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RE: MicroManagement Let's Play

Posted: Thu Feb 21, 2013 9:07 pm
by StarLab
ORIGINAL: Haree78

Thanks for this StarLab just started watching :)

More publicity for your great mod. :)

Funny part was the day I upload the first episode was the day Das started his recent LP. Both of us were featuring your's and Martians mods, so I left mine unlisted and gave his a week head start before publishing mine.

Told you about Das's in your thread at the time, but kept my mouth shut about mine - no promotion whatsoever. I was surprised how quickly people found it! Within 2 hours I had a couple viewers.

Dunno, just found that interesting. People are actively searching out DW videos - we need more of them on YouTube! [:)]

RE: MicroManagement Let's Play

Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 6:03 am
by Haree78
Thanks dude, yeah this is great because I get so little feedback about what works or what doesn't work in my mod I go completely by my own games and these kinds of vids really give me vision of what people do when they use the mod. Enjoying things so far, especially how you design all your ships and bases, give a lot of insight. Keep it up :)

RE: MicroManagement Let's Play

Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 1:32 pm
by StarLab
[center]------>>>>>>SPOILER ALERT******SPOILER ALERT<<<<<<------ [/center]
[center]If you're still watching - skip this post about the future! ;)[/center]



Okay, everyone... CUT!! That's a wrap people!! (Hollywood talk... [;)])

I brought this LP to a premature ending with a total of 40 Episodes having a running time of 21 hours and 40 minutes.

At that point I pretty much owned the game so I'm declaring it an 'unofficial' victory. I could have kept going but it would have gotten pretty repetitive: move in, exterminate, move on to the next planet. There really wasn't anyone left in the game strong enough to stop me. It would have been AT LEAST another 20 episodes (likely more!) to clean off the map for a proper victory.

Judging by the comments, I think I did what I set out to do - show people that micromanaging the game isn't the intimidating beast that most people believe it to be. Hell, if **I** can do it, anyone can! [:D] (Again, I'm not a pro at this game - yet!)

It was a ton of fun doing this and I will be back with more. I actually learned some new things about the game myself in the process so it was really a 2-way street.

Hope you enjoyed. Thanks for watching! [:)]

RE: MicroManagement Let's Play

Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 6:21 pm
by martok
Nice AAR, Starlab! Thanks for doing it.


RE: MicroManagement Let's Play

Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 7:39 pm
by Antiscamp
Man! I'm on episode 23 and now you spoiled the ending! [:D] Seriously, it's a great LP. I've learned quite a few things so far. I hope you do more of them.

RE: MicroManagement Let's Play

Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 8:32 pm
by StarLab
ORIGINAL: Antiscamp

Man! I'm on episode 23 and now you spoiled the ending! [:D] Seriously, it's a great LP. I've learned quite a few things so far. I hope you do more of them.

Sorry dude! I have now added a 'spoiler alert' to my post. [:-] (I dunno, I mean how many of us actually turn away when we see one of those? [:D])
ORIGINAL: martok
Nice AAR, Starlab! Thanks for doing it.

Glad you're both enjoying it. I've been bitten by the 'LP bug' and look forward to doing this again... soon! [:)]

RE: MicroManagement Let's Play

Posted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 8:31 am
by Sithuk
Starlab/Larry: Really enjoying your Lets Play. Well made. You're an excellent narrator and a competent player. I'm up to episode 11.

Resource Management
Great to see you focussing on resources: mining locations;optimising designs for available resources; discussing the strategic implications of resource availability. The resources are one of the reasons why DW is so interesting to play for me.

Tax
Good to see you setting zero tax rate until a planet pop is at max. The happiness implications for pop growth makes the tax rate such a powerful mechanic for growth. The AI's current tax strategies cripple them unfortunately. Hopefully Shadows will resolve that with more detailed tax policies that we can mod for each AI.

I notice you have some colonies manually set to 1% and 5%, instead of all the non-MAX planets at 0%. Are you using the tax rate percentage as an indicator of how many troops you have queued/built on a planet? Nice way to work around the deficits in the User Interface if so. Erik has already noted that troop management and planetary invasions are getting a lot of focus in Shadows, so hopefully a better troop overview screen will arrive with Shadows.

