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RE: No difference at all
Posted: Tue May 29, 2012 6:06 pm
by Michael T
They are all called NKVD. But only a few were the political type, AFAIK. I have never read about any differences, but in games like FITE/SE and Barbarossa there is a clear difference, pretty sure it is mentioned in the designers notes somewhere. The Soviets disbanded the border units, but not the fanatical political types. I am saying the vast majority of border units were crap. This game makes them all super units. Thats the issue really.
RE: No difference at all
Posted: Tue May 29, 2012 9:51 pm
by notenome
true but the game contains only a fraction of the border units stationed by the soviet side. So I assume they are all the NKVD troops that defended fanatically.
RE: No difference at all
Posted: Tue May 29, 2012 10:44 pm
by hfarrish
Yes, these rogue NKVD units are such a game-killer...unlike 3000 man German regiments that can hold 30 miles of front or panzers that can launch 500 mile per week thrusts into enemy territory. I actually don't mind those things so much, but the amount of carping over this small element of the game is truly over the top. Like Flavius, I wish they would get rid of them to stop the ridiculous carping.
Like so many complaints like this, I have yet to see a single AAR in 1941 that shows the NKVD units being some kind of problem. True brigade spam in 42 could be trouble, but the NKVD? Laughable.
RE: No difference at all
Posted: Tue May 29, 2012 11:29 pm
by Aurelian
ORIGINAL: hfarrish
Like Flavius, I wish they would get rid of them to stop the ridiculous carping.
Eh, they'll find something else to carp about.
I know, get rid of all on map regiments. Both Axis and Soviet.
RE: No difference at all
Posted: Tue May 29, 2012 11:32 pm
by Ketza
Well they certainly used to be a pain in the butt but recently I have found them to be much more brittle.
RE: No difference at all
Posted: Tue May 29, 2012 11:58 pm
by Michael T
I must constantly remind myself, just forget about trying to get anything fixed in this game that detracts from the Soviet side. Even if its apparently a minute problem.
I apologize to the Soviet overlords.... forgive me masser... [&o]
For I have sinned... [&o]
[&o][&o][&o]
RE: No difference at all
Posted: Wed May 30, 2012 12:19 am
by 76mm
ORIGINAL: Michael T
I must constantly remind myself, just forget about trying to get anything fixed in this game that detracts from the Soviet side.
Feel free to complain, as long as it is about something important and which actually detracts from the Sov side.
Several Sov players have already said that they could care less if the NKVD units are removed entirely. But still you're not happy...
RE: No difference at all
Posted: Wed May 30, 2012 12:23 am
by hfarrish
You may be, but I don't see many posts commenting on the absurdity of German logistics and advance rates and begging for those to be fixed. Many, many Soviet players were in favor of fixing the insane blizzard and fort spam that actually made the game unplayable. But no one ever mentions this...no, all Soviet players do is shout down German players who focus on the REAL issues, like the 6 NKVD units that might stall a German advance for 1/128th of what it is able to achieve without them there.
RE: No difference at all
Posted: Wed May 30, 2012 12:51 am
by Michael T
Intelligent and respectful debate is no longer possible on this forum.
RE: No difference at all
Posted: Wed May 30, 2012 1:09 am
by hfarrish
Yeah, because your previous post with all the flashy little characters was the exemplar of respect and intelligent debate.
RE: No difference at all
Posted: Wed May 30, 2012 1:30 am
by Michael T
yeah and like I fired the first shot.
Edit. An unwarranted insult.
RE: No difference at all
Posted: Wed May 30, 2012 1:42 am
by NavalNewZ
.
RE: No difference at all
Posted: Wed May 30, 2012 1:50 am
by 76mm
ORIGINAL: Michael T
I apologize to the Soviet overlords.... forgive me masser... [&o]
For I have sinned... [&o]
[&o][&o][&o]
ORIGINAL: Michael T
Intelligent and respectful debate is no longer possible on this forum.
