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Eh? Sorry Helpless you've lost me?

That was a joke Speedy..

I meant this admin shield.

ORIGINAL: Helpless

Eh? Sorry Helpless you've lost me?

That was a joke Speedy..

I meant this admin shield.

Ah got you....that's just the Game Menu screen [:)]

Flavius - thanks for HQ tip

The units are free to move, but probably will not recover from their routed status on this turn. Routed units cannot march into enemy held terrain.

Also, the surprise turn affects Soviet movement rates and they won't be able to march as far as in an ordinary turn.

Speedy..a couple pointers here using your own screenshot.

First don't leave your Hq's (in yellow) in a hex by themselves so close to enemy units. If he moves adjacent to them, they will displace losing all of their mp's and on hand supplies for that next turn.

Next be watchful for getting too extended without flank protection. On turn 1 it isn't as critical since you have enough fuel for 2 turns, but a good Soviet player will do what they can to cut your supply lines by isolating your spearheads. The red arrows indicate where this could occur. Enemy units can always move 1 hes even if isolated so watch for that. Also in this ss it would be easy to reconnect the supply lines to those trapped Soviets making it harder for you to kill them next turn.

Andy

Thanks Andy. Good to know and learn [:)] Hopefully my Mark II play of this scenario will see an improved effort!

If you need more units to cover these gaps, you can break down some of your divisions into regiments, btw. This can be chancy in later turns and invite counterattacks, but it's pretty safe to do so on the surprise turn.

Great idea. Thanks. This is a great scenario to learn on as Axis

Andy, keep in mind that the Soviets lose control over any isolated hexes not next to one of their units, which makes it impossible for them to reestablish supply in the area north of 2nd Panzer group, but they might be able to reestablish supply through the swamps as you've indicated, although not using the path you're indicating, but like this (I've done it against the AI a few times, which also left the area wide open):

Pieter, that will depend on whether or not those routed units recover; they can't march into enemy held terrain in routed condition.

Speedy might actually be able to get away with this opening move as a result, but yeah, best not to take these sorts of chances.

Pieter
 
That arrow was just a generalized placement and a warning that gaps of even this width with no flank or route security can be reconnected. If there is a cav unit in one of those stacks then closing the gap is doable.

Pieter, that will depend on whether or not those routed units recover; they can't march into enemy held terrain in routed condition.

I know, but there'll be so many units in the marshes that the odds of none of them recovering are pretty small on normal. I've been able to close the gap even with the nearest stack remaining routed.

As this crude drawing indicates, the gap in the north shouldn't be too much of a gap as there's no way the Soviets will be able to advance 1 hex through friendly terrain, 2 hexes into enemy terrain (the chance is pretty much zero that they'll make the morale check for the second hex to begin with) and then into a ZOC hex on turn 1, nor is there a way the Soviets from the east will be able to pass through a ZOC hex and enter another one.

The crudely coloured green hexes indicate terrain the Soviets will lose due to being isolated.

Hi guys,

Interesting discussions [:)]

FWIW The Soviet's didn't regain any corridors and the pocket has been liquidated on turn 2 with 154,000 Soviet Casualties.

Interesting scenario. I played as the Germans on normal difficulty and lost as the AI won a minor victory. I was able to capture Minsk and wipe out 250,000+ Soviet defenders. I just ran out of time and couldn't capture the remaining VP hexes at the edge of the map.

If fortified and supplied the Soviets will defend tenaciously, but once the panzers break through and the Soviet units are cut off from HQ's and supplies they fold quickly.

Lots of little things to still learn. From what I've seen so far it looks like the German players will have a lot of fun with the Panzer divisions backed up by the motorized units-especially from 41-late 42. The Soviet player will probably be hating life early on, but I suspect they will get hordes of replacements to make u for what will be horrendous losses.

So far this is quite a bit of fun. Much different feel than WitP AE and I wasn't sure of how I would enjoy it, but it does feel challenging and fun.

The Soviet player will probably be hating life early on, but I suspect they will get hordes of replacements to make u for what will be horrendous losses.

You know, it doesn't yet feel as if those hordes are going to be sufficient.

Re: hating life... yeah, it's a pretty interesting feeling. The Axis can do whatever they want to you, during the initial period of the war. If they want to break your lines, they can. Their ability to do so will decline, eventually, but as a Soviet player you kind of just have to accept that you can only aggravate them, and never really deny a determined assault from reaching its objective. Woe!

I'm often enjoying playing the Soviets from turn 1, as even with huge losses, the Germans will slowly run out of steam whilst my forces become stronger.

I played Road to Minsk and never really looked at the victory conditions because I figured, "If you take Minsk, you win."  Well, I took Minsk and didn't win.  But I killed or casualtied well over 250K (that was by the 2nd turn.  I'm positive it was a lot more than that.) Russians, so it wasn't a complete loss! [:D]

This looks like a better and more secure encirclement, Testers?

Testers - what causes the losses shown in the loss summary after the Logistics phase? Are they purely attritional, breakdown's, natural deaths or are they also due to enemy interdiction/bombing? If the latter do you can you ever see their bombing attacks as haven't as yet (may just be since playing the first week of the war though against the Soviets!)
 
Thanks

Testers - what causes the losses shown in the loss summary after the Logistics phase? Are they purely attritional, breakdown's, natural deaths or are they also due to enemy interdiction/bombing?

The attrition/non combat losses are an abstraction, based on the troops numbers that are adjacent to Enemy controlled hexes, so in the early turns the Axis losses are quite high relative to the SU, but is does represent what you suggest - wear and tear, accidents, and day to day patrolling activity. As it is an abstraction, you do not see specific flights or fights.