Matrix Games Forums

Jeremy,

The manual is so informative on this isn't it?:p

I still can't make any sense of this sentence:
"The number of items produced each week at a facility will be a factor of the Heavy Industry number and the production cost of the manufactured item."

And this exact same sentence appears in WEVERY one of the original manuals, I have them all right here.

Your suspicions are exactly correct on the effect of HI on overall factory growth, the big black hole appears to be what, if any, effect the HI in a base has on factories in that base.

Perhaps a simple test can be made by re-arranging some factories to produce planes not in any air groups and look at the totals built per turn. Take 4 plane types for each side, set the pools at all the same level, no air groups in use, all 8 plane types with SAME cost, in 4 different cities, with varying levels on HI from none to 150 or so (Eastern US), the same initial factory size. Look at the totals each turn. After a few turns the effect of HI on local production might be able to be determined as well as the effects of high overall HI (US) vs. low overall HI (Japan). We should also be able to find the cutoff. be it 20 or another number from fast growth to slow growth.

Hey, I might even do this myself, it sounds like fun.

Ranger-75,

I set up a special OBC41 to test aircraft production (this was how I could tell wether or not an aircraft type was under produced). In order to do this you must remove all aircraft groups (except carriers, which will give you a fixed aircraft group error) and remove all CV's (to get around this fixed aircraft thing).

However, you should leave your patrol aircraft still there because without them subs will run rampant, kill all supply and cause industry to suffer (thereby never letting you see accurate production!).

I don't know wether or not base size (port and/or airbase) base type (levels 1-9), or placing one of the factories at a 'home base' (those special bases on the Home Islands and West Coast that have populations as well as VP levels for capture).

There are a lot of factors to test here, it would be great if you could do this because there are countless other things that I have to do!

Thanks!

Jeremy,

It should be simpler than that, set everything to full human control, leave all the fleets at home, including the subs, base planes away from the front lines so they don't shoot at each other, and let it run human vs human for several turns. I can do it.

The thing is to set the data up first by "normalizing" the cost and production levels of selected plane types and adjusting the HI levels first. Then of course writing everything down - each turn

The heavy industry is pooled together.

Factory maximum size (apart from editing it bigger) is (15-cost). Heavy industry and shipyards have cost 3, artillery and armor I don't remember, but you can figure it out.

Bases 195-199 double the maximum size (so at those bases it is 2*(15-cost).

Factory always grows to 1 regardless of the formula. As long as the maximum size is at least 5, factory grows to 5 quickly.

If the cost is at least (or above, I forget) 7, growth is slowed.

Chance to grow depends on (heavy industry/cost), which is compared to random(1000) so that expensive items have smaller chance.

Once the factory has grown to maximum size, chance to grow is decreased 90%.

This is how it is, minus some details, since I don't have my notes here.

Mika

Using this in i tried the following changes:

1. changed to middle east to 160 and eastern us to 199

2. put 250 Shipyard in eastern us, 1 each in seatle, LA, San Diego, and Vancover. 20 in PH and 10 in SF.

3. put 158 HI in eastern us and 1 each in seatle, SF, LA, and SD.

ran the game for a few turns as allied( left all units alone). Shipyards starting incresing on the second turn and HI 3-4 turns into the game. left the game running comp2comp until about 4/44. Shipyards had grown about 12-14 points each( escept eastern us went to 251). HI had grown about the same.

as usual, this confirms that mika knows all.

Originally posted by Mika Väliviita
The heavy industry is pooled together.

Factory maximum size (apart from editing it bigger) is (15-cost). Heavy industry and shipyards have cost 3, artillery and armor I don't remember, but you can figure it out.

Bases 195-199 double the maximum size (so at those bases it is 2*(15-cost).

Factory always grows to 1 regardless of the formula. As long as the maximum size is at least 5, factory grows to 5 quickly.

If the cost is at least (or above, I forget) 7, growth is slowed.

Chance to grow depends on (heavy industry/cost), which is compared to random(1000) so that expensive items have smaller chance.

Once the factory has grown to maximum size, chance to grow is decreased 90%.

This is how it is, minus some details, since I don't have my notes here.

Mika

So, Mika what you refer to as "maximum size" the rule books are all referring to as "optimum size", correct? It makes more sense now.

Yes, once the factory reaches its maximum=optimum size, the growth chance is cut.

Also, the nonplanes (hvy,art,arm,shyd) might have different cost for the purposes of optimum size and growth rate, but I don't have my notes here.

I edited my shipyards in mid 42 to increase them by a combined total of 90. Its now Apr 25 '43 and they are still the same value. Are they supposed to increase over time and if so how often? Does editing them break this.

Also do new ships technically enter the game at the beginning or end of a turn (when is the production phase). I see the Essex and two sub groups sitting at TTA = 0, and I want to know if they should arrive before the orders phase on the 4.25.43 turn (and are being held up) or after the orders phase (so I wont get to see them until orders phase for 5.2.43 ?

And wow, I’ve only played about 5 games to completion and this is my only 3.0 game, but I've seen the AI do more dumb things this game than ever before. He set up combined fleet HQ on New Georgia, right next to an Allied Guadalcanal with a level 4 airfield. I sunk a couple CV's that were just hanging around the HQ. Then when the AI committed CV's to the battle in the Solomons he did it piecemeal with 3 TF's each containing 2 CV's. It was easy to get through the reduced CAP and take them out one at a time.