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3.  Happened all the time, just as the Allied Air Firces bombed Allied Ships all the time.

Do you want to define it as HIT a German ship?

no, not a friendly fire incident. I'm not sure if the German made plane actually hit the German ship though. I think so. Not a German combat ship, but one from Germany with a German captain and crew.


I was thinking of the Hungarian CR.42 on the Eastern Front. 24 kills I read. The CR.42 was a nimble little thing. The image of CR.42 vs Gladiators over Malta got me thinking, but I suspect y'all are right, there are a lot possibilities on that one.

What planes did the post-43 Allied Italians fly?

I'm Gooogling now.
Finnish Bristol Bulldogs v Red Air Force Winter war   Claims only against monplanes
Finland also used the Gloster gauntlet in the Winter war
Yugoslavia used the Hawker Fury II against Germany & Italy, no claims against Biplanes.
The Red Air Force used its I-15 & I-153's against biplanes flown by most of its attackers.
http://surfcity.kund.dalnet.se/biplanes.htm

ORIGINAL: brian brian

What planes did the post-43 Allied Italians fly?

Immediatly on forming it used the Italian aircraft it flew prior to the surrender.
Definately MC202 & MC205, Re2000? and bombers.
It was attached to the Balkan Air Force and only flew over Yugoslavia, Albania & Greece.
Later it was equipped with Spitfire V, P39Q Airacobra & Martin Baltimores
I'm not sure if it flew against Axis-Italian crewed aircraft but may have faced Italian built aircraft.

cool, I did not know the Italian air force veterans did that.

the answer I was thinking of was Belgium's CR.42s shooting down 3 or 4 Me109s and a couple Dornier bombers in May, 1940. So two answers on that one too.

ORIGINAL: brian brian

cool, I did not know the Italian air force veterans did that.

the answer I was thinking of was Belgium's CR.42s shooting down 3 or 4 Me109s and a couple Dornier bombers in May, 1940. So two answers on that one too.

But you asked about biplane on biplane, from memory, the 109 was a monoplane.

nah, question # 2 was where did Italian aircraft shoot down German aircraft. you doubled the # of correct answers. I kinda doubt the 43 Free Italians flew any CR.42s if they had any. it could do OK against early model Spitfires and Hurricanes, until the monoplane pilots figured out to always have altitude on the CR.42 guys. by 43 I wouldn't think it's advantage in turning radius would be enough to keep it safe any more.

ORIGINAL: JeffK

ORIGINAL: warspite1

ORIGINAL: wodin

Just reading through the thread and notice someone said a gurhka was the only soldier to win 2 VC's now if that is just WW2 fair enough but a young man from liverpool Noel Chavasse one two during WW1. One of them on the Somme.

Warspite1

There were two double winners from WWI - both members of the RAMC. In addition to
Noel Chavase, there was also Lt-Col Arthur Martin-Leake.[&o][&o]

The only combat soldier ever to be awarded the VC and bar was Charles Upham from New Zealand. He was awarded the first on Crete in 1941 and the Bar at Ruweisat Ridge in 1942.

As he was captured in the action on Ruweisat Ridge the secaond award was post war.

I dont remember the details but he had links to the 2 RAMC doctors who achieved this in WW2.

There were a few others who were nominated for a Bar to their VC but politics got in the way (Derrick)

Warspite1

See Post 102 [;)]

ORIGINAL: brian brian

outstanding work on the Normandie.

I hope someday we get a counter for it, though really you need 2 Queens to move a corps. Italy could get one too I think?

Warspite1

Thank-you.

I don't think the Normandie on her own would warrant a counter - as you say, at Corps level you would need two or more ships realistically.

Italy I think is a definite no no. Their two largest passenger ships. Rex (a Blue Riband winner in 1933) and Conte di Savoia were almost half the size of Queen Mary/Queen Elizabeth. I suspect that they would have struggled to transport a division between them.

They were little used (I don't think Rex was used at all) as troopships in the confined waters of the Mediterranean, and unsurprisingly neither lasted the war.

ORIGINAL: warspite1

ORIGINAL: JeffK

ORIGINAL: warspite1


Warspite1

There were two double winners from WWI - both members of the RAMC. In addition to
Noel Chavase, there was also Lt-Col Arthur Martin-Leake.[&o][&o]

The only combat soldier ever to be awarded the VC and bar was Charles Upham from New Zealand. He was awarded the first on Crete in 1941 and the Bar at Ruweisat Ridge in 1942.

As he was captured in the action on Ruweisat Ridge the secaond award was post war.

I dont remember the details but he had links to the 2 RAMC doctors who achieved this in WW2.

There were a few others who were nominated for a Bar to their VC but politics got in the way (Derrick)

Warspite1

See Post 102 [;)]

But thats 2455 posts back, I cant read that many!!!

This was from an English newspaper's letters page.The Daily Telegraph.

SIR – Those with experience of the old Stock Exchange floor will readily recall some of the nicknames (Letters, August 22) bestowed upon its habitués.
Among them were two brothers, both with highly distinguished military careers and both winners of the Military Cross, one with bar and one without.
The latter acquired the sobriquet of “The Coward”.

[font="times new roman"]In case you're not sure, its English humour.[/font]

OK, a few clues on the German plane bombing the German ship.

1. I think this plane and it's owner was discussed in this thread.

2. This plane has a WiF counter, though it is a German counter.

3. This plane was purchased from Lufthansa. Your first two guesses of that will most likely be wrong.

Ok I'm guessing: HE - 111

purchased from Lufthansa

And i'll do the FW-200 to get the second wrong one out of the way.

I asumed that Junkers Ju 52 would be among our two first guesses. But since it is not I bring it forward as candidate number three.

Lufthansa used He-111 ? But then I did not know they used the plane in question here. The Ju-52 and the FW-200 would be my first and only two guesses.

In December 1939 the South African Air Force used one of their Ju-86's to bomb a German ship in the South Atlantic. It was their first 'combat' operation of the war, though of course the German ship couldn't shoot back I don't think. The South Africans got their final Ju-86 fresh from Germany complete with new spare parts and technical manuals courtesy of the Vichy French in Djubuti handing it over to the Allies, though they had purchased about a dozen of them before the war, and once war started converted them to bombers. I think I first read about this in this thread at some point, but ran across more on it the other day.

Here is some other South African Air Force trivia you can maybe use somewhere else. They were the only air force in the Commonwealth not to use the word 'Royal' on the front of the name. As a result I think they used a different ... uh, uh, 'roundrel' than the others? Is that the right thing for the round thing on the plane that identifies what country it is from, the lo-tech version of today's IFF transponders?

Which aircraft that saw service during WW2 was produced in the most numbers.

Messerschmitt Bf109 in its various models.

ORIGINAL: ezz

Which aircraft that saw service during WW2 was produced in the most numbers.

Warspite1

Wasn't it a Soviet aircraft? Sturmovik?

Not 109.

Not Sturmovik either.

The wording of the question is important.