Passenger Transports
Have you considered editing the private sector Passenger Transport design to maximise their capacity? The private sector will build a set number of ships per colony owned. To maximise passenger transport capacity in your private fleet you need to maximise capacity on each ship, the private sector will not build more than a fixed number of ships per colony. By maxing the passenger capacity you can really kick start the smaller colony growth by getting your private sector to shift meaningful amounts of seed population from your larger worlds (and those of large nearby AI worlds with lower happiness, if you are allowing them in).

State Mining
Also, have you considered setting up state mining ships? You managed the chromium shortage well by other means, but if it was a more critically important resource or your were hamstrung by resource shortage your state mining ships could be useful in resolving the issue.

Starting Colony Spaceports
What about building a basic spaceport design containing the colony development/happiness bonus facilities (including commerce, medical and recreation facilities) at every colony? Do you not do that at the start because the zero tax rate and government bonuses mean you can achieve the max pop growth rate without building a starting spaceport at each colony? Perhaps something that you'd need if you didn't have one of the best government types right at the start like you did in this game, with all the excellent bonuses that Way of the Darkness has? Or perhaps you are conserving resources?

Cash use
I notice you are keen on sinking your excess cash into tech research. Specifically into defence related tech and not so much into resource collection / private sector transport related techs. Better mining tech, linked to better private sector transport capacity with faster hyperdrives leads to more resources mined and more distributed to your manuf centres. You can then expand your empire infrastructure and fleet without as many resource constraints.

The strategy of sinking cash into defence research makes sense if there are no bottlenecks on resource locations or private sector distribution. It makes sense to me because then the constraint becomes fuel. Higher defence related tech means more power deployed per unit of fuel expended.

I realise there is a trade-off point between the various strategies, I'd be interested in your views on where the bottlenecks lie in the early to mid game: is it mining rate; number of resource locations; private sector transport fleet capacity and speed?

I'm really looking forward to your next LP.

RE: MicroManagement Let's Play

Posted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 12:12 pm
by StarLab
ORIGINAL: Sithuk

Starlab/Larry: Really enjoying your Lets Play. Well made. You're an excellent narrator and a competent player. I'm up to episode 11.

Thanks. My gameplay does need further refining yet. Great reply here... I'll go through it point by point.
Resource Management
Great to see you focussing on resources: mining locations;optimising designs for available resources; disucssing the strategic implications of resource availability. The resources are one of the reasons why DW is so interesting to play for me.

Agreed. This is why I play such sparse maps. Makes the resource hunt just that much more interesting.
Tax
Good to see you setting zero tax rate until a planet pop is at max. The happiness implications for pop growth makes the tax rate such a powerful mechanic for growth. The AI's current tax strategies cripple them unfortunately. Hopefully Shadows will resolve that with more detailed tax policies that we can mod for each AI.

I don't wait until max population, but try to ensure that the colony can support its own space ports, etc. before adjusting the tax rate. I try to keep the population in the 'happy' range as much as possible.
I notice you have some colonies manually set to 1% and 5%, instead of all the non-MAX planets at 0%. Are you using the tax rate percentage as an indicator of how many troops you have queued/built on a planet? Nice way to work around the deficits in the User Interface if so. Erik has already noted that troop management and planetary invasions are getting a lot of focus in Shadows, so hopefully a better troop overview screen will arrive with Shadows.

Yes, initially all new colonies get set to 1%. When I build a space port I bump that rate to 5% until it's built. After that, any colony with a space port gets their tax rate set to multiples of 5% (25%, 45%, 50%, etc.). Any colony with an odd tax rate (11%, 33%, 47%, etc.) indicates there is no space port present.

It's a great visual tool that quickly helps me recognize at a glance what's going on. I touch on this in more detail later in the series.
Passenger Transports
Have you considered editing the private sector Passenger Transport design to maximise their capacity? The private sector will build a set number of ships per colony owned. To maximise passenger transport capacity in your private fleet you need to maximise capacity on each ship, the private sector will not build more than a fixed number of ships per colony. By maxing the passenger capacity you can really kick start the smaller colony growth by getting your private sector to shift meaningful amounts of seed population from your larger worlds (and those of large nearby AI worlds with lower happiness, if you are allowing them in).

