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Banzai...it seems to take more than one hit to bring down a 4E beastie.

I don't know what triggers the decision to go banzai...would be nice if you could use low skill pilots doing it.

At this stage of the game, with a dominating, very powerful japanese airforce, this self-destructive behaviour just seems really silly. A design oversight. One,your game could have done without.

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Banzai...it seems to take more than one hit to bring down a 4E beastie.

I don't know what triggers the decision to go banzai...would be nice if you could use low skill pilots doing it.

The only rammings were against the B-25D and B-25J1/11. It seems it happens with the front gunned 2Es. I'm guessing because they were damaged in a frontal attack and rammed.

I tried setting planes above and below expected arrival altitude to hit them if the dove in low. The LR CAP set low seemed to lose more through Banzai attacks.

Still a great LR CAP day. Got about 3:1 with 100+ Allied bombers shot down. He's losing an unbelievable number of fighter and bomber pilots lately.

ORIGINAL: tolsdorff

At this stage of the game, with a dominating, very powerful japanese airforce, this self-destructive behaviour just seems really silly. A design oversight. One,your game could have done without.

I agree!! Although if in fact they were damaged only some would have made it to base anyway. In most cases I think it is a damaged plane that chooses to ram. I wonder if by ramming the game always sends the pilot to the KIA pool or if any would end up in WIA/MIA. I have the names so I guess I could check in a bit if I don't have a 1,000 other things to manage. [;)]

[font="Times New Roman"]July 6, 1945[/font]

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The Allies keep on bombing over the big bases, unfazed by the devastating LR CAP last turn in the mountains. It's really giving me opportunities as it's always hard to tell if the bases you've been bombing are really closed. Since the Allies have been hitting Hangchow more regularly, and slowing bombardments (after the CD gun damage to the BBs I haven't seen them again bombarding [;)]), Shanghai fields are open.

Tomorrow I'll try a huge LR CAP over Hangchow based in Shanghai and several surrounding bases. He's still flying a lot of fragile 1Es here, plus the usual 4E and 2E barrage. The Allies are still also employing B-29-25 for ground and airfield hits here in spite of being well in range of the entire Home Islands from both sides with sweepers.

He must have something up his sleeve, or simply isn't concerned with timing. Fine by me. The clock keeps ticking. Air losses are still permanent VP gains for the Japanese.
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AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR July 6, 1945
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Ground combat at Nanning (72,55)

Japanese Bombardment attack

Attacking force 6741 troops, 281 guns, 320 vehicles, Assault Value = 3876

Defending force 203611 troops, 2662 guns, 3538 vehicles, Assault Value = 4467

Japanese ground losses:
Guns lost 10 (2 destroyed, 8 disabled)

Allied ground losses:
160 casualties reported
Squads: 1 destroyed, 15 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 3 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 1 disabled
Guns lost 3 (1 destroyed, 2 disabled)
Vehicles lost 8 (3 destroyed, 5 disabled)

Assaulting units:
70th Division
55th Division
103rd Division
5th Division
2nd Division
105th Division
16th Division
18th Division
1st Ind. Engineer Regiment
55th Naval Guard Unit
48th Division
91st Naval Guard Unit
17th Medium Field Artillery Regiment
125th AA Regiment
53rd Construction Battalion
34th Field AA Battalion
14th Ind.Art.Mortar Battalion
11th Ind.Hvy.Art Battalion
2nd Medium Mortar Battalion
11th Shipping Engineer Regiment
6th Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
8th Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
Tonei Hvy Gun Regiment
23rd Medium Field Artillery Regiment
11th Air Defense AA Battalion
113th AA Regiment
4th RF Gun Battalion
38th Ind. Engineer Regiment
3rd RF Gun Battalion
18th Medium Field Artillery Regiment
1st Air Defense AA Battalion
3rd Medium Field Artillery Regiment
24th JNAF AF Unit
56th Field AA Battalion
6th RF Gun Battalion
112th AA Regiment
7th Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
16th Army
5th Mortar Battalion
115th AA Regiment
1st JAAF Base Force
88th JAAF AF Coy

