Matrix Games Forums

ORIGINAL: olivier34

Great AAR and the fate of the 9th panzer is scary ! Maybe some preventive airstrike against those soviets that had a good starting position to attack the 9th could have help...
Reading this AAR, I understand that my friend Keunert is having some trouble with his boss, mister Staline. He may lose his job and finish in a goulag of some sort. [:D]

ORIGINAL: balto

In my low skill experience with Case Blue, I see these results as typical. The Germans cannot win against a reasonably good Russian player.

What happened in the north to the 9th Panzer always happens. The Germans do not have time on their side, so they must relentlessly attack. It is somewhat easy for the Russians to hang back and strike a spearhead here and there (one to three a turn) while their replacements and reinforcement and entrenchment keep increasing. MY god the 5th Tank Army is a freaking monster unit!!

I predict the Olivier will be the only AAR where the Germans are successful. I believe that because Olivier's tactical understanding of the game's combat engine is freakishly great. He knows how to make penetrations into three lines of defenders and he knows when the defenders are weak. So barring his genius, I doubt anyone can win with the Germans.

I think the Dismissal option is great. It does not sneak up on you in the middle of a contested scenario. Based on Olivier's AAR, it arises ONLY when you have clearly beaten your opponent into a bloody heap. I therefore see the Dismissal Option as a great way to prevent someone from suffering for 20-50 turns in these super long scenarios. Someone like me that is not very smart, Dismissal would be a godsend.

Really looking forward to this AAR. Nothing against your opponent but if you combine the German disadvantage with bad luck in the weather on the first two turns, this one is already over unless you experiment and try some reckless maneuvers.

Really looking forward to this AAR. Nothing against your opponent but if you combine the German disadvantage with bad luck in the weather on the first two turns, this one is already over unless you experiment and try some reckless maneuvers.

ORIGINAL: balto

Most importantly, this AAR is organized fantastically. You start off with your HQ units, than their subunits, and you work from the North to the South. To me, this is super fantastic. Looking forward to your excellent battle (that you will win).

ORIGINAL: bwheatley
At least with this germany has some flexibility to experiment instead of living and dying on the rails setup by WITE. And i'm still on the fence about whether the game is un-winnable as germany. They have such a good experienced military and generals with awesome cards. I think a good german player will be able to win.
It will probably be like when WITE came out and german players had to learn how to win. It will probably be a little less dramatic than that but anyone who's had AT/ATG experience shouldn't be that far off.
Worst case we as the community can build a version that gives germany increased replacements or some such.

ORIGINAL: balto
I think the Dismissal option is great. It does not sneak up on you in the middle of a contested scenario. Based on Olivier's AAR, it arises ONLY when you have clearly beaten your opponent into a bloody heap.

ORIGINAL: jjdenver

ORIGINAL: balto
I think the Dismissal option is great. It does not sneak up on you in the middle of a contested scenario. Based on Olivier's AAR, it arises ONLY when you have clearly beaten your opponent into a bloody heap.

Sadly this is just not the fact. The Germans captured Voronezh by July 7 as you can see from this map:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c ... 942-11.png

In Olivier-Kunert AAR it isn't captured until around July 14. The Soviets also took terrifically high losses in June and July 42 leaving their armies in shambles and falling back toward the Don and Volga historically. So Kunert is actually doing as well as the Soviets did historically yet being dismissed. Furthermore I think Kunert is not necessarily losing the game. The Soviets start with only 25% of their total scenario strength on map. The battle has not yet even begun for Kunert.

But of course it's an option so you're free to turn it on in your games and have an ending forced on you and your opponent by the game rather than getting to experience the epic adventure that the full campaign game can bring.

I think you are seeing Kunert's Soviet difficulties and concluding the game is done - but on the contrary the real campaign has yet to begin because the Red Army builds throughout the scenario and southern Russia is vast.

ORIGINAL: Flaviusx
The weird thing about this Voronezh business is that it was von Bock who got dismissed in real life for getting sucked into a battle there. Arguably it shouldn't be a German objective at all. It may have even prejudiced the drive down the Don and ultimately Stalingrad.