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Straits were closed according Montreaux convention for any fleet. This is not about NATO.

Might I point out NATO doesn't need to send ships into the Black Sea, apparently Russia does? Kind of slanted enforcement of an old treaty if you think about it.

Eggstor wrote: Sat May 07, 2022 4:12 am At this point, you have to wonder whether the Russians can successfully force the Dardanelles and Bosporus to reinforce the remains of the Black Sea Fleet. Turkey closed them to the non-Black Sea Fleet portion of the Russian Navy.

That didn't work out well for the British (and ANZACs, and Newfoundlanders, and French) the last time...

But as someone has already said, the Turks have invoked Article 19 of the Montreux convention https://cil.nus.edu.sg/wp-content/uploa ... traits.pdf, which is guaranteed by the UK, France, Australia, Bulgaria, Greece, Japan, Romania as well as Turkey. That would put Russia in a state of war with them, and since six of them are NATO, if the whole thing wasn't already considered an attack on Turkey, Article V would be invoked pretty quickly. I don't think Russia wants that.

Just looking at the Montreux convention and both Yugoslavia and the USSR are signatories - I wonder if that means all the bits of those former countries are also considered signatories? If so that would mean Slovenia, Croatia, Bosnia, Serbia etc but also Azerbaijan, Georgia, Armenia etc. Not that it matters, but I wonder...

Although on Snake Island a Russian LST had a bad day.
See the video on this link:
https://twitter.com/igorsushko/status/1 ... 7204295680

What happen to Hughes salvo model? Looks like Russia is trying to refute it to their detriment.

That LST hit would be consistent with the drone strikes on Snake Island and the destruction of the Tor. One thing I see on YouTube that people are trying to say the LST accounts for the footage which is allegedly the Admiral Makarov. I don't see that as remotely possible as the vessel silhouettes and size aren't even close.

One thing that amazes me is the number of drone footage videos that show Russian SAM units being destroyed with the missiles stowed in travel position! Many of the hit vehicles are clearly deployed but positioned almost on top of each other! SMH!

EDIT: BTW, I'm not saying the Admiral Makarov was sunk, but I do believe she was hit. I have seen some reports that the vessel made it to Sevastopol and about 30 ambulances met it. So who knows? The truth is the first victim of war.

BeirutDude wrote: Sat May 07, 2022 5:24 pm EDIT: BTW, I'm not saying the Admiral Makarov was sunk, but I do believe she was hit. I have seen some reports that the vessel made it to Sevastopol and about 30 ambulances met it. So who knows? The truth is the first victim of war.

Saw nothing about Admiral Makarov in Sevastopol and ambulances in serious Russian-language Telegram channels and military forums.

BrianinMinnie wrote: Fri May 06, 2022 4:36 pm Ok, what's the deal, in CMO I have to fire 20 ASM's at modern soviet capital ships to even have a sniff of a chance of getting a hit. Have we all been over estimating anti missile capabilities in real world action.

I assume the USN must test against modern ASM's to see if they can survive a similar attack on lets say a burke class, are there any real reports on how it or other navies ships are fairing in this type of testing? or is it classified to us in the outside world?

rant ended.

This has already been discussed to death: https://www.reddit.com/r/CMANO/comments ... he_moskva/

If you want to discuss modelling variable alert/readiness states & cycles, as well as the effects of fatigue, feel free: https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/view ... 4#p4748144

Blast33 wrote: Sat May 07, 2022 4:43 pm Although on Snake Island a Russian LST had a bad day.
See the video on this link:
https://twitter.com/igorsushko/status/1 ... 7204295680

Looks more like an LCT than an LST. Probably a Serna class

Saw nothing about Admiral Makarov in Sevastopol and ambulances in serious Russian-language Telegram channels and military forums.

Was something I saw on Twitter on one of the open source intel sites. The veracity of it I can't testify to, but thought it was interesting. There was also chatter about the Admiral Essen having taken damage in early April, but that seemed even more sketchy.

While I couldn't find that report I did find this (most likely Admiral Essen)...

https://twitter.com/OAlexanderDK/status ... 5185874944

https://twitter.com/ThatKHersch/status/ ... 6338296832

I will say it would be extremely stupid for the Ukrainians to have doctored a video game clip and lie about this. So far they have proven to be pretty accurate in the info they've put out, so it would really damage their reputation to have lied here.

