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September 1940 - Europe

--German surrenders, too much damage taken.
--Lost Panzer, 2-Army, 2-Corp, Fighter and Paratroop
--Burma joined year ago due to Diplo back-2-back hits
--Finland took Diplo hit

British did the All-In with Anti-Air and Corps
Also sending every unit on the planet to defend Southern France
--Egyptian troops
--South Africa
--India

German conservative strategy w/ maximum MMPs in Technology, polar opposite approach bad mix
**Key turn was being lazy and losing Panzer for no reason upfront

No point to continue, USA will also abandon Pacific

Allied Diplo too powerful and impactful on Finland and Dutch East Indies
Allies can also spread their Diplo out, to get the hit(s), Axis cannot even properly block if Allies split.
Opponent getting single hit & then mega-hit on Burma in 2 consecutive turns in 1939, set the tone.

It's a pity that it ended so quickly, but the diplomacy of the axis is really weak and completely disappears when the United States joins

IIo4Tu wrote: Wed May 08, 2024 12:03 pm It's a pity that it ended so quickly, but the diplomacy of the axis is really weak and completely disappears when the United States joins

Couple different things:

1) There was no point continuing, Axis are doomed at this point. Have seen this strategy many times before from top ranked players. Sadly, I didn't recognize, and did not react properly. USA will abandon Pacific, and land Marines in a port outside of Luftwaffe range quickly in 1942, then pour in dead-head units to clog up France forever. It's game over.

2) Personally, I don't like House Rules, it's a game. But the Diplomacy is a joke. There's already ELO rules about Majors. I've made threads before how Diplomacy is too much of a game changer. Not Burma (far as I know, first time I've seen that). But Finland and DEI is too powerful. Even crazier, it's just the "bluff of it". Allies can put just 1-chit in multiple counties (Finland, DEI, something else). Axis can only see the total spent. This forces Axis to match, but could even been in the wrong balance, when trying to neutralize. Then it's just pure luck. I've played enough games, players that put MMPs into Diplomacy, always get their hits.

I do not agree about the United States, everything depends on Japan's activity, if Japan actively presses in the Pacific Ocean, then the United States will simply have to spend resources on deterrence

ElvisJJonesRambo wrote: Wed May 08, 2024 8:28 pm
2) Personally, I don't like House Rules, it's a game. But the Diplomacy is a joke. There's already ELO rules about Majors. I've made threads before how Diplomacy is too much of a game changer. Not Burma (far as I know, first time I've seen that). But Finland and DEI is too powerful. Even crazier, it's just the "bluff of it". Allies can put just 1-chit in multiple counties (Finland, DEI, something else). Axis can only see the total spent. This forces Axis to match, but could even been in the wrong balance, when trying to neutralize. Then it's just pure luck. I've played enough games, players that put MMPs into Diplomacy, always get their hits.

Diplomacy towards the DEI could be blocked completely for either side. It would make things follow a more historic path.

As to Finland, it has to be open to some diplomacy, though the number of chits could be restricted, as this might discourage speculative ventures. Although would this really help?

Thoughts on both please.

BillRunacre wrote: Thu May 09, 2024 9:35 am
Diplomacy towards the DEI could be blocked completely for either side. It would make things follow a more historic path.

As to Finland, it has to be open to some diplomacy, though the number of chits could be restricted, as this might discourage speculative ventures. Although would this really help?

Thoughts on both please.

Nah, don't make any changes on Finland, on account of me. IIo4Tu is a Top 10 type player, I'd find something else to bitch about. Diplomacy is part of the game. The Top players are efficient, I try their strategies and still screw it up, human error.

The Finnish were about self survival, due to the Russian/Finland 1940 conflict. Joining the Axis was about the enemy of my enemy is my friend, war makes strange bedfellows, all is fair in love and war, pen is mightier than the sword. If Germans dump 250 MMPs into Finland, it can be stopped.

Far as DEI-Diplo, it was a fad for awhile. It's funny, players copy other player's strategy. If I remember right, it takes a little time and burns alot of Allied MMPs, but if they get couple big-hits, the Risk/Reward factor paid off. It's like going to the casino, playing Craps and hitting back-2-back full press "hard ways".

Me, I play the game to escape the daily routine, not a perfectionist. I'm a beer & pretzel type. When we discuss game changes, it really comes down to the skill level of the players.

If someone beats me (with any strategy), I just say, "hey you got me".

My answer, don't change for me. "Let It Be" ---one of the good Beatles songs.

I wouldn't modify Finland (diplo-wise) but I would take the DEI off the table concerning diplomacy of any type, if changes were considered.

The Dutch East Indies are are a colony...not an independent country. The same goes with all the Brit colonies like Solomons etc.

Hate to say this, but I will. WaW of all the SC titles is the most prone to gamey and exploitive behavior of all the titles with MP.
I don't buy the argument that ' The game allows it, so I can do it' when it comes counter to reality in a major way.

These are my opinions of course.

@IIo4Tu --- Congrats by the way. You have kicked the sh-t outta me from both sides of the war. Hey, you wanna try that again? We both return turns fast. By the way, how'd you get so good with only 14 games in ELO, you must be playing European front alot?

ElvisJJonesRambo wrote: Fri May 10, 2024 11:46 pm @IIo4Tu --- Congrats by the way. You have kicked the sh-t outta me from both sides of the war. Hey, you wanna try that again? We both return turns fast. By the way, how'd you get so good with only 14 games in ELO, you must be playing European front alot?

If you look at Steam, then I have played about 3,800 hours, most of the games I play without registering in ELO, I do not play in Europe, because I do not like the limitations of the theater of operations, after all, once the world war, it means we have to fight all over the world, besides, I have such a strategy for the Japanese, that the United States has to fight in the Pacific Ocean in order not to land on the west coast, and this gives more variety to the matches

IIo4Tu wrote: Sat May 11, 2024 2:09 pm If you look at Steam, then I have played about 3,800 hours, most of the games I play without registering in ELO, I do not play in Europe, because I do not like the limitations of the theater of operations, after all, once the world war, it means we have to fight all over the world, besides, I have such a strategy for the Japanese, that the United States has to fight in the Pacific Ocean in order not to land on the west coast, and this gives more variety to the matches

Yes, indeed. You have fine tuned some moves, like a composer. If I remember right, you have the Japanese quite mobile and fast at sea. Game is set-up, pick your side, you know the password. Now only, can I have a punchers chance.