I recognize this as one area of the game I really need to work on - and I have been since that LP. You will see later on that neglecting this DOES hurt me in the resource department.
State Mining
Also, have you considered setting up state mining ships? You managed the chromium shortage well by other means, but if it was a more critically important resource or your were hamstrung by resource shortage your state mining ships could be useful in resolving the issue.

Hmmm... Good call. Been getting hints of this from other forum posts so will give it a try. Although, with my chromium issue in this game, it was simply a lack of that resource in the first place (Only found 2-3 sources of it anyway). Would extra miners even help in that circumstance?
Starting Colony Spaceports
What about building a basic spaceport design containing the colony development/happiness bonus facilities (including commerce, medical and recreation facilities) at every colony? Do you not do that at the start because the zero tax rate and government bonuses mean you can achieve the max pop growth rate without building a starting spaceport at each colony? Perhaps something that you'd need if you didn't have one of the best government types right at the start like you did in this game, with all the excellent bonuses that Way of the Darkness has? Or perhaps you are conserving resources?

Hmmm... I usually hold off on space ports for new colonies, but you bring up a good technique here. Will give it a whirl...
Cash use
I notice you are keen on sinking your excess cash into tech research. Specifically into defence related tech and not so much into resource collection / private sector transport related techs. Better mining tech, linked to better private sector transport capacity with faster hyperdrives leads to more resources mined and more distributed to your manuf centres. You can then expand your empire infrastructure and fleet without as many resource constraints.

The strategy of sinking cash into defence research makes sense if there are no bottlenecks on resource locations or private sector distribution. It makes sense to me because then the constraint becomes fuel. Higher defence related tech means more power deployed per unit of fuel expended.

Again, yes, this would have helped this particular game later on. I normally play at a harder difficulty (more aggressive AIs) so defence does tend to get all the attention.
I realise there is a trade-off point between the various strategies, I'd be interested in your views on where the bottlenecks lie in the early to mid game: is it mining rate; number of resource locations; private sector transport fleet capacity and speed?

In most of my games (10x10 - 250 stars) resource and colony locating/acquisitions can be quite challenging. These two things alone make the early years my favourite part of the game. Solving shortfall and bottlenecks it what keeps me interested. (Even if I do it badly! [:D])
I'm really looking forward to your next LP.

I have a short 3-episode being uploaded today featuring Antiscamps Human Revolution Mod. (Showcases how to get your butt kicked in 3.5 years! [:D])

Beyond that I want to really look at fine tuning and implementing some of the points brought up by viewers, like yourself, who have been kind enough to offer their advice and ideas.

I still have miles to go and lots to learn and posting this LP has been instrumental in achieving a better understanding of the game. My next LP will be played MUCH better to due this.

Thanks for your great response! [8D]

RE: MicroManagement Let's Play

Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 8:31 am
by Yskonyn
Wow Sithuk, those are some really good suggestions / constructive criticism! :)

Is it always more efficient to go for optimization of resource gathering and private sector capacity first and then focus on other parts of your empire's tech with the benefit of higher mileage, so to speak, on resource handling?

RE: MicroManagement Let's Play

Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 10:02 am
by StarLab
ORIGINAL: Yskonyn

Wow Sithuk, those are some really good suggestions / constructive criticism! :)

Agreed. Tried a few things out in my last game. Noticed some pretty nice results too. [8D]

RE: MicroManagement Let's Play

Posted: Fri Mar 01, 2013 5:09 pm
by Antiscamp
I've now watched the whole series. It was a splendid ride, for sure, and it was interesting and fun all the way through. I learned a lot from you that I've noted I've been applying to my own game now too. Thanks, StarLab, for doing this LP, and I hope to see more soon, as I believe I've said. [:)]

RE: MicroManagement Let's Play

Posted: Fri Mar 01, 2013 5:22 pm
by StarLab
ORIGINAL: Antiscamp

I've now watched the whole series. It was a splendid ride, for sure, and it was interesting and fun all the way through. I learned a lot from you that I've noted I've been applying to my own game now too. Thanks, StarLab, for doing this LP, and I hope to see more soon, as I believe I've said. [:)]

Good stuff! Thanks!

