we all know that is impossible but the attempt is important.

Mr Slitherine... my request

neigh, my demand .... trip to Ireland... my horse and I

wee fly... Neigh... wee cruise!

impossible? Neigh... the attempt is important

I thought I drank too much!