Matrix Games Forums

AndrewJ,

Thank you for such great write-ups! I really appreciate that you explain your thinking behind your actions. It helps me program the AI behavior when I know how people approach a situation.

ORIGINAL: AndrewJ

Assorted observations:

The NATO SAMs seem to be all set to fire at maximum range, which means that when they engage fighters the fighters can often just turn aside and fly out of range before the SAM can get there. This is particularly true of the long-range Patriots with their longer flight time. I'd recommend using their WRA to turn down the engagement range against fighters, so the SAM engagements happen within the no-escape zone. This sacrifices some range, but also means that shots will always have a chance to hit, instead of being easily outrun.

This is good advice, and something I should be doing with all my scenarios...

The Pilica sub hunters (as mentioned in an earlier post) have an extremely small amount of fuel in the database, and will run out in just over half a day or so. Some other unit would be needed to provide escort.

Yes, I should do that. <Laziness levels rising...>

I'd suggest the high-altitude visitor be set to have active emissions only on station. I have to admit I didn't even notice the Rygge airbase, but the moment that airplane took off with its radar turned on my ESM assets picked it up and I had plenty of warning to deal with it. I might not have noticed it until much too late if it had remained silent until it arrived on station.

This is a good idea.

I don't know if you'd want to consider making Vaerlose a multi-unit airbase? It's the closest airbase to the objective, and the most likely to be attacked by the player. I was actually in a position to make a useful attack on it a few times, and multi-unit airfields are more realistic in those circumstances. I think an attack would be less likely on the other fields (although I was over them too).

After my own playthrough I thought the same thing. However, I found that by the time I was ready to attack it all the fighters there were dead. So it does give the player something to do, but it doesn't really impact the outcome. Then I started thinking about deleting the existing base, importing the multi-unit base, adding the aircraft, adding the munitions to the various weapon shelters... <WARNING! Laziness levels have exceeded safe limits!>

I liked the AWACS patrolling with a strong escort and jammer, safely behind the heavy SAM belt. Very realistic, and a real all-seeing pain in the posterior, until I could devote enough resources to defeat the Baltic CAP, make a hole in the SAMs, and send an entire squadron to deal with the escorts. Once that was done, however, the next two flew to their doom. Is there any way to prevent the next ones launching while there are enemy fighters in the area?

I'm glad you liked it, because I almost didn't add it... [:D]

I was sorta hoping that people would see the line of SAMs and fighters and just think "not worth it". I'm glad someone tried going after them and being successful. There is probably a really complicated way of keeping the AWACS and jammers from launching, but it would be really difficult to program, and it would likely be really "fragile" and quick to fail to work properly.

Thanks again for another great scenario!

I'll keep creating them if you keep writing these AARs!

Yokes

I have problems with minesweepers reaching the target area, as in only one got through enemy ASMs. Once it was on station, I did not have much problem with it sweeping the area except for minesweepers are only good for maybe ten mines max. Then, the damage of mines blowing up gets to them eventually. Since I did most sweep with helos (which I kept on the ground until I got air superiority), the lackluster life-endurance of minesweeper ships was not a problem.

Yokes,

As far as delaying AEW launch, if you just have a trigger to disable the mission once fighter aircraft are in certain area (somewhere past SAM barrier, so they are actually a threat), then put AEW/JAM mission on "inactive" status temporarily. I believe this will have the effect of aircraft currently in the air just staying where they are (which is OK) and new aircraft will be duly readied but not launched. Then, once enemy fighters are not in the area, turn back the mission (to active). The side effect is escort will also be disabled and just loiter there lazily and no replacements launched, but if you have a separate missions for backyard CAP/escort that would not be a problem.

I did not have the specific problem of AEW launching replacements into my field of fire, but NATO version has similar problem of launching minesweeper helicopters when my fighters are about just overhead.

AlexGGGG,

I thought about that, but I am concerned that a single fighter going in and out of the zone will cause the mission to be enabled/disabled a bunch of times in a short period of time. I am not sure how the game would handle that. Have you tried this?

Yokes

I never tried this on script, but in manual application this is not a problem. Even if the mission will jiggle on/off, the outside behavior will be fairly smooth.