Defending units:
11th Indian Division
255th Indian Tank Brigade
3rd Carabiniers Regiment
1st New Chinese Corps
3rd Cavalry Regiment
254th Armoured Brigade
7th Indian Division
32nd Infantry Division
150th RAC Regiment
Americal Infantry Division
14th Army Engineer Battalion
754th Tank Battalion
26th Indian Division
7th Australian Division
Provisionl Tank Brigade
27th Infantry Division
6th Australian Division
XV Corps Engineer Battalion
3rd New Chinese Corps
185 Wing
2nd Ceylon H AA Regiment
17th Indian Light AA Regiment
18th SP Field Artillery Regiment
2nd Indian AA Bde
134th Field Artillery Battalion
101st Heavy AA Regiment
XXXIII Indian Corps
122nd British AT Gun Regiment
1st RM Heavy AA Regiment
22nd Indian Mountain Gun Regiment
2/11th Field Regiment
29th Indian Mountain Gun Regiment
77th Coast AA Regiment
184th USAAF Base Force
134th Medium Regiment
6th Medium Regiment
8th Mahratta AT Gun Regiment
170 Wing
86th Coast AA Regiment
1st USMC Field Artillery Battalion
24th Indian Mountain Gun Regiment
21st Indian Mountain Gun Regiment
2nd USMC Field Artillery Battalion
1/198th Coast AA Battalion

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Ground combat at Johore Bahru (50,83)

Allied Bombardment attack

Attacking force 100134 troops, 1523 guns, 1399 vehicles, Assault Value = 2918

Defending force 59725 troops, 485 guns, 284 vehicles, Assault Value = 1605

Japanese ground losses:
29 casualties reported
Squads: 2 destroyed, 2 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Vehicles lost 7 (4 destroyed, 3 disabled)

Allied ground losses:
27 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 3 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled

Assaulting units:
2nd British Division
81st (West African) Division
268th Motorised Brigade
11th (East African) Division
Gardner's Horse Regiment
25th Indian Division
475th USA Regiment
45th Indian Brigade
236th Combat Engineer Regiment
20th Indian Division
17th Motorised Division
8th Indian Division
181st Field Artillery Regiment
168th Field Artillery Regiment
2/13th Field Regiment
6th USMC Field Artillery Battalion
12th Indian Heavy AA Regiment
XXXIV Indian Corps
88th Medium Regiment
Southeast Asia
134th (East Ang) Regiment
3rd West African AA Regiment
1st Indian Medium Regiment
56th Heavy AA Regiment
III Indian Corps
20th Indian Heavy AA Regiment
55th Heavy Regiment
2nd Indian Medium Regiment
2/9th Field Regiment
23rd Indian Mountain Gun Regiment
2nd HK&S Heavy AA Regiment
14th Army
3rd (Special Force) Division

Defending units:
4th Tank Regiment
2nd Amphibious Brigade
Kure 3rd SNLF
Yokosuka 4th SNLF /2
26th Tank Regiment
49th Tank Battalion
21st Ind.Mixed Brigade
29th Ind.Mixed Brigade
2nd South Seas Det.
Sasebo 8th SNLF
5th INA Regiment
2nd INA Gandhi Regiment
4th Ind.Mixed Regiment
4th Raiding Regiment
44th Naval Guard Unit
27th Ind.Mixed Brigade
65th Brigade
4th INA Nehru Regiment
120th Div /2
17th JAAF AF Bn
105th JAAF AF Bn
3rd Mortar Battalion
1st RF Gun Battalion
89th JAAF AF Bn
94th JAAF AF Bn
91st JAAF AF Bn
201st JAAF AF Bn
28th JAAF AF Bn
80th JAAF AF Bn
23rd JAAF AF Bn /1

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Ground combat at Nanning (72,55)

Allied Bombardment attack

Attacking force 7364 troops, 302 guns, 256 vehicles, Assault Value = 4444

Defending force 150489 troops, 1413 guns, 833 vehicles, Assault Value = 3876

Japanese ground losses:
23 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 5 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Allied ground losses:
Guns lost 14 (2 destroyed, 12 disabled)
Vehicles lost 3 (1 destroyed, 2 disabled)

Assaulting units:
255th Indian Tank Brigade
1st New Chinese Corps
7th Indian Division
27th Infantry Division
Americal Infantry Division
254th Armoured Brigade
150th RAC Regiment
11th Indian Division
26th Indian Division
XV Corps Engineer Battalion
754th Tank Battalion
Provisionl Tank Brigade
6th Australian Division
7th Australian Division
3rd Cavalry Regiment
3rd Carabiniers Regiment
14th Army Engineer Battalion
32nd Infantry Division
3rd New Chinese Corps
8th Mahratta AT Gun Regiment
184th USAAF Base Force
2nd USMC Field Artillery Battalion
86th Coast AA Regiment
134th Medium Regiment
185 Wing
170 Wing
21st Indian Mountain Gun Regiment
XXXIII Indian Corps
2nd Ceylon H AA Regiment
134th Field Artillery Battalion
6th Medium Regiment
29th Indian Mountain Gun Regiment
18th SP Field Artillery Regiment
122nd British AT Gun Regiment
24th Indian Mountain Gun Regiment
1st RM Heavy AA Regiment
101st Heavy AA Regiment
2/11th Field Regiment
77th Coast AA Regiment
17th Indian Light AA Regiment
2nd Indian AA Bde
1st USMC Field Artillery Battalion
22nd Indian Mountain Gun Regiment
1/198th Coast AA Battalion

