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RE: The truth about supply
Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 8:17 pm
by mdiehl
Of course, Tristanjohn, on reflection I think it might be almost as good to provide the inspiration for an offed Nevernever lackey in a forthcoming Jim Butcher novel.
RE: The truth about supply
Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 8:21 pm
by Oznoyng
ORIGINAL: Ron Saueracker
Again, this is coming down to a bash Ron or any other critic exercise, regardless if they have good intentions or not. This does not do the game any darn good.
Show me once where I called you a pig headed, idiotic, know-it-all with no factual basis for any of your wild assertions, oatmeal-brained puss-face too drunk on paint thinner to know the difference between a meatball and dog dung. There, I didn;t. Ergo, no Ron bashing.
No one is attacking you or bashing *you*. No Adhominem attacks, just refutations of your arguments and questioning your sources. The funny thing is, because we don't agree with you, and because we have the temerity to challenge your position, we are bashing you. On the other hand, none of us are claiming to be bashed in return.
Here is my challenge Ron: Take the stock scenario. Play against the AI. Ship in no supply beyond what you capture - and see how far you get. Post your AAR turn by turn and let us see how fast you advance.
RE: The truth about supply
Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 8:23 pm
by Tristanjohn
ORIGINAL: Nikademus
Like Nike says....."just do it"
[center]
[font="Times New Roman"]"With them on or off?"[/font]
RE: The truth about supply
Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 8:25 pm
by Rob322
ORIGINAL: mdiehl
yer flogging a dead horse and the crowd is starting to disperse.
Sssshhhhh! Some of us are enjoying this thread for the sheer insanity of it. Lots of shots, no hits, no victors, no losers, just perpetual combat! It's like the old Star Trek episode where the flashlight beam they projected on the wall took over the Enterprise and made the crew and Klingons fight forever, reanimating dead corpses when needed. Sure nothing will change, the designers won't change the game and the guys complaining won't play a game to try and prove their points but it'll be fun to watch nonetheless.
RE: The truth about supply
Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 8:26 pm
by Ron Saueracker
ORIGINAL: Nikademus
ORIGINAL: Ron Saueracker
Cutting supply in half and capacities in half using a respected mod/map that already reduces the ease of the logistics model is going to make people think that it was not a fair test?[:)] I'm not about to frigging install another version of this game to use the stock version.
Then shut up. Your not willing to prove it using Stock which most people use and that of which you rant about in every thread you post in regardless of what the subject of said thread is.
What would your A2A mod do to the test? Nada...
I agree....but then again i'm not the one who suggested stripping my A2A changes onto the alleged AAR your obviously not going to commit too. You did. [:-]
We used the stock version to test eveything because "we don't want corrupt or undocumented data". I'm glad that has had such an impact on bug busting. Anyway, this is not a bug, this is a design debate so using the CHS or the stock makes no difference outside of the fact that I'd have to load yet another version on my PC. I'm willing to do this AAR but you guys want to use your toys. CHS extended map or nothing.
RE: The truth about supply
Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 8:29 pm
by Rob322
ORIGINAL: Ron Saueracker
ORIGINAL: Nikademus
ORIGINAL: Ron Saueracker
Cutting supply in half and capacities in half using a respected mod/map that already reduces the ease of the logistics model is going to make people think that it was not a fair test?[:)] I'm not about to frigging install another version of this game to use the stock version.
Then shut up. Your not willing to prove it using Stock which most people use and that of which you rant about in every thread you post in regardless of what the subject of said thread is.
What would your A2A mod do to the test? Nada...
I agree....but then again i'm not the one who suggested stripping my A2A changes onto the alleged AAR your obviously not going to commit too. You did. [:-]
We used the stock version to test eveything because "we don't want corrupt or undocumented data". I'm glad that has had such an impact on bug busting. Anyway, this is not a bug, this is a design debate so using the CHS or the stock makes no difference outside of the fact that I'd have to load yet another version on my PC. I'm willing to do this AAR but you guys want to use your toys. CHS extended map or nothing.
Ultimatums are really useless if you're serious about testing since if people don't agree with your demands then you can wash your hands and say "they didn't agree to my reasonable offer." Alternatively, you could then play on and they'll ignore you since you're using the "wrong" version. If you're truly serious then your stance isn't going to get you where you want to go.
Still, I suspect for most everyone on here now it's no longer really that much about the game.
RE: The truth about supply
Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 8:35 pm
by Mr.Frag
CHS extended map or nothing.
Ron - Go play CHS as Japan against the AI ... speed play it ... post your Jan 1st, 1943 save game file ... don't care about anything inbetween, don't need any aar's. The AI will not do a "sir robin"
TJ - I'm putting my money where my mouth is ... get writing.