When the mission is inactive,

1. new courses are not plotted (aircraft goes to its last plotted waypoint and orbits there because there is no further order),
2. new aircraft is not launched.
3. bingo fuel aircraft is returned to their assigned base as usual.
4. firing orders are not issued, for, say AAW patrol (and SARH missiles inflight are aborted)

when the mission goes active
1. the courses are plotted from whatever current positions are, to random points inside the now-current patrol zone (in cause patrol zone is defined by movable refpoints and moved while the mission was inactive)
2. new aircraft are launched if not enough aircraft are on station and there is something ready to launch
3. if there is enemy in a range of fire and RoE is satisfied, firing orders are issued and firing commences straight away

In case of AAW or whatever other mission requiring SARH, there is a problem - each time ON/OFF loop is triggered, all SARH missiles in flight are discarded, and new ones are launched, expending missiles faster than optimal. However, in your case it is AEW, and it's only mission is to loiter around. Which it will happily do, I just tested by jiggling it manually.

AlexGGGG,

I was thinking about implementing the enable/disable based upon nearby fighters, and I ran into something that I think is a problem, but I wanted to get your (or anyone else's) opinion.

I was planning on implementing a "unit enters area" trigger to disable the mission and a "unit enters area" with the "not" setting checked for the enable trigger. However, the enable trigger event would be firing continuously during the vast majority (or all of) the scenario. This bothers me, since I usually play with the events displayed (for troubleshooting).

Do other folks play with the events displayed?

Yokes

Oh. Yes, I do play with events displayed. Shame on me, but the last time I tried to disable it, I was not able to find how

I usually do have them on for troubleshooting also.

Greetings all!

Recent convert to C-MANO, I thought I should add my experiences regarding this mission;
I should state beforehand that I enjoy the challenge of managing WP forces where no mistakes are allowed due to technological inferiority in general.
In true Communist language there we go:


From: The Defence Commissar
To: Members of Politbureau
Urgent

Comrades,
Over the last 2 years, the imperialists are applying a strategy of soft blockade to our Baltic forces.
As a result, exporting the benefits of socialism to Latin America and Africa has been limited.
Despite our peaceful requests, they keep imposing tighter measures. Only recently, we were denied access to our peaceful Northern Pole exploring WP force on unsubstantiated grounds.

Comrade General Secretary has given the following orders:

Within 48 hours, a full brigade of WP peacekeeping forces should be based in Koge to guarantee safe passage of our forces in the future.

Hostilities started 2 hours earlier and major highlights are the following:

South Sector:
Groups of MIG-21s (6 instead of 4) are patrolling the airports and SAM sites.
Most of the SAM sites have been set on passive mode forcing the NATO F-4G to get closer to our S300 and fall prey of our MIG29¡¦s &MIG27¡¦s that are patrolling closely to our coastal radars.
A flight of courageous MIG27 pilots attempted to bypass and sneak on the back of the NATO forces from the most Southern route. Unfortunately 5/6 where shot down from a HAWK SAM site.
The Sixth though, achieved to bypass and came up front an EC-130 which was jamming the entire sector. The heroic pilot, true to his socialist training, sacrificed himself and managed to shoot it down before being shot down from an unknown salvo of missiles. He did manage to acknowledge the presence of a nearby AWACS. His family will be awarded a state pension and a double meat provision for a month.

