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INP....GP

btd64 wrote: Thu Jul 03, 2025 12:38 am Hot dogs, pasta salad and beers. Perfect dinner....GP

Do you ever put ice cream in your beer? https://www.tasteofhome.com/recipes/roo ... at-recipe/
Remember . . .

Morning Gentlemen. Ranger. And ladies.

Hi all,

Good morning!


Leo "Apollo11"

Good morning folks!

Today 163 years ago was the third and final day of the Battle of Gettysburg.

Other significant dates.

• 324: The Battle of Adrianople saw Constantine I defeat Licinius.

• 1644: The Battle of Marston Moor saw Oliver Cromwell's victory over the Royalists.

• 1863: The final day of the Battle of Gettysburg in the American Civil War resulted in a decisive Union victory, largely due to the repulse of Pickett's Charge.

• 1866: The Battle of Königgrätz decided the outcome of the Austro-Prussian War.

• 1898: An American squadron defeated a Spanish naval squadron in the Battle of Santiago de Cuba.

Zovs wrote: Thu Jul 03, 2025 7:18 am

• 1863: The final day of the Battle of Gettysburg in the American Civil War resulted in a decisive Union victory, largely due to the repulse of Pickett's Charge.

I am weird. I pretty much consider the battle of Gettysburg as a draw. I dislike the idea that events that has yet to happen (often very far into the future) dictates if it was a strategic victory or not.

Orm wrote: Thu Jul 03, 2025 7:28 am

Zovs wrote: Thu Jul 03, 2025 7:18 am

• 1863: The final day of the Battle of Gettysburg in the American Civil War resulted in a decisive Union victory, largely due to the repulse of Pickett's Charge.

I am weird. I pretty much consider the battle of Gettysburg as a draw. I dislike the idea that events that has yet to happen (often very far into the future) dictates if it was a strategic victory or not.

Gettysburg was a Union victory and it was known as such at the time. It was a large enough victory and combined with the Union victory at Vicksburg, Mississippi, in the West, it ended the hope of the Confederacy that the Confederacy would be recognized in Europe. Also, the Union cavalry proved equal to the Confederate cavalry.

Yes. I know. Yet the Union win was that the Confederates failed to win. The Confederates needed to win that battle, One could consider stopping the opponent from winning a victory. I certainly understand why they would do so at the time. I've even seen loses described as victories at the time they occurred.

I suppose it is because I dislike the idea that it is also possible for a tactical defeat to be considered a strategic victory because it managed to achieve other goals

Although, if one holds the belief that the winner is the side that holds the battlefield in the end then it would be simple enough.

,,,,,,,,,,,,

Brigadier General Alexander S. Webb wrote to his father on July 17, stating that such Washington politicians as "Chase, Seward and others", disgusted with Meade, "write to me that Lee really won that Battle!"[

Zovs wrote: Thu Jul 03, 2025 7:18 am Good morning folks!

Today 163 years ago was the third and final day of the Battle of Gettysburg.

Other significant dates.

• 324: The Battle of Adrianople saw Constantine I defeat Licinius.

• 1644: The Battle of Marston Moor saw Oliver Cromwell's victory over the Royalists.

• 1863: The final day of the Battle of Gettysburg in the American Civil War resulted in a decisive Union victory, largely due to the repulse of Pickett's Charge.

• 1866: The Battle of Königgrätz decided the outcome of the Austro-Prussian War.

• 1898: An American squadron defeated a Spanish naval squadron in the Battle of Santiago de Cuba.

Good morning everyone. Zovs, thank you for the history post....GP

Orm wrote: Thu Jul 03, 2025 3:22 pm Yes. I know. Yet the Union win was that the Confederates failed to win. The Confederates needed to win that battle, One could consider stopping the opponent from winning a victory. I certainly understand why they would do so at the time. I've even seen loses described as victories at the time they occurred.

I suppose it is because I dislike the idea that it is also possible for a tactical defeat to be considered a strategic victory because it managed to achieve other goals

Although, if one holds the belief that the winner is the side that holds the battlefield in the end then it would be simple enough.

,,,,,,,,,,,,

Brigadier General Alexander S. Webb wrote to his father on July 17, stating that such Washington politicians as "Chase, Seward and others", disgusted with Meade, "write to me that Lee really won that Battle!"[

Yes, I understand your point of view.

And as far as General Webb's point of view, one way it is correct because Meade did not try to cut off Lee's Army. But Meade couldn't do that without giving Lee the possibility of marching to Washington DC which is something that Meade couldn't allow. The "baggage" train went one way and part of it was captured while the rest of Lee's Army went another way. Meade was a great organizer but Grant was the necessary "bulldog" type of leader that was needed because he would not let go, he did not head back to a camp to "reorganize" the army, he just kept marching and fighting.

In more modern terms of a tactical defeat being a strategic victory, the Coral Sea Battle was was such a victory. Dunkirk could also be considered a tactical defeat while it was a strategic victory because of the saving of most of the BEF along with some French troops as well.

I hope that everyone is having a nice day.
Enjoy your day, have a safe rest of the week.

Morning Gentlemen. Ladies.

RangerJoe wrote: Thu Jul 03, 2025 8:02 pm I hope that everyone is having a nice day.

Enjoy your day, have a safe rest of the week.

I hope you all enjoy your day. And have a nice Independence day.

Although you are somewhat wrong, Ranger. Today is not TGIF. Today is TYLFOID. At least for some of us. We, of course, are so spoiled that we do not think much about such days (We in this sentence I suspect are most of the Swedes). In some ways this is a beautiful piece of paper.

Our forefathers are rolling over in there graves because of the way this country is heading....
But happy Birthday USA. Many of us Love you ....GP

Afternoon Gentlemen. Ladies.

Good morning everyone....GP

Morning Gentlemen, and Ladies.

Good morning everyone. We all know what tomorrow is. Just don't say it....GP

Good morning everyone. We all know what tomorrow is. Just don't say it....GP

It's worth saying twice....GP