Defending units:
1st Ind. Engineer Regiment
18th Division
103rd Division
105th Division
55th Division
5th Division
48th Division
2nd Division
70th Division
16th Division
55th Naval Guard Unit
91st Naval Guard Unit
8th Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
34th Field AA Battalion
1st Air Defense AA Battalion
2nd Medium Mortar Battalion
23rd Medium Field Artillery Regiment
18th Medium Field Artillery Regiment
7th Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
6th Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
11th Ind.Hvy.Art Battalion
17th Medium Field Artillery Regiment
11th Air Defense AA Battalion
125th AA Regiment
14th Ind.Art.Mortar Battalion
4th RF Gun Battalion
6th RF Gun Battalion
115th AA Regiment
5th Mortar Battalion
16th Army
112th AA Regiment
11th Shipping Engineer Regiment
3rd RF Gun Battalion
Tonei Hvy Gun Regiment
1st JAAF Base Force
24th JNAF AF Unit
38th Ind. Engineer Regiment
53rd Construction Battalion
56th Field AA Battalion
113th AA Regiment
3rd Medium Field Artillery Regiment
88th JAAF AF Coy

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A little look at the economic situation. Supply is still reducing daily, but it's not critical yet. Just annoying. I am getting a lot more oil and resources to the Home Islands in the next few weeks to hopefully build a last reserve. We'll see.

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Banzai...it seems to take more than one hit to bring down a 4E beastie.

I don't know what triggers the decision to go banzai...would be nice if you could use low skill pilots doing it.

In theory, you could get low skill pilots to do so but for practical game reasons they are most unlikely to succeed.

Ramming attacks are a poor mans version of kamikaze attacks. Bear in mind there are some significant differences between the two types of "kamikaze" attacks.


Kamikaze and ramming "kamikaze" comparison

1. True Kamikazes can not be triggered before 1 January 1944 whereas the ramming "kamikazes" can occur before 1944.

2. True Kamikazes expend the entire group although the results are determined on an individual aircraft attack basis. Ramming "kamikazes" involve only single aircraft which successfully meet the qualification criteria.

3. True Kamikazes only attack ships. Ramming "kamikazes" can strike at bombers in addition to ships, although in practice they are most likely witnessed in bomber attacks.


Ramming "kamikaze" conditions

A. The chance of a ramming "kamikaze" attack occurring increases each year. By 1945 it was almost a certainty that they would occur so patch #4 reduced the odds of their appearance down.

B. Only an already highly damaged Japanese fighter which is unlikely to return to base is eligible for consideration to undertake a ramming "kamikaze" attack. An undamaged fighter will never qualify.

C. To qualify for a ramming "kamikaze" attack, the fighter must

• have damage >80% of the value of it's durability rating
• pass the year based ramming check

D. The damage to a bomber inflicted by a ramming "kamikaze" aircraft is relative (and randomised) to the durability of the fighter. There is no guarantee that any damage will actually result directly from the attack. Usually the bomber will need to already be damaged for it to succumb to the ramming. A combination of aggregated damage from flak, air to air combat and from the rammer will usually be required for the bomber to crash on the return trip (or far less likely during the Combat Animation).

E. A ramming pilot has a chance to survive the encounter.



It is very important to understand that a ramming "kamikaze" attack involves, in almost all instances, a Japanese fighter which would not survive the return trip to base and the attendant pilot loss rates. It is therefore a bonus last opportunity for an already doomed fighter to cause some extra damage which will probably show up in Allied operational bomber losses.

Alfred

ORIGINAL: Alfred

E. A ramming pilot has a chance to survive the encounter.

It is very important to understand that a ramming "kamikaze" attack involves, in almost all instances, a Japanese fighter which would not survive the return trip to base and the attendant pilot loss rates. It is therefore a bonus last opportunity for an already doomed fighter to cause some extra damage which will probably show up in Allied operational bomber losses.

Alfred

Good news! Thanks Alfred. I'd thought I remembered some of this but your confirmation is very helpful. Eases my mind a bit about the pilots too. Most combat these days is above my troops or bases.

