Matrix Games Forums

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

Other missions will fly from a Level 1 airfield, like recon, nav search and I think 1EB. But LRCAP and sweeps won't.

Escorts?

Fred

ORIGINAL: jagsdomain

ORIGINAL: Richard III

Move 1 or better 2 0f the US Volunteer P-40 Sq. to Rangoon, set at 50%+/- CAP, set them above the incoming strikes altitude, set range to 0. They will decimate even the elite Naval Zero sweeps.

I can send 1 but not the other 2. I will set it to 0 but what about the other units 4 hex away. Why will they not engage?

The other 2 have restricted China HQs. If you want to move them to somewhere that is not China then you will have to change to a different HQ.

What I have not yet seen anyone state is that CAP has a default range of 3 hexes unless you restrict the range of the unit as some one above suggested by setting it to zero.

With range set to zero it will fly CAP only over its own base. With range set to whatever is normal for the unit, it will fly CAP three hexes out from its base.

To get any CAP over a hex at a range of 4 hexes the units have to be set to LRCAP, or Long Range CAP. They will only fly over the target hex or Task Force.
LRCP has diminishing return they further away the target hex is from the squadron base hex.

No squadrons at Rangoon flying CAP will ever cover anything 4 hexes from Rangoon.

ORIGINAL: HansBolter

What I have not yet seen anyone state is that CAP has a default range of 3 hexes unless you restrict the range of the unit as some one above suggested by setting it to zero.

With range set to zero it will fly CAP only over its own base. With range set to whatever is normal for the unit, it will fly CAP three hexes out from its base.

To get any CAP over a hex at a range of 4 hexes the units have to be set to LRCAP, or Long Range CAP. They will only fly over the target hex or Task Force.
LRCP has diminishing return they further away the target hex is from the squadron base hex.

No squadrons at Rangoon flying CAP will ever cover anything 4 hexes from Rangoon.

Really? Even if you have it set to 6 which is the range.
I thought long range would be beyond the 6 hex limit.

Think about it - the CAP does not know which direction the attack will come from so it will disperse in a circle at the range set. At range 3 or 120 NM, a squadron of 33 aircraft at 100% CAP would be thin indeed - that's an area of about 10,000 Square NM. At range 6 (240 NM) the area to be covered would be over 45,000 Sq. NM. So it seems likely the developers restricted the CAP radius to something worthwhile calculating for odds of an interception. I never set CAP more than one hex - you can't detect the incoming raid anyway.

ORIGINAL: jagsdomain

ORIGINAL: HansBolter

What I have not yet seen anyone state is that CAP has a default range of 3 hexes unless you restrict the range of the unit as some one above suggested by setting it to zero.

With range set to zero it will fly CAP only over its own base. With range set to whatever is normal for the unit, it will fly CAP three hexes out from its base.

To get any CAP over a hex at a range of 4 hexes the units have to be set to LRCAP, or Long Range CAP. They will only fly over the target hex or Task Force.
LRCP has diminishing return they further away the target hex is from the squadron base hex.

No squadrons at Rangoon flying CAP will ever cover anything 4 hexes from Rangoon.

Really? Even if you have it set to 6 which is the range.
I thought long range would be beyond the 6 hex limit.

No matter what the range of the fighter is, and some later war Allied fighters have considerable normal range, CAP is hard coded for a maximum range of three hexes.

BBfanboy provided a good explanation of why.

This is why the game has the LRCAP function for providing air cover at ranges beyond normal CAP range.

Thanks everyone!

ORIGINAL: HansBolter

ORIGINAL: jagsdomain

ORIGINAL: HansBolter

What I have not yet seen anyone state is that CAP has a default range of 3 hexes unless you restrict the range of the unit as some one above suggested by setting it to zero.

With range set to zero it will fly CAP only over its own base. With range set to whatever is normal for the unit, it will fly CAP three hexes out from its base.

To get any CAP over a hex at a range of 4 hexes the units have to be set to LRCAP, or Long Range CAP. They will only fly over the target hex or Task Force.
LRCP has diminishing return they further away the target hex is from the squadron base hex.

No squadrons at Rangoon flying CAP will ever cover anything 4 hexes from Rangoon.

Really? Even if you have it set to 6 which is the range.
I thought long range would be beyond the 6 hex limit.

No matter what the range of the fighter is, and some later war Allied fighters have considerable normal range, CAP is hard coded for a maximum range of three hexes.

BBfanboy provided a good explanation of why.