Middle Sector:
Numerous groups of F-16 and F-4¡¦s tried to get to our shores but they fell victims of our MIG29¡¦s patrolling the area and the SU-27¡¦s that arrived on time. The combination of their exceptional radar and massive load of state of the art AA-10¡¦s proved to be far superior and capable of sending them burning down in the sea.
Northern Sector
Despite their numerous launches from their northern airbase , and thanks to the apparelled heroism of our SU-22¡¦s pilots, the fort and Hawk battery have practically ceased to operate properly. A follow up flight is on its way to finish them off while helicopters with towed arrays are on their way to clean up the area from mines.
Unfortunately, during the early stages of the operation, a lone F-16 managed to sneak from the North practically replicating what our MIG-27 did in the South. A Tu-16 and 5 helicopters fell victims of his missiles and guns before a group of SU-27¡¦s coming from motherland launched a salvo of 6 missiles and terminated his activities.
Meantime, we have established a patrol area where everything that is below the sea surface and makes a wave or noise is to be attacked first and be questioned later. 2 NATO submarines are lying already on the seabed and additionally the proletariats that live by the sea will get to enjoy loads of freshly torpedoed tuna ļ
Next steps are to establish a permanent CAP in the North, defend our Southern sector and deal with the NATO fleet.
While a number of Generals believes that the involvement of Danish forces and minor US forces (F-4s) is a sign of NATO weakness and that they will not push back, our intelligence services estimate that we are yet to see the full reaction of German, British and American forces.
Flights of Mig31¡¦s have been assigned sectors and groups of Mig29¡¦s are on standby to replace or supplement the 21¡¦s &27¡¦s
Notes:
I am moving everything that fires missiles from the far eastern end assigning them bases nearest the front. What I lose in loadouts, I can earn in multiple and quicker exits.
Anything older than MIG29 is flying in groups of 6
I am not experienced in submarine warfare and given the tight time limits, I am ordering attacks to anything that is spotted in the sea.
Will try and equip a flight of Mig21 with rockets and try to attack the radar station in the West. Need first though to clean-up the Northern sector and all my EW capable planes are there.
Just spotted a Patriot battery !! It keeps getting better and better!

P.S.
Definitely this one goes in my top3 scenarios list. Many thanks for your hard work. Much appreciated

Current EXPENDITURES :
SIDE: Warsaw Pact

===========================================================




LOSSES:

-------------------------------

5x Be-12PL Mail

10x MiG-23ML Flogger G

2x MiG-29 Fulcrum A

1x Su-17M-3 Fitter H

4x Su-22M-4K Fitter K

1x Su-27P Flanker B

1x Su-27S Flanker B

1x Tu-16P Badger L







EXPENDITURES:

------------------

2x 23mm Gsh-6-23 [50 rnds]

32x 30mm NR-30 x 2 Burst [20 rnds]

78x AA-10 Alamo A [R-27R, MR SARH]

44x AA-10 Alamo B [R-27T, MR IR]

46x AA-10 Alamo C [R-27RE, LR SARH]

15x AA-11 Archer [R-73]

46x AA-7 Apex C [R-24R, SARH]

10x AA-8 Aphid [R-60TM]

31x AA-9 Amos [R-33, SARH]

9x APR-2 Orlan-M

5x AS-12 Kegler [Kh-25MP, ARM]

6x AS-14 Kedge [Kh-29T]

4x AT-1M [NATO E45-75A]

23x Generic Chaff Salvo [4x Cartridges]

2x Generic Chaff Salvo [5x Cartridges]

10x Generic Flare Salvo [2x Cartridges, Single Spectral]

5x Generic Flare Salvo [3x Cartridges, Single Spectral]

8x Generic Flare Salvo [4x Cartridges, Single Spectral]

3x RGB-NM-1 [Passive Omni]

10x SA-12a Gladiator [9M83]

10x SA-2f Guideline Mod 1 [S-75M2 Volkhov, 5YA23 / V-759]

7x SA-5c Gammon [5V28M5]










SIDE: NATO

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LOSSES:

-------------------------------

3x BR.1150 Atlantic 1

39x F-16A Falcon

3x F-4E Phantom II

12x F-4G Phantom II [Wild Weasel V]

3x M192 I-HAWK

2x Radar (AN/FPS-6A HF)

3x Radar (Coastal)

1x Radar (THD-1955 MPR)

3x S 192 U 13 [Type 206A]







EXPENDITURES:

------------------

6x 20mm/85 M61A1 Vulcan Burst [100 rnds]

2x AGM-88A HARM

74x AIM-7F Sparrow III

38x AIM-9L Sidewinder

2x Generic Acoustic Decoy

127x Generic Chaff Salvo [5x Cartridges]

53x Generic Flare Salvo [3x Cartridges, Single Spectral]

14x MIM-104A Patriot

52x MIM-23C I-HAWK










SIDE: NATO AEW

===========================================================




LOSSES:

-------------------------------

1x EC-130H Compass Call







EXPENDITURES:

------------------

4x AIM-7M Sparrow III










SIDE: WP Marines

===========================================================




LOSSES:

-------------------------------







EXPENDITURES:

------------------










SIDE: Neutrals

===========================================================




LOSSES:

-------------------------------

4x Biologic Tuna Fishes

2x False Contact (Small)