That might also explain the predominance of ramming against only the B-25 variants? Weren't these late war B-25 variants fitted with multiple forward-facing .50cal guns for airfield strafing? If these are being calculated in the bomber defense fire role, perhaps that atypically heavy damage to enemy fighters is inducing the 'ramming check'?

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy

That might also explain the predominance of ramming against only the B-25 variants? Weren't these late war B-25 variants fitted with multiple forward-facing .50cal guns for airfield strafing? If these are being calculated in the bomber defense fire role, perhaps that atypically heavy damage to enemy fighters is inducing the 'ramming check'?

Yes. My theory exactly.

It's well known that the variants beginning with B-25D1 are defensively overpowered in game due to the huge set of 50cal guns in the nose. These were used against fighters in the war and were occasionally effective, but in game it can be crazy. They have much more effect than many bombers that have multiple defensive turrets and gun ports.

At any rate, it's fine with me as long as they get taken down, and interestingly the B-251/11 and A-26 Invader have seemed to suffer proportionately more losses than other bombers lately. Even better if his bomber pilots go KIA/MIA and mine are often just WIA.

I still get a kick out of the VP difference in 4EB versus 2EB. Trading a B-17/24/29 for a fighter is a 2:1 losing proposition. You'd think there would be a more discerning realization about the VP trade off when he's trying to close a certain VP gap within the next month and a half of game time.

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy

That might also explain the predominance of ramming against only the B-25 variants? Weren't these late war B-25 variants fitted with multiple forward-facing .50cal guns for airfield strafing? If these are being calculated in the bomber defense fire role, perhaps that atypically heavy damage to enemy fighters is inducing the 'ramming check'?

Correct.

It will be very rare to see a British/Commonwealth, or 1E Allied bomber the subject of a ramming "kamikaze" attack as their defensive fire is light in relative terms and unlikely to get the fighter damage level up high enough. Attack and 4E bombers on the other hand have heavy defensive fire, particularly if the fighter attack vector is front on against an attack bomber. The fighter attack vector chosen is randomised and not within player control.

The defensive fire effect of the forward firing guns of attack bombers was toned down a little in a patch but it cannot be totally eliminated without a significant rewriting effort.

Alfred

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy

I still get a kick out of the VP difference in 4EB versus 2EB. Trading a B-17/24/29 for a fighter is a 2:1 losing proposition. You'd think there would be a more discerning realization about the VP trade off when he's trying to close a certain VP gap within the next month and a half of game time.

It is even worse than that as the 2VP goes to the denominator thereby requiring a 4 VP to go to the numerator just to stabilise it back to an Auto Victory by 31 August 1945.

At this stage even an overall net 2:1 exchange in favour of the Allies is insufficient. In practical terms the Allies need a gross 4:1 device exchange to get that overall net 2:1.

I said months ago I didn't think the Allies would bridge the gap by 31 August 1945. I am increasingly of the view that they won't even get to 2:1 by the end of March 1946. The likelihood of the game ending with an official draw or even a marginal Japanese victory is very much in play unless Soviet activation results in massive Soviet gains.

Alfred

[font="Times New Roman"]July 7, 1945[/font]

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The Allies step right into the muck at Hangchow on the 7th. A 125 plane LR CAP met the one sweeping group of Corsairs, decimated them, and had 115 left to meet the first 1E bombing run. The CAP lasted through many waves and took out bombers and escorts of all types in big numbers. The ramming here was often against B-29s, which I support completely! [:)]

On the day the Allies lost 140+ aircraft to only 41 for the Japanese.
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AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR July 7, 1945
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Amphibious Assault at Misool (80,108)

TF 357 troops unloading over beach at Misool, 80,108

Allied ground losses:
7 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 6 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

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Amphibious Assault at Kiungshan (71,61)

TF 455 troops unloading over beach at Kiungshan, 71,61

Allied ground losses:
239 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 42 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 67 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

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Morning Air attack on Hangchow , at 90,55

Weather in hex: Clear sky

Raid spotted at 26 NM, estimated altitude 21,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 9 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A7M2 Sam x 29
J2M5 Jack x 19
N1K5-J George x 29
Ki-83 x 13
Ki-84r Frank x 28
Ki-100-II Tony x 7

Allied aircraft
F4U-1A Corsair x 33

Japanese aircraft losses
A7M2 Sam: 1 destroyed
N1K5-J George: 1 destroyed
Ki-83: 1 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
F4U-1A Corsair: 10 destroyed

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Morning Air attack on Hangchow , at 90,55

