FIFTY SHADES OF WiTE: SILLYFLOWER V BRIANG

[sillyflower]

Indeed, that's his best option and I've done what I can to minimise his opportunities. He did that last turn as well as anyone could. I didn't put combat toggle on because that would have obscured the picture too much but most of the 'converted' hexes around the 2 pockets are my efforts to get more elbow room.

I don't think there is much anyone can do much better in the north and middle. Some get very slightly further in the north in particular, but that's at the expense of more russian units escaping. Pelton does that for example, but I prefer the opposite approach. You pays your money ...

[sillyflower]

Thoughts on T2

I apologise for not identifying heroic units/generals etc as some do, but the trouble with doing a server game at my advanced age (60) is that it's hard to remember those details so long after the event without being able to go back to saved games and I can't be bothered to write them down. I am, however trying to record my thinking at the time of moving as opposed to using hindsight to 'predict'later triumphs or to set up excuses for things that went wrong.

Pretty standard fare following up from T1[>:]. Not much forward movement in the south as there are so many Soviet units waiting to be herded into HIWIs. I believe it will be worth it, mainly in terms of weakening the enemy, but also I hope reducing the flow of reinforcements from south to north in the crucial 1st 2 turns when ground units are n't competing with factories for space on trains. It takes 2 turns to rail form south to north, and the Germans can get a long way if units don't start transferring until T3. of course, I may be wrong and Brian has started the move north, but there do seem to be more units in the south on his side of the front line than I would have expected if that were the case.

At least it's something different for Brian to worry about. I will be happy if he continues to fight forward as that will enable the well-supplied Axis to snaffle more Russian units. I don't pretend that there is a definable optimum formula for casualties versus territory, or a definable tipping point for the WiTE snowball to get rolling against the USSR, but the soviets can't sustain losses of 250K+ per turn for very long. What I do see in AARs is that low russian losses in the early turns, such as only 1 million in 5 turns, start to make it very difficult for the axis especially if the high quality units in the south escape in large numbers. Despite the popular saying to the contrary, more is almost always more, and snowballs can very occasionally be a good thing for the Germans to see[:D].

On the air front, Brian kept the red airforce in play. That cost him over 300 a/c in my turn to not very many, which makes up a bit for my apparently poor aerial effort on T1. Ground losses are 33K to 568K by the end of my turn, so his losses should be 650K or so by the end of his turn.

[Northern Star]

Does Brian bomb your airfields? With what results?
I need to find out a good defensive air strategy...

[sillyflower]

He did kill about 40 recce a/c on T2 but none on T3. I will let you have my strategy for stopping this in return for your giving me your T1 airbase bombing strategy

[Northern Star]

I think I'll wait patiently... Soon or later someone will bomb my airbases, I hope I'll have enough fighters and flak units in the right place at the right time [:)]

[chaos45]

I think the new rules in this patch has killed airfield bombing completely. I know when I play Soviets my most important bombing runs of the turn are bombing German units I intend to attack.

As winning ground combat is more important than smashing 5-10 average Axis planes on the ground with an airstrike.

This new change has pretty much ended the air war for the red airforce until maybe late 1943 or 1944 when your ground units can win with pure CV and dont need all the air support. All my new games im basically disbanding the red airforce in the early game and intend to keep it between 7-10k aircraft at most. 3-4 airbases per front thats it. Enough for fighter support and some limited ground support. Level bombers are now a complete waste of trucks and they were only moderately worthwhile before. In recent games I have disbanded 75% of the soviet level bomber force early in the games and dont noticed anything missing lol.

[Steelwarrior7]

Hey, great AAR - I am a noob - trying to learn the game for a PBEM from the German side - so I should not have more then 4 div to a corps HQ and I should even directly connect some to army HQs (12)? Or you mean inderectly through corps HQS not more than 12 to army HGS? What if I split divsions - does it have any effect?
Are you using leader replacements?
How do you adjust SU in details and TOE?

[SuluSea]

ORIGINAL: Steelwarrior7

Hey, great AAR - I am a noob - trying to learn the game for a PBEM from the German side - so I should not have more then 4 div to a corps HQ and I should even directly connect some to army HQs (12)? Or you mean inderectly through corps HQS not more than 12 to army HGS? What if I split divsions - does it have any effect?
Are you using leader replacements?
How do you adjust SU in details and TOE?

No disrespect intended Steel warrior but your questions are basic 101 how to play this game and is covered in the
war room many times over.
This thread here will help you learn much about this game. tm.asp?m=2984809



It takes quite abit of time to prepare and run an AAR . While I'm not his keeper, [:)]
I wouldn't be surprised if SillyFlower doesn't have time to explain basics
that are readily available to all who search.

Best of luck!

[sillyflower]

@ Steelwarrior -a lot of your questions are also answered in the updated manual. Generic qu's are best asked in main forum or the war room because they are the where you are most likely to get answers if you haven't found them for yourself. Happy to answer anything directly related to what I'm doing in the AAR though

[Steelwarrior7]

Ok - thanks all ;-D

[sillyflower]

Turn 3

In a feeble attempt to spark the reader's curiosity, I shall post the pics in reverse order.



11th Army, divesting itself of a couple of Romanian divs, clears the way for FBD2. Only token resistance met as the commies retreat in cowardly fashion to the next river line. The Romanians concentrate on shuffling forward and locking up the Lvov pocket, which Brian had broken again further north. Hence no effort to reduce the pocket this turn. Still, Brian did leave behind 1 inf div that could have escaped, and sent in a sacrificial cav xx, so not all bad.