Admittedly, things got a little disorganized near the end as I was intent on bringing the series to a close at that point.

Doing that LP has really made me sit back and review how I'm doing things. The comments that were made were great in pointing out some of my shortcomings and have already improved my game.

I will be doing another LP but likely won't be for a bit.

RE: MicroManagement Let's Play

Posted: Tue May 07, 2013 6:09 pm
by tylertoo
Larry: thanks for doing this micromanagement series. I have just started working my way through it in order to learn to play with automation off. I've only played DW with high amounts of automation.

I'm currently only on part two. I'm taking detailed notes on your approach. Its a great help.

You manually turn automation off on newly-created ships. At one point you say that players can set it so new ships arrive with auto off. How do you do this? Why don't you do this, if you want to micromanage?

Also, is there a way to get a pop-up message when a ship has no mission, so they're not sitting around?

Thanks!

RE: MicroManagement Let's Play

Posted: Tue May 07, 2013 6:36 pm
by Bingeling
There is an option page under the menu (hit escape in game, or look for a button up left).

That is the original game options. There you have on the main page a list of events and how to display them. Look if ship complete is one you can make more noisy.

On the same option page, there is a link to "Empire Options" or similar approximately midway through. This has some nicely hidden options for default stances, attack overmatch, popup suppression, and what you ask for - newly built ships starting automated.

RE: MicroManagement Let's Play

Posted: Tue May 07, 2013 10:54 pm
by tylertoo
Thanks Bing [:D]

RE: MicroManagement Let's Play

Posted: Wed May 08, 2013 10:57 am
by StarLab
ORIGINAL: tylertoo

Larry: thanks for doing this micromanagement series. I have just started working my way through it in order to learn to play with automation off. I've only played DW with high amounts of automation.

I'm currently only on part two. I'm taking detailed notes on your approach. Its a great help.

You manually turn automation off on newly-created ships. At one point you say that players can set it so new ships arrive with auto off. How do you do this? Why don't you do this, if you want to micromanage?

Also, is there a way to get a pop-up message when a ship has no mission, so they're not sitting around?

Thanks!
Thanks for watching! [:)]

I see Bingeling answered your questions. (Thanks Bing!) I did gloss over some things that I should have talked about more, I think. Although, I did get some comments from a few saying they preferred that I didn't explain every little thing.

RE: MicroManagement Let's Play

Posted: Fri Dec 13, 2013 9:14 pm
by Timotheus
This is the let's play which made me buy this game (ouch says my wallet) and from which I have learned the most on how to play.

Very well done.


RE: MicroManagement Let's Play

Posted: Sat Dec 14, 2013 3:01 pm
by StarLab
ORIGINAL: Timotheus

This is the let's play which made me buy this game (ouch says my wallet) and from which I have learned the most on how to play.

Very well done.


Thank you.

Always a pleasure helping a fellow gamer in emptying their wallet... [:D] (The same thing will happen with your free time also - GONE! Just FYI...) lol

RE: MicroManagement Let's Play

Posted: Thu Dec 19, 2013 4:56 am
by Timotheus
Thank you.

Always a pleasure helping a fellow gamer in emptying their wallet... [:D] (The same thing will happen with your free time also - GONE! Just FYI...) lol

It's 1:55AM here, you couldn't be more ... wrong...

RE: MicroManagement Let's Play

Posted: Thu Dec 19, 2013 9:00 am
by StarLab
ORIGINAL: Timotheus
Thank you.

Always a pleasure helping a fellow gamer in emptying their wallet... [:D] (The same thing will happen with your free time also - GONE! Just FYI...) lol

It's 1:55AM here, you couldn't be more ... wrong...

Only 1:55am? Pfft! Whudda Lightweight! [;)] hehehe...