Weather in hex: Clear sky

Raid detected at 74 NM, estimated altitude 18,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 33 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A7M2 Sam x 27
J2M5 Jack x 18
N1K5-J George x 28
Ki-83 x 10
Ki-84r Frank x 27
Ki-100-II Tony x 5

Allied aircraft
F4U-1D Corsair x 1
F-6D Mustang x 18
P-38L Lightning x 18
P-51D Mustang x 3
TBM-1C Avenger x 23

Japanese aircraft losses
N1K5-J George: 1 destroyed
Ki-100-II Tony: 1 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
F4U-1D Corsair: 1 destroyed
F-6D Mustang: 6 destroyed
P-38L Lightning: 9 destroyed
P-51D Mustang: 2 destroyed
TBM-1C Avenger: 4 destroyed

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Morning Air attack on Hangchow , at 90,55

Weather in hex: Clear sky

Raid spotted at 20 NM, estimated altitude 17,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 9 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A7M2 Sam x 20
J2M5 Jack x 13
N1K5-J George x 21
Ki-83 x 10
Ki-84r Frank x 23
Ki-100-II Tony x 2

Allied aircraft
TBM-3 Avenger x 17

No Japanese losses

Allied aircraft losses
TBM-3 Avenger: 7 destroyed

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Morning Air attack on Hangchow , at 90,55

Weather in hex: Clear sky

Raid detected at 68 NM, estimated altitude 15,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 20 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A7M2 Sam x 19
J2M5 Jack x 13
N1K5-J George x 21
Ki-83 x 10
Ki-84r Frank x 21
Ki-100-II Tony x 2

Allied aircraft
Liberator B.VI x 11
Liberator GR.VI x 9
F4U-1D Corsair x 14
A-20G Havoc x 14
A-26B Invader x 29
B-24J Liberator x 23
B-29-25 Superfort x 25
P-51D Mustang x 10
PBJ-1D Mitchell x 22
PBJ-1J Mitchell x 11
PV-2 Harpoon x 15

Japanese aircraft losses
J2M5 Jack: 2 destroyed
Ki-84r Frank: 1 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
Liberator B.VI: 11 damaged
Liberator GR.VI: 3 damaged
F4U-1D Corsair: 4 destroyed
A-20G Havoc: 1 destroyed, 1 damaged
A-26B Invader: 1 destroyed, 4 damaged
B-24J Liberator: 1 destroyed, 10 damaged
B-24J Liberator: 1 destroyed by flak
B-29-25 Superfort: 1 destroyed, 15 damaged
B-29-25 Superfort: 1 destroyed by flak
P-51D Mustang: 5 destroyed
PBJ-1D Mitchell: 6 damaged
PBJ-1J Mitchell: 4 damaged

Japanese ground losses:
26 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 3 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled

Airbase hits 17
Airbase supply hits 3
Runway hits 71

Aircraft Attacking:
10 x PBJ-1D Mitchell bombing from 10000 feet
Airfield Attack: 6 x 500 lb GP Bomb

Banzai! - Kamei G. in a Ki-84r Frank rams a A-26B Invader for the Emperor
Banzai! - Shimizu, K. in a J2M5 Jack rams a B-29-25 Superfort for the Emperor
Banzai! - Doikawa V. in a J2M5 Jack rams a PV-2 Harpoon for the Emperor

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Morning Air attack on Hangchow , at 90,55

Weather in hex: Clear sky

Raid detected at 69 NM, estimated altitude 12,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 30 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A7M2 Sam x 11
J2M5 Jack x 7
N1K5-J George x 16
Ki-83 x 8
Ki-84r Frank x 7
Ki-100-II Tony x 1

Allied aircraft
Liberator B.VI x 4
Liberator GR.VI x 3
A-26B Invader x 64
B-24J Liberator x 11
B-29-25 Superfort x 11
PB4Y-2 Privateer x 11

Japanese aircraft losses
A7M2 Sam: 2 destroyed
J2M5 Jack: 1 destroyed
N1K5-J George: 1 destroyed
Ki-84r Frank: 2 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
Liberator B.VI: 4 damaged
Liberator GR.VI: 2 damaged
A-26B Invader: 4 destroyed, 18 damaged
A-26B Invader: 1 destroyed by flak
B-24J Liberator: 5 damaged
B-29-25 Superfort: 7 damaged
PB4Y-2 Privateer: 4 damaged

Airbase hits 15
Airbase supply hits 2
Runway hits 31

Aircraft Attacking:
11 x PB4Y-2 Privateer bombing from 10000 feet
Airfield Attack: 8 x 500 lb GP Bomb

