Page 2 of 2

RE: Convoy system does not work

Posted: Tue Oct 20, 2015 11:51 am
by Extraneous
ORIGINAL: paulderynck

You state how much you are lending in the same turn it is lent, not the previous turn.

The convoy route owner(s) must adhere to: "If, during production (see 13.6 Production), it is possible for the promised resources (or build points) to be delivered then they must be delivered." Therefore, lends take precedence over transporting other resources, regardless.

Again, if you say a specific resource can be lent versus only announcing the quantity thereof, then provide a rules citation that supports that statement.

The rules for lending and rules for the starting Trade Agreements are the same, so this quote from the FAQ may help you:
Q5.1-2
Q: For at-start Trade Agreements, must the RP and BPs provided by JA, US, GE, and RU come from their respective home countries?

A: No, but they must satisfy rule 5., that is they must be delivered if possible. Example: After Russia has conquered Persia, Russia couldn't give the coastal Persian oil to Germany as part satisfaction of their trade agreement unless there were convoys in position to send them to Germany AND the owner of those transports is allowed, and agrees, to ship them. In all other cases the Russians would instead have to transport the resources by rail from the USSR to Germany directly.

Your example is for "at-start Trade Agreements".
5.1 Trade agreements

Germany-USSR
Japan-USA

It would have been better if you had included this with your example.

5. Lending Stage
Q5.1-5
5.1 Other than the Japan-USA Trade Agreement, are there any penalties for not shipping the appropriate mandatory lendings?

No but you don't have a choice, must means must and if for some reason you can't physically get them there you can't use them yourself. Date 05/07/2007

5. If, during production (see 13.6 Production), it is possible for the promised resources (or build points) to be delivered then they must be delivered.

5.1: Where possible, these resources (or build points) are transported by rail (…). If the recipient cannot provide the convoys, they do not receive the resources (or build points). 05/07/2007


Do you agree "to be delivered" means "you are able to transport it to a usable factory in that step"?


RE: Convoy system does not work

Posted: Tue Oct 20, 2015 3:36 pm
by paulderynck
ORIGINAL: Extraneous

Do you agree "to be delivered" means "you are able to transport it to a usable factory in that step"?
In the Production step - yes. Which is why a resource you think you might lend in the Lending step is not necessarily the one you'll deliver - since you must deliver the quantity of the type you promised, if possible.

5. Lending Stage
In this stage, you can announce that you are giving resources and/or lend leasing build points (see 13.6.4 Lend lease) to another major power on the same side this turn.

Which in turn proves you can't designate the location to source a lend when in the lending step, only the quantity and type of the lend. You might have a location in mind, but if that location can't be the source when you get to the Production step, and another location can be, than that's the one that must go.

RE: Convoy system does not work

Posted: Tue Oct 20, 2015 5:32 pm
by brian brian
It depends on what the meaning of the word "must" must be.

RE: Convoy system does not work

Posted: Wed Oct 21, 2015 2:29 pm
by Jagdtiger14
Or what the meaning of "is", is.