This is why the game has the LRCAP function for providing air cover at ranges beyond normal CAP range.

Do you have a citation on the hard-coded limit? Because that's not my experience. You can have CAP set to a range of 4, 5, 6, etc., and they will react to those hexes. They just won't be very effective.

I think the OP needed to set LRCAP, not CAP. That's where his problem lay.

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

ORIGINAL: HansBolter

ORIGINAL: jagsdomain



Really? Even if you have it set to 6 which is the range.
I thought long range would be beyond the 6 hex limit.

No matter what the range of the fighter is, and some later war Allied fighters have considerable normal range, CAP is hard coded for a maximum range of three hexes.

BBfanboy provided a good explanation of why.

This is why the game has the LRCAP function for providing air cover at ranges beyond normal CAP range.

Do you have a citation on the hard-coded limit? Because that's not my experience. You can have CAP set to a range of 4, 5, 6, etc., and they will react to those hexes. They just won't be very effective.

I think the OP needed to set LRCAP, not CAP. That's where his problem lay.

I'm at work and unable to dig for the reference. I'm pretty sure that has been the formula since the game scale changed from 60 nautical miles per hex to 40 when AE replaced WITP. It is possible for pilots with very high skill to exceed range limits in all kinds of missions. Devs stated this long ago.

Usually, night CAP doesn't extend beyond the base hex, but I have seen multiple occasions in '45 and '46 where it extended out an additional hex and have attributed it to the high experience levels of the pilots.

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

Other missions will fly from a Level 1 airfield, like recon, nav search and I think 1EB. But LRCAP and sweeps won't.

No. No offensive missions from a level one airbase.

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

ORIGINAL: HansBolter

ORIGINAL: jagsdomain



Really? Even if you have it set to 6 which is the range.
I thought long range would be beyond the 6 hex limit.

No matter what the range of the fighter is, and some later war Allied fighters have considerable normal range, CAP is hard coded for a maximum range of three hexes.

BBfanboy provided a good explanation of why.

This is why the game has the LRCAP function for providing air cover at ranges beyond normal CAP range.

Do you have a citation on the hard-coded limit? Because that's not my experience. You can have CAP set to a range of 4, 5, 6, etc., and they will react to those hexes. They just won't be very effective.

I think the OP needed to set LRCAP, not CAP. That's where his problem lay.

From the Manual:

7.4.1 COMBAT AIR PATROL (CAP) When enemy aircraft are spotted by those aircraft that are airborne or by radar or ground forces assigned to watch for enemy aircraft, all planes available for CAP are scrambled. CAP Aircraft are assigned, but they do not all fly at the same time. They are divided into varying levels of readiness in order to maintain a standing CAP over an assigned target hex. There are three levels of CAP. Airborne CAP is the most prepared, and can be considered that portion of a group of Aircraft Assigned to CAP that are currently flying at the assigned altitude. There is no delay in this portion of the CAP being in position to intercept an incoming raid. Ground CAP, is the next level of readiness in the CAP hierarchy. This portion is considered to be on deck to rearm/refuel, or waiting to relieve the Airborne CAP in a ready status. There is little delay in this portion of the CAP Fighters to being airborne and in a position to intercept an incoming raid. Available CAP is any ready Fighter that is assigned some mission other than “Rest” and can be scrambled in extremis. There is a significant delay in this groups scramble and may be manifested in the Available CAP only being able to intercept a raid AFTER it has struck it’s target. This is the POST TARGET Intercept phase. CAP may react to defend a target as far as 2 hexes away. To do so, the hex to be defended must be attacked by more aircraft then are defending the hex, and the hex the CAP is going to come from must be under attack by less aircraft than are currently flying CAP over that hex (checked for each air unit, one at a time). The CAP that is going to fly out of their hex must have an extended range that would reach the hex to be defended (but no more than 2 hexes away). Also, in order for this extra coverage to happen, the attack must be detected by radar in time to allow for the CAP to reach the target (an intercept is allowed 33% of the time even when there is no radar). The exact number of aircraft that will cover outside their hex is dependent on how good the radar detection is on the incoming strike.

I seem to recall that the two hex range was increased to three hexes at some point, but am too lazy to invest effort in searching for corroboration just to make a point.

I seem to recall that the two hex range was increased to three hexes at some point, but am too lazy to invest effort in searching for corroboration just to make a point.

Through empirical observation I can confirm this is true. Just keep in mind that you'll not get that many aircraft out to three hexes.