So I don't play SIMs like DCS and that, but I was just researching ARMA 3 on YouTube (I knew it existed but have never played it or watched it before). Dang that looks like the FLIR we had when I was o active duty, so yeah maybe the video is faked. Like I said above stupid on the Ukraine's part if they faked it and took credit! They really will loose all credibility playing that game!

So far they have proven to be pretty accurate in the info they've put out, so it would really damage their reputation to have lied here.

:facepalm:
"How many blissful revelations
The spirit of enlightment hides!"
A.Pushkin

I even feel a little sorry for you that you would be so shamelessly deceived by your propaganda. I dare say I have a better idea of the situation on the front than you do. And I can assure you that Ukraine's statements are mostly false. You may or may not believe me, you are more likely not to believe me. But that is up to you.

And Elon knows more about that than all of us combined. Even knows more than the Russian government.

Filitch wrote: Mon May 09, 2022 12:14 pm

So far they have proven to be pretty accurate in the info they've put out, so it would really damage their reputation to have lied here.

:facepalm:
"How many blissful revelations
The spirit of enlightment hides!"
A.Pushkin

I even feel a little sorry for you that you would be so shamelessly deceived by your propaganda. I dare say I have a better idea of the situation on the front than you do. And I can assure you that Ukraine's statements are mostly false. You may or may not believe me, you are more likely not to believe me. But that is up to you.

FWIW, The Dupuy Institutes Blog ( http://www.dupuyinstitute.org/blog/ ) says that the claim the frigate Admiral Makarov has been damaged or sunk on 6 May by Ukrainian Neptune missiles is not correct. After taking a look at the alleged video of the "damaged" Admiral Makarov, I have to agree that there are significant questions regarding its veracity.

More confirmation that looks like she was indeed never hit, and these were rumors.

Take everything with a grain of salt of course but everything added up would seem to indicate the whole thing is blatantly false.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/a- ... b31454287e

Filitch wrote: Mon May 09, 2022 12:14 pm

So far they have proven to be pretty accurate in the info they've put out, so it would really damage their reputation to have lied here.

:facepalm:
"How many blissful revelations
The spirit of enlightment hides!"
A.Pushkin

I even feel a little sorry for you that you would be so shamelessly deceived by your propaganda. I dare say I have a better idea of the situation on the front than you do. And I can assure you that Ukraine's statements are mostly false. You may or may not believe me, you are more likely not to believe me. But that is up to you.

Fascinating. I'm curious - do you believe in Putin's justification for invading Ukraine?

maverick3320 wrote: Thu May 12, 2022 5:37 pm

Filitch wrote: Mon May 09, 2022 12:14 pm

So far they have proven to be pretty accurate in the info they've put out, so it would really damage their reputation to have lied here.

:facepalm:
"How many blissful revelations
The spirit of enlightment hides!"
A.Pushkin

I even feel a little sorry for you that you would be so shamelessly deceived by your propaganda. I dare say I have a better idea of the situation on the front than you do. And I can assure you that Ukraine's statements are mostly false. You may or may not believe me, you are more likely not to believe me. But that is up to you.

Fascinating. I'm curious - do you believe in Putin's justification for invading Ukraine?

Just my 2 cents, but here goes: This forum probably is not the proper place for where your question would likely lead.

If this thread is going to be closed. This is a good end







Edit: better not to close it yet.

https://mezha.media/en/2022/05/12/russi ... yi-island/

maverick3320 wrote: Thu May 12, 2022 5:37 pm

Filitch wrote: Mon May 09, 2022 12:14 pm

So far they have proven to be pretty accurate in the info they've put out, so it would really damage their reputation to have lied here.

:facepalm:
"How many blissful revelations
The spirit of enlightment hides!"
A.Pushkin

I even feel a little sorry for you that you would be so shamelessly deceived by your propaganda. I dare say I have a better idea of the situation on the front than you do. And I can assure you that Ukraine's statements are mostly false. You may or may not believe me, you are more likely not to believe me. But that is up to you.

Fascinating. I'm curious - do you believe in Putin's justification for invading Ukraine?

I'm curious - Why would anyone care in this forum? Are looking to start something?

maverick3320 wrote: Thu May 12, 2022 5:37 pm Fascinating. I'm curious - do you believe in Putin's justification for invading Ukraine?

I'm completely agree above commentators. My opinion about justification of this war is not point of discussion. Same as yours, or anybody else. We should discuss subject, not opinions.
If you really interested in communication - PM me.

Filitch wrote: Fri May 13, 2022 9:07 am We should discuss subject, not opinions.

Vsevolod Bobrov logistic ship issue is real or fake news, what is it said in Russia?