[sillyflower]

South central






Finally locked down I hope. I inf xx and 2 A/B xs that had been trying to restrict my supply line in the Rovno area have been dealt with appropriately.

One strange event in that pocket. The cav xx in the pocket decided to rout out when I just wanted it to move back 1 hex. This was disappointing, until I realised that it routed to Tarnopol despite that city being in a pocket further to the west. Clearly, Soviet obsession with secrecy re maps can be a disadvantage at times, or maybe they are just desperate to become HIWIs.

[sillyflower]

AGC



A bit of a disaster. The lone isolated HQ that I had left all alone in a pocket just NE of Kaunas (see post 17 above), turned out not to be alone. It turned out that there was a routed inf unit with it, which recovered in Brian's turn and which he used to cut the rail lines just E of Kaunas.After practising my extensive Anglo-Saxon vocabulary, I had to send FBS 3 back to repair the damage. This cost me a whole turn of rail repair in the center which is not ideal. In the meantime, the recce pilots responsible for missing that division are now flying daylight recce missions over England. At least, they were the last time I heard.

Otherwise, just tidying up the battlefield (to use one of Montgomery's favourite expressions) and the armour pushes forward whist awaiting the infantry who are marching as fast as their little legs will carry them. The armour tries to balance progress with access to petrol.

[loki100]

ORIGINAL: sillyflower

Turn 3

In a feeble attempt to spark the reader's curiosity, I shall post the pics in reverse order.

consider my curiosity totally picqued ... [;)]

looks like Brian is very much of the mindset that costing you time/mps at this phase matters more than his own losses?

[sillyflower]

He wrote in his AAR (vs Pelton I think) that running was not his style - then promptly did it. It comes back to: where is the tipping point for losses of men/units in the early turns. The views of others on this issue are particularly welcome.

[chaos45]

Be interesting to see going forward...I think if he keeps burning up units forward like he is, he will be short troops to properly defend the Dnepr. His rail line cut in the center for sure cost you time tho.

Looking forward to seeing the north, as with all those units still tied up in the south his northern front cant be very strong at all.

[Manstein63]

ORIGINAL: sillyflower


A bit of a disaster. The lone isolated HQ that I had left all alone in a pocket just NE of Kaunas (see post 17 above), turned out not to be alone. It turned out that there was a routed inf unit with it, which recovered in Brian's turn and which he used to cut the rail lines just E of Kaunas.After practising my extensive Anglo-Saxon vocabulary, I had to send FBS 3 back to repair the damage. This cost me a whole turn of rail repair in the center which is not ideal. In the meantime, the recce pilots responsible for missing that division are now flying daylight recce missions over England. At least, they were the last time I heard.

Otherwise, just tidying up the battlefield (to use one of Montgomery's favourite expressions) and the armour pushes forward whist awaiting the infantry who are marching as fast as their little legs will carry them. The armour tries to balance progress with access to petrol.

The Great and all powerful Sillyflower has made a mistake, there is hope for me yet.
Manstein63

[sillyflower]

ORIGINAL: Manstein63

there is hope for me yet.
Manstein63

Don't be silly

[sillyflower]

Now to the North. My plan was to pin Brian in the south, to make it easier up here by minimising the flow of reinforcements up here in the early turns.



Whether it was a result of my cunning plan or the reduction in the number of troops either side can rail, or both, the plan seems to be working. Recce showed that Pskov appeared to be empty apart from an already routed unit.My panzers were well gassed (thanks to having held them back on T2) and I suspect Brian underestimated how far they could go. Luckily Morvael's .07 hotfix meant that cities were no longer dense terrain, making the assault relatively easy for Manstein's corps as the only defender was the inf xx I had just kicked out of the fort to the west of Pskov. For once, the Luftwaffe did not lie. I had petrol to spare to clear the area near Pskov to make it very difficult for Brian to hug me too closely: not that he seems to have much there. I think the inf div visible in the the marsh is the 1 that started off in the fort W of Pskov.

I normally hope to take or surround Pskov on T4 or T5 with the hope of getting a bridgehead across the Neva on T7. This is the first time I've done it on T3, and a rare error by the great and all powerful Brian G.

As an aside, I notice that some AAR authors criticise their opponents directly. I do not agree with this for 2 reasons. Firstly, it seems a bit rude, especially when the opponent can't answer back because he is barred from the AAR. More importantly, if you say your opponent is useless, then you don't get much credit for winning. The Pathans have a saying 'you can measure the status of a man by the status of his enemies'. There are ways of critiquing one's opponent's play in a more subtle manner, and you can probably rely on someone else to say that your opponent is an idiot so you don't need to.

[timmyab]

ORIGINAL: sillyflower
He wrote in his AAR (vs Pelton I think) that running was not his style - then promptly did it.

Excellent tactic! Classic art of war. Sun Tzu would be proud.

ORIGINAL: sillyflowerIt comes back to: where is the tipping point for losses of men/units in the early turns. The views of others on this issue are particularly welcome.

This is the real art of playing the Soviets in the early game. How much can you delay and frustrate the Axis player without getting your ass handed to you. It's a fine line to tread and success requires a good understanding of Axis capabilities.