Banzai! - Tokuda B. in a A7M2 Sam rams a B-29-25 Superfort for the Emperor

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Morning Air attack on Hangchow , at 90,55

Weather in hex: Clear sky

Raid detected at 80 NM, estimated altitude 11,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 27 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A7M2 Sam x 4
J2M5 Jack x 3
N1K5-J George x 5
Ki-83 x 6
Ki-84r Frank x 1

Allied aircraft
Corsair IV x 16
B-29-25 Superfort x 18
PB4Y-1 Liberator x 12
PV-1 Ventura x 6

Japanese aircraft losses
J2M5 Jack: 1 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
Corsair IV: 1 destroyed
B-29-25 Superfort: 14 damaged
PB4Y-1 Liberator: 4 damaged
PV-1 Ventura: 2 damaged
PV-1 Ventura: 1 destroyed by flak

Airbase hits 1
Runway hits 15

Aircraft Attacking:
12 x PB4Y-1 Liberator bombing from 10000 feet
Airfield Attack: 10 x 500 lb GP Bomb

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Morning Air attack on Hangchow , at 90,55

Weather in hex: Clear sky

Raid detected at 47 NM, estimated altitude 15,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 16 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A7M2 Sam x 4
N1K5-J George x 2
Ki-83 x 4

Allied aircraft
B-24J Liberator x 10
B-29-25 Superfort x 9

No Japanese losses

Allied aircraft losses
B-24J Liberator: 8 damaged
B-24J Liberator: 1 destroyed by flak
B-29-25 Superfort: 5 damaged
B-29-25 Superfort: 1 destroyed by flak

Japanese ground losses:
10 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Airbase hits 1
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 5

Aircraft Attacking:
10 x B-24J Liberator bombing from 10000 feet
Airfield Attack: 10 x 500 lb GP Bomb

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Ground combat at Nanning (72,55)

Japanese Bombardment attack

Attacking force 6753 troops, 279 guns, 320 vehicles, Assault Value = 3874

Defending force 204096 troops, 2659 guns, 3534 vehicles, Assault Value = 4524

Japanese ground losses:
Guns lost 15 (1 destroyed, 14 disabled)
Vehicles lost 3 (1 destroyed, 2 disabled)

Allied ground losses:
250 casualties reported
Squads: 5 destroyed, 12 disabled
Non Combat: 2 destroyed, 5 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 1 disabled
Guns lost 12 (3 destroyed, 9 disabled)
Vehicles lost 18 (15 destroyed, 3 disabled)

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Ground combat at Johore Bahru (50,83)

Allied Bombardment attack

Attacking force 117170 troops, 1798 guns, 1557 vehicles, Assault Value = 3047

Defending force 59524 troops, 485 guns, 280 vehicles, Assault Value = 1595

Japanese ground losses:
99 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 9 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Vehicles lost 3 (2 destroyed, 1 disabled)

Allied ground losses:
12 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Vehicles lost 2 (1 destroyed, 1 disabled)

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Ground combat at Kiungshan (71,61)

Allied Shock attack

Attacking force 116 troops, 2 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 60

Defending force 0 troops, 0 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 0

Allied adjusted assault: 10

Japanese adjusted defense: 1

Allied assault odds: 10 to 1 (fort level 3)

Allied forces CAPTURE Kiungshan !!!

Combat modifiers
Attacker: shock(+)

Assaulting units:
111th Chindit Bde /5
77th Indian Para Bde /1

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Your a2a results are amazing for this stage of the game.[&o]

Were there no offensive sweeps prior to the bombings?

ORIGINAL: mind_messing

Were there no offensive sweeps prior to the bombings?

He had a couple of sweeps before that one, but the DS is away, so the fighters may be used protecting Allied bases in China primarily right now. He might guess that I was thinking of launching a massive bombing campaign to hit the 500 bombers here on a non-rail linked base. Which I was, but decided to LR CAP instead. [;)]

He has been fairly successful setting a few sweeps and then massive escort with many of his strikes in the past 6 months. The escorts were doing okay, but this was a more concerted effort in defence and there weren't enough sweepers ahead of time. He also continued to set them at 16k from the previous few turns so I layered my CAP just above that and was able to get a very good jump on the sweep.

My suspicion is also that the quality of pilots is not what it used to be in the USN/USMC/USAAF fighter groups.

ORIGINAL: Miller

Your a2a results are amazing for this stage of the game.[&o]

Cheers. It's the thing I worked toward the entire game knowing the KB was less a dominant force, and to try and fix some long term mistakes in planning from my last late effort.

