Matrix Games Forums

chief wrote:The way I seed it was Sherman cost 150 crew no posted cost....sherman destroyed, crew escapes, no points to destroyer, on the other hand crew destroyed then or later full 150 points to destroyer. Destroy a 30 pt 10man inf squad 30 pts to destroyer, destroy only 7, 21 pts etc. I personally don't think (working without tools here) that game can handle a crewed vehicle any other way. Unfortunately. IMO

Hmm.. I thought it was more like

Destroy the AFV - full point awarded

Destroy the crew (if bailed) - additional points

Since, after all, a bailed crew is in fact a new unit in your roster, and that unit is worth points. The AFV is also a unit in the roster, but now listed as "destroyed", which is why the enemy is awarded points for it.

This is also why the "Men" casualty count is messed up in the combat results; if you bail a tank crew of 5 and kill 3 of them, the total loss will be 5+3=8

Do I have it backwards?

I guess it needs a test to prove it.......

Tested theory.....Test setup....section of M4A3s cost 210/section vs 2- 88's.....HQ platoons.....nothing else....2 ea M4s clobbered/w crew dead.....RESULTS....HAHAHAHA...USA 1781 points, GER 419, USA Marginal Victory......BS for results. My question is ......"How is score calculated in SPWAW 7.1?" Nothing like a test to prove a theory.

Ive always found score to be pretty difficult to measure...

I think we need to get the people who coded the game in here to give us an answer

Belisarius wrote:Hmm.. I thought it was more like

Destroy the AFV - full point awarded

Destroy the crew (if bailed) - additional points

Since, after all, a bailed crew is in fact a new unit in your roster, and that unit is worth points. The AFV is also a unit in the roster, but now listed as "destroyed", which is why the enemy is awarded points for it.

This is also why the "Men" casualty count is messed up in the combat results; if you bail a tank crew of 5 and kill 3 of them, the total loss will be 5+3=8

Do I have it backwards?

In regards to this AFV comment we were precisely in agreement, until, that is, you said 5+3=8. What???? I regard crews as infantry (or foot unit), so the way you put it (5+3=8) sounds strange, but I think we're dead-on in regards to foot units too, though for some reason I haven't applied the foot unit principle to crews, but then I see where you're coming from. If infantry and crews are both treated the same, then the principle that applied to a 30pt. infantry unit being worth 30pts. when it's slain, no matter how few men are left, applies too. Yeah, I'll go for that. The men you whittle down would be the 3pts. and the last two men, since their loss destroyed the squad would be worth 5pts. since there were 5 men. I have the suspicion that crews come out as a solid point value too, like any other unit: maybe 5pts. irrespective of the number of men, or perhaps 8pts.

chief wrote:Tested theory.....Test setup....section of M4A3s cost 210/section vs 2- 88's.....HQ platoons.....nothing else....2 ea M4s clobbered/w crew dead.....RESULTS....HAHAHAHA...USA 1781 points, GER 419, USA Marginal Victory......BS for results. My question is ......"How is score calculated in SPWAW 7.1?" Nothing like a test to prove a theory.

What kind of mission was that? Did the crews pop; were they destroyed? The GE score is almost precise. If my theory holds, he was awarded 419 because one of the tanks wasn't precisely worth 105pts. because his experience wasn't precisely 70 (or maybe one is 75 while the other is 64). You may need to do some studying to account for the US score, but the GE score looks suspiciously like the old scoring of awarding a defender with double points for kills.

OTOH, maybe your lineup is so peculiar that it comes out with a strange result. It looks like the US has all or most of the objectives while GE is getting double points for kills. If you fought this somehow without objectives, as I know there are some that figured out a way to do that, I wouldn't trust the game to be accurate without them. What you'd need to make it the most predictable, would be to have untimed objectives with a meeting engagement (is it possible to have entirely untimed objectives with meeting engagements?).

Fallschirmjager wrote:Charles is correct....to an extent

To get the FULL point value from destroying those units....you must also kill the crews as they are part of the vehicles value

I thought it was the other way around, you get the full points for killing the vehicle and extra points for killing the crew that bailed.
thanks, John.

Fallschirmjager wrote:Hmm

I always thought...

lets say you have a 10 man team...lets say that team is worth 100 points (its a high number but this is for example sake) when you kill one man in that unit...you get 10 points

So....
Number of points earned is the number of men killed divided by total cost of the unit

Now I may be wrong....
But that is how it SHOULD work to be a good system

I also either disagree of misread something in your above post...
The cost of a crew is not adverse to how many men are in the crew....
Look at wittmans crew in the Villars Bocage scenario...I think just the crew is like 10-15 points ( I dont have the game on thos machine otherwise id check)

You are almost right, for units that take damage it is a percentage. However if a unit is totally destroyed, you take a double hit, you lose both the points per man and the cost of the unit as a whole. So a unit down to three men is a very expensive loss, if it is killed. While it saves quite a few points if it is pulled back to survive.
thanks, John.