Matrix Games Forums

ORIGINAL: Nemo84

ORIGINAL: diamondspider

The easy fix is to resolve all of the player supply before building the private roads... solved.

Solves nothing. That just shifts the problem to the next turn, unless the player is micromanaging his supply in close enough detail to spot the issue before the next turn resolution.

ORIGINAL: Sieppo

It has been stated here before but please do not simple down the logistic system - it is what makes this game truly unique and deep, in addition to a lot of stuff also of course. You really get the feeling of managing your realm and I'd opt for even deeper options.

If the logistics system is automated at some point to a pull system for example, please let there be at least a choice to use the old one. I think this game should not be for "the masses", there are tens or hundreds of great simpler strategy games out there to start exploring the genre. I'm at my second game during a week at regular and probably due to luck it seems too easy ..

It will be a great option to remove AI built roads but of course you can also use these well when conquering. I think the only con is that of aesthetics. I never have found the traffic signs too hard or time consuming to use. You never know when you need that one stretch of road for supply. I like to think about what I do and mostly moving units and think about production stuff has been done in so many games in such a great way. IMO choke points created by the terrain in addition to the supply system are the most interesting things in this game.

The one issue that needs to be dealt with is the one with the private industry stealing half of your logistics points at will before you can catch and execute them. This should not be too hard to do but what do I know.

BTW I have huge variance in how much surplus I get into SHQ storage pretty much ever turn. I might get +1000 food one turn and -700 the next. Oil availability problem for truck stations etc?

ORIGINAL: Dampfnudel

ORIGINAL: Sieppo

It has been stated here before but please do not simple down the logistic system - it is what makes this game truly unique and deep, in addition to a lot of stuff also of course. You really get the feeling of managing your realm and I'd opt for even deeper options.

If the logistics system is automated at some point to a pull system for example, please let there be at least a choice to use the old one. I think this game should not be for "the masses", there are tens or hundreds of great simpler strategy games out there to start exploring the genre. I'm at my second game during a week at regular and probably due to luck it seems too easy ..

It will be a great option to remove AI built roads but of course you can also use these well when conquering. I think the only con is that of aesthetics. I never have found the traffic signs too hard or time consuming to use. You never know when you need that one stretch of road for supply. I like to think about what I do and mostly moving units and think about production stuff has been done in so many games in such a great way. IMO choke points created by the terrain in addition to the supply system are the most interesting things in this game.

The one issue that needs to be dealt with is the one with the private industry stealing half of your logistics points at will before you can catch and execute them. This should not be too hard to do but what do I know.

BTW I have huge variance in how much surplus I get into SHQ storage pretty much ever turn. I might get +1000 food one turn and -700 the next. Oil availability problem for truck stations etc?

Putting traffic signs is not complex. It is tedious micromanagement work. There is no decision making involved. A pull system takes away 0 decision making.

I am curious. How is blocking logistics from flowing into an empty road something you enjoy and why do you consider it a mind-breaking tactical decision?

ORIGINAL: Dampfnudel

ORIGINAL: Sieppo

It has been stated here before but please do not simple down the logistic system - it is what makes this game truly unique and deep, in addition to a lot of stuff also of course. You really get the feeling of managing your realm and I'd opt for even deeper options.

If the logistics system is automated at some point to a pull system for example, please let there be at least a choice to use the old one. I think this game should not be for "the masses", there are tens or hundreds of great simpler strategy games out there to start exploring the genre. I'm at my second game during a week at regular and probably due to luck it seems too easy ..

It will be a great option to remove AI built roads but of course you can also use these well when conquering. I think the only con is that of aesthetics. I never have found the traffic signs too hard or time consuming to use. You never know when you need that one stretch of road for supply. I like to think about what I do and mostly moving units and think about production stuff has been done in so many games in such a great way. IMO choke points created by the terrain in addition to the supply system are the most interesting things in this game.

The one issue that needs to be dealt with is the one with the private industry stealing half of your logistics points at will before you can catch and execute them. This should not be too hard to do but what do I know.

BTW I have huge variance in how much surplus I get into SHQ storage pretty much ever turn. I might get +1000 food one turn and -700 the next. Oil availability problem for truck stations etc?

Putting traffic signs is not complex. It is tedious micromanagement work. There is no decision making involved. A pull system takes away 0 decision making.

