Matrix Games Forums

ORIGINAL: CobraAus

Kumano Maru

Cobra Aus

Hi!

I found a picture of Kumano Maru

Making these ships be AK's instead of LSD's only allows them to make efficient troop landings during the bonus period for Japanese naval landings. Unless there is a compelling reason to go AK with a given ship (like upgrading to CVE or usa as a high-speed aircraft transport) it is probably better to go LSD.

My opinion about this ships:

Well these are multirole ships, but in CHS Japan lost many of it's AP which changed to AK, Japan always would have enough ships to transport planes. Since there isnt a way to make them better at transporting planes, making them as AK is pointless and waste of ships of such capabilities. Let's make them LPD or at least AP.

The ships with flight deck - I think they should be depicted as small CVE's - even that they hadnt had an elevator (planes were transported from hangar to flight deck by crane) - with small capability of 7 planes (Akitsu Maru and Nigitsu Maru airgroup was 7 x Ki-76 Stella while on escort duty, otherwise she transported 20 vehicles or 20 partially dismounted planes). It's small capacity will prevent them to be used in any other role than escort duty.

Well these are multirole ships, but in CHS Japan lost many of it's AP which changed to AK, Japan always would have enough ships to transport planes. Since there isnt a way to make them better at transporting planes, making them as AK is pointless and waste of ships of such capabilities. Let's make them LPD or at least AP.

The ships with flight deck - I think they should be depicted as small CVE's - even that they hadnt had an elevator (planes were transported from hangar to flight deck by crane) - with small capability of 7 planes (Akitsu Maru and Nigitsu Maru airgroup was 7 x Ki-76 Stella while on escort duty, otherwise she transported 20 vehicles or 20 partially dismounted planes). It's small capacity will prevent them to be used in any other role than escort duty.

These are intelligent comments. However, the air group was slightly bigger. There were ALSO Ka-1 autogyros. But since I have not added them the exist in no version of the data set - so we cannot simulate them except possibly by adding Ki-76s. Ka-1 was the first rotary wing aircraft to see combat duty in squadron size units in any nation in history (or so says Rene Francillon). Germany and the US and the UK all had individual ASW helos and/or autogyros, but not squadrons operating from carriers.

Yeah, I forgot about this one - Ka-1 aren't (at least in Polish) aircraft so I did not add them to capacity. But still have no idea how many of these was stationed on these ships. Also in description of these ships, the way author is talking about Ka-1 suggest that there were plans to put them in this kind of servis. He is not mentioning that they were actually used.

ORIGINAL: Monter_Trismegistos

My opinion about this ships:

Well these are multirole ships, but in CHS Japan lost many of it's AP which changed to AK, Japan always would have enough ships to transport planes. Since there isnt a way to make them better at transporting planes, making them as AK is pointless and waste of ships of such capabilities. Let's make them LPD or at least AP.

LSD is the only applicable one in the dataset for the game. Since they were obviously amphibious oriented the LPD is the only logical choice. These ships only excaberate the limited ability to accurately model. In reading many of the ship histories of the USN CVE's it was not uncommon for them tobe used as transports for supplies and personnel. US tankers were equipped by midwar to be used as aircraft transports also. Auxiliaries, primarily AV's, were used to transport personnel and equipment early war..

with two different kinds of ASW squadrons on board - Ki-76 fixed wing and Ka-1 rotary wing (autogyro - the first combat rotary wing aircraft in squadron service in history).

in case of need, break glass

Kayaba KA-1 rotary

Cobra Aus

I chose the LSD because it is the only amphip that Matrix provided that DOES NOT have to beach. The amphip capability also means that units are more effeciently transported for amphip operations, a capability that clearly existed historically by vertue of the existence of these vessels

My first ship was an APA. These ships are modeled in WITP by APs too.
They - and AKs - are standoff ships that land via landing craft. But both AK and AP differ from LSD in that they must load their craft - slowly - using a crane. The Japanese ships are sort of "pre LSDs" using a different concept than our - but they really are LSDs. Both ours and theirs carry LOADED landing craft. But we carry ours in a "well deck" that can be flooded so they float out aft. They carry theirs in a sort of hanger deck, and they roll them on RR tracks down a stern ramp. This is the same idea used to launch midgets from the CVS ships - and the CVS ships so modified COULD BE LSDs if anyone wanted to substitute landing craft for midgets. The problem is that they then cannot carry aircraft. But it is a small lost - many AK can carry aircraft - and we can give the Army flight deck ships classed as CVEs which will function as aircraft transports too. LSD really is the nearest kind of ship for most of these. And a mixture of LSD and CVE will get the job done nicely.

Yeah, I forgot about this one - Ka-1 aren't (at least in Polish) aircraft so I did not add them to capacity. But still have no idea how many of these was stationed on these ships. Also in description of these ships, the way author is talking about Ka-1 suggest that there were plans to put them in this kind of servis. He is not mentioning that they were actually used.

Francillon says they were used. Best guess is that a JAAF carrier ASW "unit" would have seven. Not sure why, but I guess it is so that one can be kept aloft continuously, with another deck ready.

ORIGINAL: el cid again

Yeah, I forgot about this one - Ka-1 aren't (at least in Polish) aircraft so I did not add them to capacity. But still have no idea how many of these was stationed on these ships. Also in description of these ships, the way author is talking about Ka-1 suggest that there were plans to put them in this kind of servis. He is not mentioning that they were actually used.

Francillon says they were used. Best guess is that a JAAF carrier ASW "unit" would have seven. Not sure why, but I guess it is so that one can be kept aloft continuously, with another deck ready.

My question in all this is just how effective would they have been? We are not talking about Cold War asw here. Indeed, until the means to find and track subs at a distance becomes available I do not see them contributing much, if at all, to the the war. There is a tremendous difference between prototype technology and its effective integration into the war effort that includes such things as doctrine and training, all that takes months, if not years, to work out. My exoerience in working for cmompanies designing electronic prototypes has taught me this much.

In reading many of the ship histories of the USN CVE's it was not uncommon for them tobe used as transports for supplies and personnel. US tankers were equipped by midwar to be used as aircraft transports also. Auxiliaries, primarily AV's, were used to transport personnel and equipment early war..

When Uncommon Valor was young, I posted this, and a Matrix programmer responded they didn't know it and didn't believe it - so no need to make carriers able to be transports. HMAS Melbourne ended its career as a transport ship.

Well after the war almost every CVE was used to transport back US POWs from Asia back to US.