Matrix Games Forums

ORIGINAL: John 3rd

ORIGINAL: Bearcat2

The US determined the hybrids were a failed design, if they were allowed to build them, a CVL based on a Brooklyn hull was a more likely build; basically a Independence class CVL.

Really? Guess I got lucky on doing exactly that...OF COURSE that is what it converts to...this is all stated in the Mod History.

US would have built a CVL instead of a hybrid is my point; the US had already determined it wasn't a good idea.

ORIGINAL: obvert

I may have missed it somewhere here but which economy will you be using for this game? The BTS as it is in your game against John III or the one with DBB oil/resource production numbers?

I don't have the new numbers from John, so we are using the old 5.7 BTS version. It would be quite a headache to work through the numbers myself to find a balance between all the new HI and resources. It seems I can't just set the numbers back to DBB because the economy will crash, so comprehensive changes will be required. So this part of my desired changes will have to wait...OR maybe someone like Itaklinus can help.

One thing I'm noticing in my game: Garrison requirements in China for a lot of Japanese-held cities have been lowered in comparison to DBB. For instance, Canton's garrison requirement is 360 in DBB-C and 150 in BTS 5.7; similar changes can be seen elsewhere (Shanghai is now 350 vs 720). This makes the China situation a lot simpler and easier for Japan, at least initially, but perhaps this is something worth looking into for balance. I think I remember John saying somewhere that garrison requirements have been increased elsewhere, such as in India or Chinese-held China. That said, I do believe John is somehow trying to implement BigB's China for the next version.

I am somehow not really present, writing from mobile in pubs... however, I'm available for anything needed. Even in game checks (but we speak of new year for that).


Regarding garrisons. IIRC canton has 300 in stock. Shanghai 720.

I am quite open to say that most of the garrison requirements are ok-ish in stock game. The huge collaborationist army is not represented a part from few random units, and I suppose the idea is that the collaborationists act as a sort of police and it's not needed to represent the whole thing into the game.



Economy. In line of principle, you can run the industry as in the mod with few modifications from stock resources. But forget using the CV fleet for more than say one week per month (I'm approximating here, haven't calculated). Forget completely about the rest. And you can produce fewer planes than in stock.
So, yes, practically speaking it's impossible to run the economy without the additional raw materials given in the mod.

Also, the placement of oil is relatively unimportant since Japan has so many stuff it can defend every point of the map, even generally soft spots such as DEI.
Basically: as allied you can run a couple of carrier raids on oilfields but either you get sunk outright or Japan is able to repair them without major problems. And, in the meanwhile ,no industrial production has to be altered because of the raids.

I suppose it's essentially impossible for the allied to win but who knows.
I'm fairly sure that getting a much larger industrial base in Scen1 makes 1943 and 1944 nightmar-ish years for the allies. Until late 44 you can be extremely dangerous even if with increasing losses and risks.
And that's a scen1 where you actually have to get those territories and defending them it's not easy.
Here I think you can safely go well into 45 with superiority or rough parity even if you don't increased much your industrial base (meaning: no ridiculous overextension).

Just be safe with your carriers and don't sail too much: the economy can handle everything but there is no need to overstress it because of intense fleet movements (better to save the fuel in order to invest in additional HIs, which give you a lot of supplies: they're always always needed)

Turn is away to Qball. From here on out, no Qballs! I will post more in a bit after I come back from dinner.

Dec 7th, 1941

Yamamoto was pacing his office, unable to keep still due to the nerves welling up in him. This was the day of decision, a throw of the dice - it could lead to great victory or end in calamity. All he could do in the mean time, however, was wait and worry. Suddenly the phone rang and he dashed to the nearby table where it was stationed to answer it. The subordinates in the communications room had been collating the various reports from all throughout the front of attack: like a great octopus, Japan's various tentacles of military might were spreading out to conquer the Pacific. Forces had landed at Kota Bharu on the Malayan Peninsula with more on their way to Singora by rail, the landings at Miri in Sarawak and Laoag on Luzon had also been conducted without incident (though a small minelayer took a torpedo from a Dutch sub and sank off Malaya). In the air, Japanese bombers had even managed to sink several transports and a British "D" class light cruiser north of Singapore, and the port at Manila had been hit decently hard, damaging and sinking submarines, transports, and more.



Yamamoto knew, however, that these movements south into the Southern Resource Area were precarious, deliberately done on a shoestring budget so as to allocate more forces to the great prize he so desperately sought. He had pondered it for long: how to deal with America's industrial might and her ability to drown Japan through quantity in the long run? A strong first blow had to be delivered to knock America's fleet out of the war for the foreseeable future, it had to be crushing, decisive, annihilating.

"And what of the Hawaiian operation?"