The low layered CAP has really changed the game and made both sides have to adjust to each other continuously. It's hard for an Allied player to not be able to rely on brute force of P-47/P-51/F4U sweeping in the late game. There are other ways to fight the air war though, and when focused on a target he can get good results, but often it takes a few turns to see those play out, and by then he seems to try something else. I've been able to consistently bring in fresh groups to make up for losses and damaged planes.

My pools are growing now, and by recent count the Allies have lost close to 1,800 airframes in the past three weeks! [X(]

[font="Times New Roman"]July 8, 1945[/font]

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On the 8th the Allies get back to naval bombardments against Shanghai, and in the daytime send retribution strikes at the base. I flew out all CAP and withdrew the damaged. Nothing here to hit today. I did leave one group of Ki-83 on CAP but forgot to raise their altitude. Damn. Lost about 15 for only about 5 Corsairs.

It looks like the Allies are leaving Nanning!! A big win here. Getting those troops disabled, hitting them hard with bombardments for 4-5 turns and now being able to turn and use my now ultra-experienced defenders elsewhere is huge. I'll leave much smaller bockade here, but forts are still 6, terrain is still x2, and if he ever crosses again I'll be stunned. This releases about 2k AV of 85+ EXP IDs and the best arty units in game to the defence of the Southern Chinese capitals and Canton (2k AV now) and Hong Kong (1.5k AV now), with reserves in Kukong (300 AV now).

The Allies are slowly moving a lot of their force toward Nanking from the blocking hex NW of Hangchow. There is still no movement North from here though, but I'm sure it will happen soon. He'll have a free run up to Peiping and Tsientian. There is a force there and at Sinyang (able to rail to support) but I have to make sure rail lines are good. Allied bombing can easily wreck one of the Chinese units so I'll add a bit more in each node.

Still bombing at Singapore and Johore Baru, but no further attacks. It seems like the RN CVs might have popped through into the South China Sea and gone toward the Chinese coast to link with the DS, but my search is spotty to try and reduce losses. Either way nothing seems to be threatening supply lines or the DEI resource bases at the moment.
[font="Trebuchet MS"]--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR July 8, 1945
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Night Naval bombardment of Shanghai at 92,55

Allied Ships
CA Canberra II
CL Astoria II
DD Remey
DD Pringle
DD Mullany
DD McNair
DD Heermann

Japanese ground losses:
20 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Fires 1
Airbase hits 1
Runway hits 15
Port hits 1
Port fuel hits 1

OS2U-3 Kingfisher acting as spotter for CA Canberra II
CA Canberra II firing at 89th Ind.Mixed Brigade

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Morning Air attack on Shanghai , at 92,55

Weather in hex: Light rain

Raid spotted at 28 NM, estimated altitude 37,900 feet.
Estimated time to target is 10 minutes

Japanese aircraft
Ki-83 x 28

Allied aircraft
F4U-1A Corsair x 11

Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-83: 6 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
F4U-1A Corsair: 1 destroyed

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Morning Air attack on Shanghai , at 92,55

Weather in hex: Light rain

Raid detected at 39 NM, estimated altitude 45,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 11 minutes

Allied aircraft
P-47N Thunderbolt x 18

No Allied losses

Aircraft Attacking:
18 x P-47N Thunderbolt sweeping at 42000 feet



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Morning Air attack on Hangchow , at 90,55

Weather in hex: Partial cloud

Raid detected at 13 NM, estimated altitude 45,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 3 minutes

Allied aircraft
P-47N Thunderbolt x 22

No Allied losses

Aircraft Attacking:
22 x P-47N Thunderbolt sweeping at 42000 feet

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Morning Air attack on Hangchow , at 90,55

Weather in hex: Partial cloud

Raid detected at 65 NM, estimated altitude 17,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 28 minutes

Allied aircraft
P-51D Mustang x 11
P-38L Lightning x 25
P-51D Mustang x 22
SB2C-3 Helldiver x 27
TBM-3 Avenger x 18

Allied aircraft losses
SB2C-3 Helldiver: 12 damaged
SB2C-3 Helldiver: 1 destroyed by flak
TBM-3 Avenger: 4 damaged
TBM-3 Avenger: 1 destroyed by flak

Japanese ground losses:
10 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Airbase hits 1
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 11

Aircraft Attacking:
7 x SB2C-3 Helldiver releasing from 2000'
Airfield Attack: 1 x 1000 lb GP Bomb, 2 x 250 lb GP Bomb

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Ground combat at Nanning (72,55)

