ORIGINAL: Vincenzo BerettaYou mean: instead of making a constructive argument?
I was making an observation. The facts are out there, ASGI even admitted the PDB plagiarized the DB2000. Why not just admit it and move on? Ah, In too deep now to do that I see.
ORIGINAL: Please, cite? P.s. Re-gurgitating the same accusation isn't proof of a fact.
Well when I left HH was the issue, when I come back he is now just one of the issues, but they all lead back to HIM in one way or another. His hand was in them.
See above, this is not for debate. The proof is published
ORIGINAL: To condemn someone you need means, opportunity, and motive. You freely admit that you don't have at least one of the three but you still pass judgment, and this judgment is "guilty".
I gave the benefit of doubt at one time, but by his actions he left no doubt.
ORIGINAL:See how it is easy to fumble?
Fumble? that is funny. For those who love the game so much, it is strange the actions Y'all take.
That is complete crap, The DB2000 was HH property period. Property that I might add was plagiarized, but nonetheless, they could modify it in what ever fashion they deemed necessary.
For those that don’t know, a modification was made, a fingerprint so to speak, to prove a point. Not only did it finger the culprit (~PDB), but also the scenario rebuilder issue nailed it 100%. Caught red handed.
Knoweth thy protestith to much!
ORIGINAL:Many reasons. One is that he paid for the roller-coaster ride and the following booze for both when I was in Edmonton. You will find others further down. But the fundamental one is that every time I personally checked something Herman told me IT ALWAYS CHECKED
Checked? Ok I will humor you for a minute. PROVE that the fingerprint that was caught in the PDB was not there for all to see. Prove the scenario rebuilder was not used without permission. You see you cant because facts are facts. How do you check things, the answer has been posted and proven before, there is no reason to repost it.
As for the Poster, that is the operating methods he/you use. You promote stolen intellectual property. Period. The poster was probably unknowingly posting this, now he knows.
ORIGINAL:...Whereas I lost count of the attempts to smear him I was able to debunk by simply looking personally at facts (or at the lack of alleged ones). Some attempts were, let's say, marginally sophisticated, but none of them really held water after the most superficial of examinations.
Just so everyone knows:
pla•gia•rism [pley-juh-riz-uhm, -jee-uh-riz-]
–noun
1. the unauthorized use or close imitation of the language and thoughts of another author and the representation of them as one's own original work.
2. something used and represented in this manner.
ORIGINAL:Just look at this thread. Slanderous accusations that "Harpooner" was a fake identity just because he posted links to content that both he and HH and use. What's next? A lynch mob for the first foreigner who comes in town?
Not at all, but a Bull in a China shop can cause issues if not addressed. It has been the operating way of doing things for quite a while now. Being banned with his own name I would not have put it past him.
ORIGINAL:This is the gist of it all, in simple words, on a simple thread. Multiply it for 100.000: you will still get evil hot air on HH, and facts from either me or him or whoever bothered to look for them.
EVIL? What?
Once again
Just so everyone knows:
pla•gia•rism [pley-juh-riz-uhm, -jee-uh-riz-]
–noun
1. the unauthorized use or close imitation of the language and thoughts of another author and the representation of them as one's own original work. 2. something used and represented in this manner.
ORIGINAL:Let's say that I find the word "stooge" offensive - mostly because, as it happens, I act out of free will. Let's also say that I don't really care - mostly because the ones who whine about the "once fairytale community" are then also the very first to distribute slander and offences. Let's, finally, also look at some of these so-hated facts.
Well that is the way I see it, you defend him and his actions so therefore are by default and accomplice.
Fairytale community? Well gee; it was a pretty tight knit one until HH. Why is that? Divide and Conquer?
ORIGINAL:*I* own the site. It is mine, paid yearly with own money. So, fact is that I post announcements regarding new material uploaded on a site I own. True, once upon a time *my* stooge HH (if you really want to use the word), did this dirty work for me. Now, sometimes I do it, sometimes it is done by others.
So host stolen material with your money. It’s up to you.
ORIGINAL:Let's look at some more facts. I don't make money from the site. None. Not even from Google ads.
Well in one respect that is good, at least you are not befitting monetarily by hosting stolen material.
ORIGINAL:So your question could become "What's your motive?" and I would answer "The same that moves people who host mods and scenarios for other games published by Matrix".
This one truly puzzles me; if you like it so much why try to DESTROY it? Why be associated with such an endeavor?
ORIGINAL:Now we have established that I pay for a site that gives free content for a game without second aims - neither hidden nor guessed. What's the reaction of that faction of the community that considers itself "healthy", "righteous", "official", or whatever? Either denigrate it, or smear it, or both without giving a single, factual, reason (And, I could add, without even having a clue about who owns what).
Oh I think there are hidden reasons; I just have NO clue as to what they are. I have no $ stake in it. I helped with something I loved and hope to do again. I would not even consider trying to destroy it.
