Matrix Games Forums

This is very good news as I own (and still play) all of the titles listed, save the TOAW series. I even have kept my old Win95 (266 Mhz [X(]) machine running just so I could continue playing the BattleGround series (I could never get them to run on any of my other machines).

Just the other day, after playing a round in an ongoing BTR campaign, I was thinking about how neat it would be if someone could update some of the old Talonsoft titles so they could run on newer machines. I didn't believe it when I first heard the news.

Well done, Matrix!

I own most of them already, but it would be worth my while just to get a clean version of the BattleGround series with all the patches and Tiller's 32 bit upgrade incorporated!

This is such great news about a great classic game collection.

I am, quite frankly, thrilled to hear this news! Well done guys! Looking forward to seeing what develops!

I would like the Civil War games in a packaged bundle please. And ummm how much are you going to charge for these old games renewed?

I dug up the old TOAW manual tonight. 160 pages, and I do remember being impressed with this at that time. Most companies around then had stoped giving decent printed manuals. The only other time since I had such luxury, was when buying Civ III.

I for one would be looking forward to a updated of ' Bombing The Reich '

I for one will be looking foward to the "bargain bin" prices on the bundle paks.

ORIGINAL: ravinhood
I for one will be looking foward to the "bargain bin" prices on the bundle paks.

Now this, I would not have guessed... [;)]

Great! I was never a fan of the Campaign series (maybe this time?), but TOAW certainly deserves a new lease of life.

Now how about updating this one while you're at it?



It's the number one game I miss on XP!

Matrix Games,

Very glad to hear that you are picking up the Talonsoft Battleground series. I got many hours of enjoyment from them, but could not run them once I switched to XP. If you are planning any updates to them, I have a couple of suggestions. I am not an AI person, so I am not sure how easy it would be to implement them, but I think they would help make the games more realistic:

• Brigade Combat Effectiveness. One of the problems with the Battleground games was that units could continue to reengage even after absorbing incredible losses. Certainly losses did lead to units routing, but they could later be rallied, sometimes time after time. Especially versus the AI, units reduced from hundreds of men to 50 or 25 would continue to make suicidal attacks. A fix for this would be some sort of a Brigade Combat Effectiveness rule. This term/concept actually comes from the similarly scaled and detailed Great Battles of the American Civil War board games. In these games, separate player aids are used to track losses by brigade (the ability to take losses varies amongst brigades based on historical performance - in fact as there are games for most/all of the Battleground Civil War battles in the series, the research is essentially done). Once a given brigade has absorbed a certain level of losses, all units in the brigade are restricted in what actions they can perform and usually also suffer some level of permanent (in game terms) morale loss.
• Artillery Ammunition. The Battleground games gave each side a set number of artillery ammo points. Each time an artillery battery fired, one point was deducted. While that helped limit overuse of artillery, it permitted unhistorical use of artillery such as using all batteries at the same time, or allowing batteries in key positions to have an essentially unlimited supply. In reality, at least in general terms, artillery supply was managed at the battery level and one of the key command considerations a Civil War general had was to manage his artillery so that fresh batteries could be brought forward at the correct time and place as other batteries ran low on ammo. I think it would be more realistic if the artillery ammo was divided by battery and once a battery was out of ammo, it can no longer fire.

Another feature that would be nice to have would be to have the unit icons, at least the 3D ones, come in slightly different versions (perhaps 3 or 4 levels) to reflect their relative size. As it is, a 25-man infantry regiment appears the same size as a 1000-man one.

Finally, as you are probably aware, there were some unofficial variants produced using the Battleground software. I know that at least Eylau and Chancellorsville versions were produced and available online. It would be great to see the Battleground series expanded and it seems a lot of the work may already have been done.

Duncan Lang
Spotsylvania, VA

ORIGINAL: Tête de Porc

Now how about updating this one while you're at it?

BEER.


A much more constructive use of Norm's time than mesing about with TOAW IMHO (flak jacket on [;)] )

ORIGINAL: Tête de Porc

Great! I was never a fan of the Campaign series (maybe this time?), but TOAW certainly deserves a new lease of life.

Now how about updating this one while you're at it?



It's the number one game I miss on XP!

This game is sooooooo good!! I would really like to see it redone too

What about Tiller's commitment to HPS? He has taken the Battleground system to another level with his campaigns of the civil war system at HPS Franklin, Corinth, Gettysburg and the Pennisular campaign. Will he be serving two masters or can we see some sort of blending of the systems. Basically the Battleground system is visually much more beautiful due to the painted maps but the campaign systems (although a visual dog) has refined the game mechanics and made it much better.

ORIGINAL: crsutton

What about Tiller's commitment to HPS? He has taken the Battleground system to another level with his campaigns of the civil war system at HPS Franklin, Corinth, Gettysburg and the Pennisular campaign. Will he be serving two masters or can we see some sort of blending of the systems. Basically the Battleground system is visually much more beautiful due to the painted maps but the campaign systems (although a visual dog) has refined the game mechanics and made it much better.

I agree with your final sentence, but I think the clue is in the press release;

Matrix Games has reached an agreement with the original developer of these titles, John Tiller, to assist in updating each game to the most recent version to assure full compatibility with the latest Windows XP systems and DirectX. Matrix Games plans to publish an updated version of the full Battleground and Campaign series games, including some fixes and tweaks for issues that have become known since their original release.

I'm making a habit of being wrong with guesses about what's likely to happen [;)], but I think people are getting a little carried away about what's actually going to be on offer. The above statement doesn't suggest any great improvement or development, and actually the one for TOAW was similar.

I really don't share the desire to see any of the titles seriously 'developed'. I can see why die-hard fans, especially of TOAW, would but nostalgia aside the games are no better than many of those that have become available since they were published, and in many ways are considerably less impressive. More to the point, they are certainly no better than many currently in development. Things have moved on and I'd rather see Norm Koger, Gary Grigsby, and John Tiller getting on with new games, not stepping back in time five years or more to improve old titles... and despite my earlier post that includes AoR too!

I would be pleased to buy re-releases of the Campaign Series or TOAW with significant improvements, BUT nowhere near as pleased as I would be to buy CotA, or a new War in Russia, or Combined Arms, or Combat Leader.

I am more happy to see that just a patch is being done, then a total-rewrite. In theory, the products will be able to ship sooner.

I would also like to see Matrix get a hold the source code for Panzer General II. This was the best game in the entire series.

There is a ready-made and active fan base for this game that would work on the game, test it, and improve it for free...

Some things that would need to be changed:

* fix bugs
* bigger maps
* reinforcements should not be elite replacements
etc...

I would rather see PG III fixed than PG 2. PG III Scortched Earth had great potential. It just sucks when every time you ambush a unit (even by accident) the game crashes to desktop every god damn time!

Only work around is to start over and pray you don't ambush a unit again.

This is great news. I love the talonsoft games, and this will certianly create interest. Mostly looking forward to trying TOAW:COW which never got a release here in the UK.

ORIGINAL: Pippin

I would rather see PG III fixed than PG 2. PG III Scortched Earth had great potential. It just sucks when every time you ambush a unit (even by accident) the game crashes to desktop every god damn time!

Only work around is to start over and pray you don't ambush a unit again.

PG III does have its moments.

However, I could never really get into the 3D aspect of the game. It was a slower game and you couldn't have as many units in your army.

In addition, it is much less moddable than PG2.

The PG2 community has already made hundreds of scenarios and campaigns for the game as well as new maps, equipment files, etc, etc...

They have been after the source code for some time and would be thrilled to be able to work on it...