Japanese Bombardment attack

Attacking force 6741 troops, 278 guns, 319 vehicles, Assault Value = 3887

Defending force 189262 troops, 2620 guns, 2371 vehicles, Assault Value = 3893

Japanese ground losses:
Guns lost 12 (3 destroyed, 9 disabled)
Vehicles lost 12 (5 destroyed, 7 disabled)

Allied ground losses:
480 casualties reported
Squads: 16 destroyed, 41 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled
Guns lost 21 (1 destroyed, 20 disabled)

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Ground combat at Johore Bahru (50,83)

Allied Bombardment attack

Attacking force 117355 troops, 1798 guns, 1556 vehicles, Assault Value = 3060

Defending force 59673 troops, 487 guns, 282 vehicles, Assault Value = 1592

Japanese ground losses:
46 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 6 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Vehicles lost 7 (3 destroyed, 4 disabled)

Allied ground losses:
16 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled


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It seems like no invasion is currently moving with the DS, but hard to tell. This does look like the RN DS joining in though.

ORIGINAL: obvert

ORIGINAL: Miller

Your a2a results are amazing for this stage of the game.[&o]

Cheers. It's the thing I worked toward the entire game knowing the KB was less a dominant force, and to try and fix some long term mistakes in planning from my last late effort.

The low layered CAP has really changed the game and made both sides have to adjust to each other continuously. It's hard for an Allied player to not be able to rely on brute force of P-47/P-51/F4U sweeping in the late game. There are other ways to fight the air war though, and when focused on a target he can get good results, but often it takes a few turns to see those play out, and by then he seems to try something else. I've been able to consistently bring in fresh groups to make up for losses and damaged planes.

My pools are growing now, and by recent count the Allies have lost close to 1,800 airframes in the past three weeks! [X(]

Tell me more about this layered CAP [&o]

ORIGINAL: mind_messing

ORIGINAL: obvert

ORIGINAL: Miller

Your a2a results are amazing for this stage of the game.[&o]

Cheers. It's the thing I worked toward the entire game knowing the KB was less a dominant force, and to try and fix some long term mistakes in planning from my last late effort.

The low layered CAP has really changed the game and made both sides have to adjust to each other continuously. It's hard for an Allied player to not be able to rely on brute force of P-47/P-51/F4U sweeping in the late game. There are other ways to fight the air war though, and when focused on a target he can get good results, but often it takes a few turns to see those play out, and by then he seems to try something else. I've been able to consistently bring in fresh groups to make up for losses and damaged planes.

My pools are growing now, and by recent count the Allies have lost close to 1,800 airframes in the past three weeks! [X(]

Tell me more about this layered CAP [&o]

Lowpe had started looking into layering CAP based on some of Alfred's comments on how to counteract high P-47 sweeps. Essentially any fast high altitude sweep that usually decimates the more fragile, lower altitude Japanese planes. Zoom and boom.

So the low layered CAP is at heart just a way to take away the speed advantage by getting fast planes to fly in lower altitudes in order to maximise the higher manoeuvre of the defenders. It is also geared to allow supporting groups to fly at different complementary altitude bands, and works best with at least there groups at three bands at zero hex bleed and good radar in the base. It has to be done in layers that are tight though to make sure as the sweeps dive on the lowest band the higher ones have time to quickly dive in and get the bounce on the sweepers.

I didn't believe it at first, but then remembered a certain time I accidentally had only my lowest bands flying against Jocke in the late game and saw Sam's wipe out a P-47N sweep. I couldn't replicate it though until I read about what Lowpe was trying.

So I tried some tests. Here is the evidence. It works. [;)]
http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4047529

I've played around a bit, but the most successful for me is 5k (maneuveralbe high defence and air skill: Oscar, A6M8 but can be Georges, Jacks or Franks too), 7k (high defence and better airframes with good armament to kill when diving in: Tojo, Sam, Tony-II and Jack) and 9k (best airframes and pilots with high speeds and best guns: Franks and Georges usually).

Only use three bands. Try it first with only three groups (and I mean against anything that comes. If you mess with too many at first you lose the nuance).

I also find that if you set a 70% CAP at 9k, 60% at 7k and only 50% with 20% rest at 5k it tends to work better. Zero hex bleed).

Lowpe uses it against me, and so does Loka(!) in my Allied games. It is tough but I've found some ways to combat it too. It just allows the mix to become more complex because you have to change altitudes rather than constantly setting to max and letting them rip.

Canoe has figured out some better methods, but once he does I change it up, and I've been even layering up higher against other planes (Corsairs are tough since they have high speed, good guns and higher manoeuvre even in the low bands. Same for Spit VIII).