RE: The truth about supply
Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 8:40 pm
by Ron Saueracker
ORIGINAL: Mr.Frag
CHS extended map or nothing.
Go play CHS as Japan against the AI ... speed play it ... post your Jan 1st, 1943 save game file ... don't care about anything inbetween, don't need any aar's. The AI will not do a "sir robin"
And I was just thinking...why not get folks to post their respective logistical situations (Japanese and Allied) with pertinent summary details of their ops and geographical expansion from their games? More the merrier. After all, 1 example is not a proper test pack.
RE: The truth about supply
Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 8:41 pm
by Ron Saueracker
ORIGINAL: Rob322
ORIGINAL: Ron Saueracker
ORIGINAL: Nikademus
Then shut up. Your not willing to prove it using Stock which most people use and that of which you rant about in every thread you post in regardless of what the subject of said thread is.
I agree....but then again i'm not the one who suggested stripping my A2A changes onto the alleged AAR your obviously not going to commit too. You did. [:-]
We used the stock version to test eveything because "we don't want corrupt or undocumented data". I'm glad that has had such an impact on bug busting. Anyway, this is not a bug, this is a design debate so using the CHS or the stock makes no difference outside of the fact that I'd have to load yet another version on my PC. I'm willing to do this AAR but you guys want to use your toys. CHS extended map or nothing.
Ultimatums are really useless if you're serious about testing since if people don't agree with your demands then you can wash your hands and say "they didn't agree to my reasonable offer." Alternatively, you could then play on and they'll ignore you since you're using the "wrong" version. If you're truly serious then your stance isn't going to get you where you want to go.
Still, I suspect for most everyone on here now it's no longer really that much about the game.
Again, it's not a bug issue. Stock is not the issue is it? And speaking of ultimatums, telling me to use the stock or nothing is no different.
RE: The truth about supply
Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 8:43 pm
by Tristanjohn
ORIGINAL: Mogami
Hi, And that last post furthered improvement to WITP How? And it will lead to a better next game how? But it did afford you one more shot at GG right?
Listen up. With both ears. I've bought a lot of Grigsby games over the years. And enjoyed most of them. I've also donated my time and energy to help
him get some of
his titles out. For free. These last two of his on the Pacific have disappointed me. Maybe because they have so much unrealized potential, maybe because I'm getting old and I'm afraid this will be the last time around for me, and maybe just because I'm . . . getting old. I don't know. I do know they don't work for me, and I've painstakingly pointed out why they don't work for me. In an articulate fashion. Over and over. As have others. And we all can't be making it up. Well, I guess we all
could be making it up, but then I know for a fact that I am not making it up, so right away there goes the "all" part after all.
Now, as I view it that amounts to one long record of good service rendered by me
gratis for Gary and Joel and Matrix and the hobby in general. I wish you could see it that way but I realize you can't. And that's a crying shame. But if it gets
too bad for you, if it comes down to where you
just can't stand it anymore . . . well, then maybe you should go see a doctor.
RE: The truth about supply
Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 8:45 pm
by Tristanjohn
ORIGINAL: mdiehl
@Mogami
"Freedom 75" -- get it? [;)]
@Tristanjohn
All I know is that my Hollywood ambitions will be realized if I could only be featured as a "Way Cool Scientist" on Bill Nye the Science Guy. And that is maybe more likely than getting what you want in the near future from this product, judging by the general way the conversation is going. Which is to say, I hear you buddy but at this point yer flogging a dead horse and the crowd is starting to disperse.
Hell, since forever. Just go check your score on the old Zero debate. [8|]
RE: The truth about supply
Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 8:49 pm
by Rob322
ORIGINAL: Tristanjohn
ORIGINAL: Mogami
Hi, And that last post furthered improvement to WITP How? And it will lead to a better next game how? But it did afford you one more shot at GG right?
Listen up. With both ears. I've bought a lot of Grigsby games over the years. And enjoyed most of them. I've also donated my time and energy to help
him get some of
his titles out. For free. These last two of his on the Pacific have disappointed me. Maybe because they have so much unrealized potential, maybe because I'm getting old and I'm afraid this will be the last time around for me, and maybe just because I'm . . . getting old. I don't know. I do know they don't work for me, and I've painstakingly pointed out why they don't work for me. In an articulate fashion. Over and over. As have others. And we all can't be making it up. Well, I guess we all
could be making it up, but then I know for a fact that I am not making it up, so right away there goes the "all" part after all.
Now, as I view it that amounts to one long record of good service rendered by me
gratis for Gary and Joel and Matrix and the hobby in general. I wish you could see it that way but I realize you can't. And that's a crying shame. But if it gets
too bad for you, if it comes down to where you
just can't stand it anymore . . . well, then maybe you should go see a doctor.