ORIGINAL:Are you really still asking why I usually side with Herman?
Ok , let me proposed you a hypothetical question. If you became convinced that the property was plagiarized, would you still act in this manner? Would you support him then so diligently?
ORIGINAL:The "because it is not true until proven and it never happened" answer comes readily to mind. However, I like more the "Never trust words, always check for yourself" tag line more [;)]
Give it a REST. It HAS ALREADY BEEN PROVEN!
ORIGINAL:I guess you have your reason. I also have one. Reasons are 234 for $59.99.
That should not bother you at all; I mean you pay with your own money to host a site with ill gotten booty on it.
ORIGINAL:This is wrong on at least three counts. First: there is no reason why a site should cease to exist just because a member, or even a cohort of members, is troublesome: just ban them and move on (which is, as you explicitly noticed, what they did).
I can see why, it is obvious to the most casual of observers.
ORIGINALSecond, the core of HarpoonHQ is still right there, only with a different name. I won't mention it because they came blaring about themselves some time ago on this board and Don Gilman didn't really like it. Third...
Look HH has moved on, I wish the utmost success for RED PILL. I wonder if they have asked for you or Herman’s assistance on it.
(((Now I don't care who you are but that is funny stuff right der!)))
ORIGINAL:..There is a game, out there, whose working title is "Red Pill". Think about this one.
Oh I have and see above....
Maybe they will let Herman make copies of the manuals?
ORIGINAL:BTW: if you really want to talk about the alleged "decline" of HarpoonHQ, don't forget to include stunts like altering the Database 2000 without warning to make third party scenarios crash. The whole stunt is
out there,
in the open. This got
me banned from HarpoonHQ. It happens.
Do you know why they did that? I guess you are right, they should have gotten Herman's ok first before they modified THEIR stuff. Geez..
ORIGINAL:...Which, incidentally, was also the reason why the need for a new DB properly maintained became evident.
Which is why the Plagiarized Database (PDB) was born. Good one!
Look I will not deny there are/were bugs. With a limited amount of bugs/people they were trying to fix it. They did not need to be bombarded with Bug fixes by the 100's. Some of course were good to know for the programmers, but I did not need to know the bathroom on my B-2 would not flush when there was a full moon. It became a GAME for Herman. Heck I remember that was going on when I left.
ORIGINAL:
[For those who don't want to click and read the whole tirade, here is the money quote on ANW from HarpoonHQ:
The developer’s horrible planning, their limited understanding of naval warfare, plus their poor testing has resulted in hundreds of newly introduced bugs that make the game unplayable. And it gets worse with each new release. The scenarios they ship with the game are not compatible with the game engine any more, and the database will not work as intended. The scenario editor has been released in a dysfunctional and untested state, and not even the AGSI ‘experts’ (uhm, right… LOL!) know how to use the ‘updated’ database editor. Version 3.7 and 3.8 are also far less stable than 3.6, and run considerably slower.]
Yeah yeah, so by the new version and use 3.63 and the old DB2000, oh wait you have your own version now.......
This is a nich game/sim. It does not have a million dollar budget like some. I have played ANW for 4 scenarios now and have not had a single crash, plus on a good note, my B-2's toilet flushed.
ORIGINAL:Please, note that I neither agree nor disagree with this - I'm simply reporting it along with the fact that it's HH who is usually acused of "actively damaging the Harpoon brand". Personally, I strive and hope for a better Harpoon, and I support those working towards the same end.]
Well if you do, and Herman does, it is time for this crap to stop. Admit mistakes and Move on, the community knows what happened.
ORIGINAL:This, I guess, allows for announcements regarding PDb's scenarios to continue - until the contrary is proven.
Well by all means go right ahead. I have an advertising slogan for you.
The PDB, the database for when you don’t have time to do the work yourself. Its the People's Database, Plagiarized for everyone!
ORIGINAL:BTW, you are not the first to make such accusations. It happens quite often on UseNet, too, at least
sparking debate. And Herman is always more than willing to discuss bugs and other deficiencies. I don't think I've ever seen him turn down an opportunity to discuss problems.
Nor will I be the last I guess. True he was very helpful etc at times. But judging the fruits of the tree, some branches yield rotten fruit.
ORIGINAL:This is why I am baffled why some people are so reluctant to ask him about these problems directly. However, I *can* understand how there is probably a component of fear in actually checking for the truth (especially when someone has already stuck his neck out so far in “judgment”… [:)])
Well he has not answered the Database fingerprint issues that were proven, he has not answered the Scenario rebuilder issue. So until he does that, I have no need to even listen when the truth is not spoken.
Disclaimer: IF it can be proven that I made a false statement, then I will of course offer an apology and retract immediately. In my mind the question of wether the DB2000 was copied was answered beyond a reasonable doubt. I personally did not witness the Scenario Rebuilder issue, but it was offered a proof because the ‘fingerprint’ was there.