Great success! Tora, tora, tora! The First and Second Mobile Forces were reporting complete surprise, with the airfields at Pearl severely damaged, as well as her battle line and various other ships either severely mauled or worse. Two battleships were said to be outright sunk! This was good news. With the airfield so hardly put upon and her navy so weakened, the mobile fleets could stick around and continue to deliver punishment. As for the American carriers, they were worryingly nowhere to be seen, but that could wait. For now, the boats at Pearl Harbor had to be completely destroyed. And for that...

"And the Third Mobile Fleet?"



The Third Mobile Fleet was reporting Midway's airfield decently damaged and most planes there damaged or destroyed on the ground. Patrols operating from there would find the going a bit rough, the US Navy would be blinded, at least temporarily. This was important, as surprise was needed. Yamamoto turned around to the figure sitting in a chair by his desk behind him, a European-looking man of all things, out of place, a bit of an anachronism, and for some reason wearing a dark black hooded robe. Yamamoto looked to him and nodded.

"Everything is going to plan; Midway seems to have been denied its eyes and Pearl is looking in rough shape."
"We are undetected then?"
"Yes, so far your plan seems to be working. I doubt the US Navy will come steaming out of Pearl anytime soon."
"Everything is preceding as I have foreseen...haha...muahahahaha....muahahahahahahah!" *cough* *hack*

2nd turn is away to Qball; KBs will stick around and hit fleeing ships and if there are none, we will hit PH again with sweeps and bombers. A lot of housekeeping still left to do, particularly my plans for airframes and R&D.

I am starting a new contest with my long time opponent but alas he is out of town so as the Empire I am awaiting the results of my 1st turn. Good luck and I will be following your contest with great interest.

Dec 15th, 1941

Our forces have landed in good order, though our transports have suffered greatly. Our bombardmends seem to have had some effect on the gun defenses of Oahu. Nonetheless, heavy Allies artillery on land is having an effect. More divisions are required, more are on their way. The entire American battle line remains stuck in the shipyards.

Testing the limits of this particular mod takes some aggression. This will be fun. Have you considered a small landing at one of the other islands to set up air support and additional search?

@the1henson We need all the troops we can get on the main one; indeed, an additional division is on its way to Pearl north of Midway currently. That said, 2 SNLF Assault divisions (~200 AV) will take Midway and Wake Island and then proceed to occupy the islands around Pearl. All this activity is coming at a cost in the DEI, where Qball actually probably has a slight advantage in the number of combat vessels.

Interesting for me, Qball's carriers appeared down by Luganville the turn previous, sinking a small transport force. So for me, I know they are far away and I have a free hand in the area.

Good luck on your very bold stroke.

With two very big caveats, there is only one reason to invade Hawaii.

First the caveats: (1) you may know 10x more than I do; (2) any attack anywhere can become decisive if the enemy chooses to give battle there and takes significant losses.

The one reason to invade Hawaii is to facilitate ops against the West Coast. There are a number of possibilities, chiefly: (1) taking Canadian airfields in order to strategic bomb West Coast industry (lots of strat bombing points); (2) to actually invade the USA, primarily targeting ship- and aircraft construction bases; and (3) to actually conquer the USA, which I don't think is possible, but who knows.

Back in the day, Q-Ball was one of the IJ players who had the ability to engage in such a complex op. He'll be a tough customer.

After I played Q-Ball, my next opponent (Panzerjagger Hortlund) engaged in an invasion of Canada and air/and KB ops vs. USA industry. He didn't go all-out, and it fizzled, but there was a lot of discussion in the AAR about possibilities, including good comments from Alfred, Bullwinkle and others. Lots of cool stuff. If you wish to read, look up the old "War and Peas" AAR.

Great to see you taking on something so bold and fun. Good luck!

If you take Pearl, and I don't see how it is possible for the US to hold it in this mod if Japan wants it; it does impact the 48 ground units and 18 air units reinforcements due to arrive at Pearl

This certainly looks interesting. I assume you have been able to close the fields at PH and Lahaina? How bad is the flak hurting your air groups?

Three whole divisions are now at hand on the beaches of Oahu. The assault begins. Forts are down to 1.

@affins the flak hurts, the airfield was closed but now is not; hopefully we can take it soon.

ORIGINAL: Bearcat2

If you take Pearl, and I don't see how it is possible for the US to hold it in this mod if Japan wants it; it does impact the 48 ground units and 18 air units reinforcements due to arrive at Pearl

It only delays them and they show up in San Francisco. Only ships destined to arrive at that port are destroyed.

how's the game going?

I will be updating this soon. Suffice to say, PH has proven tougher than we though, but recent turns show 5-6 very damaged BBs still in port there and reinforcements on the way to hopefully take the base. We'll see.

ORIGINAL: Anachro

I will be updating this soon. Suffice to say, PH has proven tougher than we though, but recent turns show 5-6 very damaged BBs still in port there and reinforcements on the way to hopefully take the base. We'll see.