[8|]
RE: No difference at all
Posted: Wed May 30, 2012 2:01 am
by Flaviusx
Michael is an excellent player, but there's no mystery to his success. He's identified the major weak points of the Soviet side and exploits them ruthlessly. He understands that the importance of the first turn and leverages it to maximum effect. Back when mules where possible, he did those. He concentrates on force destruction with the idea that once the Red Army is gone, everything falls like a ripe plum, as per Clausewitz. He also, it must be said, goes into games with house rules that put all the chances in his favor, but if the Soviet player is willing to accept those, then that's their fault. I myself would insist on random weather playing him, a condition I am sure he would refuse.
RE: No difference at all
Posted: Wed May 30, 2012 2:16 am
by Michael T
But Flavius you neglect that I am prepared to play as Soviet under the same house rules/conditions. Which I hope Tarhunnas takes me up on whenever our current game concludes. A point you always leave out. A point that when ever I have included house rules (which have been in very few games I might add) I have always offered to play as Soviet under.
RE: No difference at all
Posted: Wed May 30, 2012 2:25 am
by Flaviusx
Heh.
"The law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich as well as the poor to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal bread."
RE: No difference at all
Posted: Wed May 30, 2012 2:34 am
by Michael T
[:D] You really crack me up dude. There is no hope for us.
In future, if anyone wants to know how I play the game just forward your query to Flav, he knows best.
I will be off now, I have a turn to do. Be nice
RE: No difference at all
Posted: Wed May 30, 2012 3:10 am
by Aurelian
ORIGINAL: 76mm
ORIGINAL: Michael T
I must constantly remind myself, just forget about trying to get anything fixed in this game that detracts from the Soviet side.
Feel free to complain, as long as it is about something important and which actually detracts from the Sov side.
Several Sov players have already said that they could care less if the NKVD units are removed entirely. But still you're not happy...
I haven't seen *any* "unbiased" Axis player complain about the reduction in Soviet command capacity for example.
Or the reduction of the Sov manpower multiplier.
Ah well.....
RE: No difference at all
Posted: Wed May 30, 2012 3:23 am
by Aurelian
ORIGINAL: Michael T
But Flavius you neglect that I am prepared to play as Soviet under the same house rules/conditions. Which I hope Tarhunnas takes me up on whenever our current game concludes. A point you always leave out. A point that when ever I have included house rules (which have been in very few games I might add) I have always offered to play as Soviet under.
All to easy........
ORIGINAL: Michael T
Seeking a Soviet opponent for the new 'Alt' 41-45 CG.
Server Game
Non random weather
Locked HQ's
FOW
Latest beta's ok
House Rules:
1. No Para drops beyond 10 hexes from the front line. No Soviet Para drops before the first blizzard.
*Warning* I use HQ Buildup in its various forms. If you don't like this rule give playing me a miss.
PM if interested.
Thanks
No offer here. But a stacked deck for sure.
RE: No difference at all
Posted: Wed May 30, 2012 7:39 am
by Tarhunnas
ORIGINAL: Flaviusx
Michael is an excellent player, but there's no mystery to his success. He's identified the major weak points of the Soviet side and exploits them ruthlessly. He understands that the importance of the first turn and leverages it to maximum effect. Back when mules where possible, he did those. He concentrates on force destruction with the idea that once the Red Army is gone, everything falls like a ripe plum, as per Clausewitz. He also, it must be said, goes into games with house rules that put all the chances in his favor, but if the Soviet player is willing to accept those, then that's their fault. I myself would insist on random weather playing him, a condition I am sure he would refuse.
I entered into a game with Michael and agreeing to the conditions knowing full well what I did and the possible consequences. Moreover, a forward defense strategy has served me well against all other Axis opponents, and I would likely have used much the same methods even if we had no "no-runaway" agreement. Michael is using a god strategy and very strong playing skills to good effect against me, and I am learning from that. I will likely adapt my strategy in future games as a result. Learning from playing good opponents is the best way to improve your own skill.
Edit: I meant to write a good strategy, not god strategy. [:D]