RE: The truth about supply
Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 8:49 pm
by Ron Saueracker
I'm amazed that a simple please all suggestion like seperate resources from supply (make it adjustable within the editor) has so many detractors when PDUs were a much more complex endeavour yet this was done.
RE: The truth about supply
Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 8:50 pm
by Tristanjohn
ORIGINAL: Mr.Frag
CHS extended map or nothing.
Ron - Go play CHS as Japan against the AI ... speed play it ... post your Jan 1st, 1943 save game file ... don't care about anything inbetween, don't need any aar's. The AI will not do a "sir robin"
TJ - I'm putting my money where my mouth is ... get writing.
Wow! That beats me!
(youmusthackafanciercab...orsmokecheapercigars)
RE: The truth about supply
Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 8:52 pm
by Rob322
ORIGINAL: Tristanjohn
ORIGINAL: Mr.Frag
CHS extended map or nothing.
Ron - Go play CHS as Japan against the AI ... speed play it ... post your Jan 1st, 1943 save game file ... don't care about anything inbetween, don't need any aar's. The AI will not do a "sir robin"
TJ - I'm putting my money where my mouth is ... get writing.
Wow! That beats me!
(youmusthackafanciercab...orsmokecheapercigars)
Did you do the exchange rate?
RE: The truth about supply
Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 8:53 pm
by Mr.Frag
smokecheapercigars
Cuban's are legal here [:D]
RE: The truth about supply
Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 8:54 pm
by Oznoyng
ORIGINAL: Ron Saueracker
...outside of the fact that I'd have to load yet another version on my PC.
Write a friggin script:
Time to play stock (dbl-click on stock.bat):
Copy c:\matrix~1\warint~1\stockfiles\ART\*.* c:\matrix~1\warint~1\ART
etc.
Time to play CHS (dbl-click on chs.bat):
Copy c:\matrix~1\warint~1\CHS\ART\*.* c:\matrix~1\warint~1\ART
etc.
All you have to do is identify any files that are a part of the CHS install and copy them out to the stockfiles directory first. Likewise, after the CHS install, copy CHS Files to into directories. all you do then is execute the script before you open WitP and close the app when changing between CHS and stock games.
Honestly, you are telling us how easy it is to code your suggestion and you simultaneously tell us how hard it is to play CHS and stock on the same install?
RE: The truth about supply
Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 8:55 pm
by mogami
ORIGINAL: Tristanjohn
ORIGINAL: Mogami
Hi, And that last post furthered improvement to WITP How? And it will lead to a better next game how? But it did afford you one more shot at GG right?
Listen up. With both ears. I've bought a lot of Grigsby games over the years. And enjoyed most of them. I've also donated my time and energy to help
him get some of
his titles out. For free. These last two of his on the Pacific have disappointed me. Maybe because they have so much unrealized potential, maybe because I'm getting old and I'm afraid this will be the last time around for me, and maybe just because I'm . . . getting old. I don't know. I do know they don't work for me, and I've painstakingly pointed out why they don't work for me. In an articulate fashion. Over and over. As have others. And we all can't be making it up. Well, I guess we all
could be making it up, but then I know for a fact that I am not making it up, so right away there goes the "all" part after all.
Now, as I view it that amounts to one long record of good service rendered by me
gratis for Gary and Joel and Matrix and the hobby in general. I wish you could see it that way but I realize you can't. And that's a crying shame. But if it gets
too bad for you, if it comes down to where you
just can't stand it anymore . . . well, then maybe you should go see a doctor.
Hi, Explain to me again how your playing a game in the past is working for gratius for gary Joel and Matrix and the hobby in general? You mean because I've played wargames for 30 years something is owed to me?
I asked how your posts help? I don't give a hoot about games you've played or tested this is the WITP forum and you don't post much anyone connected to the game can use for changing it "Supply broken, air model broken, landcombat broken, AI broken" is not "rendering a service" to anyone at all. You don't bother me but thanks for worrying about that. You just don't make sense to me.
How about rather then pointing out what is wrong. You fix it. Since you can't fix WITP you need to fix everything broken here in a new program that Mr Frag is willing to pay for if you just write the directions the programmers must follow. That is what you have been asking for since before UV. That programmers follow your directions. I wish you well in the project. Really I am behind you all the way.
Everything you've ever asked for is being offered. What more do you want?
RE: The truth about supply
Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 8:56 pm
by Mr.Frag
Did you do the exchange rate?
53k US but doesn't really matter ... my coders are in India and that $2,371,525.72 rupees
I might add that the way the us is going ... it will probably be $100 US this time next year [:D]
RE: The truth about supply
Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 8:56 pm
by Rob322
ORIGINAL: Mr.Frag
smokecheapercigars
Cuban's are legal here [:D]
Send me some Frag. Our current regime has an irrational prejudice against the boys down there. [:-]