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RE: Disappearing ship wrecks in Indonesia
Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2017 8:33 am
by Zorch
Illegal salvage is also a problem in the North Sea. In 'Jutland 1916: The Archaeology of a Naval Battlefield' the author shows pictures of damage to Jutland wrecks.
All but 2 of the ships sunk there have been identified.
RE: Disappearing ship wrecks in Indonesia
Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2017 4:08 pm
by mind_messing
EDIT: Nvm
RE: Disappearing ship wrecks in Indonesia
Posted: Wed Mar 01, 2017 2:57 pm
by crsutton
ORIGINAL: SheperdN7
Pure ignorance is all it is. I get how the population and government may hate the Dutch colonials for essentially subjugating them but still... Do they honestly believe life under the Rising Sun would be (or was) any better?
I seriously doubt they do, but the Dutch were there for a hundred years or more and tried to reestablish control by force after the Japanese left. I don't suppose that there is much fondness for either, but the Dutch footprint is more embedded in local memory. I recommend you read up on Dutch Colonial expansion. They, along with the French and Portuguese proved to be unusually harsh and brutal colonial masters. The British, Australian and even the Germans at were a little more paternal-though that does not mean that they were wonderful.
As for the ships. The urge to salvage is really driven by economics. Pretty hard to reign that in.
RE: Disappearing ship wrecks in Indonesia
Posted: Wed Mar 01, 2017 3:42 pm
by warspite1
The whole linking of this with the colonial past is just missing the point imo. This is human nature, this is greed, this is people from a poor country doing what they can - simply, this is money talks and.....
Is there really a "Oooh I really hate the Dutch, lets dismantle their war graves - and the British and Aussies and Americans too - in a really costly and tricky maritime operation" type scenario going on?? No.
Sure, the fact that these are foreign nations ships may mean that there is more chance of a blind eye being turned, but its not the main driver. As was said above, this problem (on a smaller scale) affects other wrecks in the North Sea too. Where there is money to be made there will be people that ignore the law.
RE: Disappearing ship wrecks in Indonesia
Posted: Wed Mar 01, 2017 4:28 pm
by Chickenboy
ORIGINAL: warspite1
Is there really a "Oooh I really hate the Dutch, lets dismantle their war graves - and the British and Aussies and Americans too - in a really costly and tricky maritime operation" type scenario going on?? No.
I agree. Only thing going on here is greed and pocket lining. The only question in my mind is how complicit the Indonesian military and / or government is in these activities.