I am curious. How is blocking logistics from flowing into an empty road something you enjoy and why do you consider it a mind-breaking tactical decision?

ORIGINAL: Kamelpov

ORIGINAL: Dampfnudel

ORIGINAL: Sieppo

It has been stated here before but please do not simple down the logistic system - it is what makes this game truly unique and deep, in addition to a lot of stuff also of course. You really get the feeling of managing your realm and I'd opt for even deeper options.

If the logistics system is automated at some point to a pull system for example, please let there be at least a choice to use the old one. I think this game should not be for "the masses", there are tens or hundreds of great simpler strategy games out there to start exploring the genre. I'm at my second game during a week at regular and probably due to luck it seems too easy ..

It will be a great option to remove AI built roads but of course you can also use these well when conquering. I think the only con is that of aesthetics. I never have found the traffic signs too hard or time consuming to use. You never know when you need that one stretch of road for supply. I like to think about what I do and mostly moving units and think about production stuff has been done in so many games in such a great way. IMO choke points created by the terrain in addition to the supply system are the most interesting things in this game.

The one issue that needs to be dealt with is the one with the private industry stealing half of your logistics points at will before you can catch and execute them. This should not be too hard to do but what do I know.

BTW I have huge variance in how much surplus I get into SHQ storage pretty much ever turn. I might get +1000 food one turn and -700 the next. Oil availability problem for truck stations etc?

Putting traffic signs is not complex. It is tedious micromanagement work. There is no decision making involved. A pull system takes away 0 decision making.

I am curious. How is blocking logistics from flowing into an empty road something you enjoy and why do you consider it a mind-breaking tactical decision?

Sometime logistics going to that empty road is useful if you do strategic redeployment going here

ORIGINAL: MarbleToad

ORIGINAL: Kamelpov

ORIGINAL: Dampfnudel





Putting traffic signs is not complex. It is tedious micromanagement work. There is no decision making involved. A pull system takes away 0 decision making.

I am curious. How is blocking logistics from flowing into an empty road something you enjoy and why do you consider it a mind-breaking tactical decision?

Sometime logistics going to that empty road is useful if you do strategic redeployment going here

Exactly. If you dont have unused logistics, you cant strategic move accross your empire to counter a surprise attack or some other unforseen maneuver. In a multiplayer game, a player who has a perfectly efficient logistics system will have spent less resources, which is an advantage. But the player who has tons of redundancy and overlap will have a strategic advantage. Both equally interesting decisions. Right now, the current system lets you micromanage between these two different strategies as the landscape of the game evolves. Tight on resources or overextended? Plop down some traffic signs. Diplomatic dealings going south with all of your neighbors? Better have some redundancy. If you are always strapped for logistics, then you are likely overextending yourself.

ORIGINAL: MarbleToad

I haven't had any of these issues. Having played and enjoyed games like Factorio, Im no stranger to resolving thoughput issues. Maybe that has helped. I dont mean to sound harsh, but I wouldnt like the game to get easier to accomodate those who are having trouble with it. If some of us arent having issues with it, like the system, are challenged by it, and are still marching our ways to victory, there isnt anything fundamentally wrong with the system. Maybe a few tweaks would be nice, making a good system better, but overhauling would be a shame. Id be willing to play a pbem game against anyone who is having trouble. Maybe having a human player exploit your weaknesses and also demonstrating through example how to make logistics work might be helpful. Necessity is the mother of invention. Id say the same about the slavers/independent raiders everyone is complaining about as well.

ORIGINAL: Malevolence

I often wish for some kind of mobile staging base away from the SHQ. I would be willing to sacrifice the efficiency with a two turn delivery in exchange for a warehouse full-fillment feature. It also offers everyone a nice targets to disrupt or destroy.

ORIGINAL: Sieppo

ORIGINAL: Dampfnudel

ORIGINAL: Sieppo

It has been stated here before but please do not simple down the logistic system - it is what makes this game truly unique and deep, in addition to a lot of stuff also of course. You really get the feeling of managing your realm and I'd opt for even deeper options.

If the logistics system is automated at some point to a pull system for example, please let there be at least a choice to use the old one. I think this game should not be for "the masses", there are tens or hundreds of great simpler strategy games out there to start exploring the genre. I'm at my second game during a week at regular and probably due to luck it seems too easy ..

It will be a great option to remove AI built roads but of course you can also use these well when conquering. I think the only con is that of aesthetics. I never have found the traffic signs too hard or time consuming to use. You never know when you need that one stretch of road for supply. I like to think about what I do and mostly moving units and think about production stuff has been done in so many games in such a great way. IMO choke points created by the terrain in addition to the supply system are the most interesting things in this game.

The one issue that needs to be dealt with is the one with the private industry stealing half of your logistics points at will before you can catch and execute them. This should not be too hard to do but what do I know.

BTW I have huge variance in how much surplus I get into SHQ storage pretty much ever turn. I might get +1000 food one turn and -700 the next. Oil availability problem for truck stations etc?

Putting traffic signs is not complex. It is tedious micromanagement work. There is no decision making involved. A pull system takes away 0 decision making.

I am curious. How is blocking logistics from flowing into an empty road something you enjoy and why do you consider it a mind-breaking tactical decision?

For example: you block it for this turn but anticipate some of your units to be in the vicinity in some future turn and adjust it then. It makes you connect more with the game instead of everything being automatic or hidden, like somebody stated here before. I don't understand how you can like the game at all, if you don't enjoy micromanagement to at least some extend.

ORIGINAL: Nemo84

ORIGINAL: Sieppo

ORIGINAL: Dampfnudel





Putting traffic signs is not complex. It is tedious micromanagement work. There is no decision making involved. A pull system takes away 0 decision making.

I am curious. How is blocking logistics from flowing into an empty road something you enjoy and why do you consider it a mind-breaking tactical decision?

For example: you block it for this turn but anticipate some of your units to be in the vicinity in some future turn and adjust it then. It makes you connect more with the game instead of everything being automatic or hidden, like somebody stated here before. I don't understand how you can like the game at all, if you don't enjoy micromanagement to at least some extend.

The proper way to do that would be to have a button that extends supply to the one road you want it to redeploy to, instead of having to press a button for every road you don't want it to go.

Brainless micromanagement is neither strategy nor gameplay, and I haven't read a single counter-argument in these 11 pages that wouldn't be equally possible with far less hassle in a more intelligent supply system.

ORIGINAL: MarbleToad

ORIGINAL: Nemo84

ORIGINAL: Sieppo




For example: you block it for this turn but anticipate some of your units to be in the vicinity in some future turn and adjust it then. It makes you connect more with the game instead of everything being automatic or hidden, like somebody stated here before. I don't understand how you can like the game at all, if you don't enjoy micromanagement to at least some extend.

The proper way to do that would be to have a button that extends supply to the one road you want it to redeploy to, instead of having to press a button for every road you don't want it to go.

Brainless micromanagement is neither strategy nor gameplay, and I haven't read a single counter-argument in these 11 pages that wouldn't be equally possible with far less hassle in a more intelligent supply system.

Ok. Here is an example: If I have a single road from my city that branches into 16 roads that evenly supply a massive front(split in half, then again, then again). In your example, I need to click 16 times to tell my logistics where to go. But in the current system it is the default that they are all supplied. And what if I want to supply that front at places without the need, for strategic move. Even if it did both methods, but drew to where it is needed as an override system, it would still require me to micromanage something I dont have to right now. I dont mind micromanaging, as Ive said. Just giving an example of where your method is not better.

ORIGINAL: Nemo84

ORIGINAL: MarbleToad

ORIGINAL: Nemo84




The proper way to do that would be to have a button that extends supply to the one road you want it to redeploy to, instead of having to press a button for every road you don't want it to go.

Brainless micromanagement is neither strategy nor gameplay, and I haven't read a single counter-argument in these 11 pages that wouldn't be equally possible with far less hassle in a more intelligent supply system.

Ok. Here is an example: If I have a single road from my city that branches into 16 roads that evenly supply a massive front(split in half, then again, then again). In your example, I need to click 16 times to tell my logistics where to go. But in the current system it is the default that they are all supplied. And what if I want to supply that front at places without the need, for strategic move. Even if it did both methods, but drew to where it is needed as an override system, it would still require me to micromanage something I dont have to right now. I dont mind micromanaging, as Ive said. Just giving an example of where your method is not better.

And in your example you're still clicking more than 16 times in the current implementation: to close off the 50+ other dead-end roads that would otherwise prevent LPs from even arriving at this 16 branch road.

There will always be more road branches that don't need thousands of logistic points than you can ever conjure up branches that do.