Matrix Games Forums

ORIGINAL: clamel

ORIGINAL: Kull
Even if your transport mode was correct, but you had chosen to carry it in xAP and xAK ships.....well, it will take a LOT longer to unload because unlike AK and AP vessels, there isn't a built-in ship-to-shore capability. And while spending more time than necessary is inconvenient in friendly locales, on a hostile shore it means that unit (and others) will be coming ashore in dribs and drabs, and, well, your casualties will be enormous.

So this was an opportunity - an optional one - for you to pick up some never-to-be-forgotten knowledge. And I'd say it worked! [:)]

I understand this could be true, but really can't find anything of this in the manual. Exclude Amph TF, but just a normal cargo TF. Lots of tables in the manual but I can't grasp what makes a AK unload faster than a xAK of same size and in same size port.

Blunt saying that I can't even find if these 155mm guns can unload in time or not at all. Some tables I read got numbers that is far lower than the 1440 that ship got on those guns. Since it stuck for several days I just deduct it can never unload.
The message I read in the Op Rep say TF can not completely unload at Channel Island.
That might be info enough.
But I can't mathematical see numbers on why not.

I do see the tables with the size of ship that can dock in ports of different sizes but not that specific equipment had a play.
I got these 3 guns at Load cost 480 each (155mm M1918) laod cost for them in database is 60
In a Capacity Usage table in Manual I find load cost for Heavy(load cost > 9) is 3Xload.
So 480x3 then = 1440
Well what now. How do I understand that these will not ever unload ?
I looked in this 6.3.3.2.4 SHIP AND PORT LOAD ABILITY TABLE and found not numbers I grasp in this case.
I read this too, which don't indicate a total stop

6.3.3.3.1 NORMAL UNLOADING
2. Port Rate Limitations: The Daily Port Rate applies to Loading and
Unloading together. If a Loading TF uses 70% of the Daily Port
Rate, then only 30% remains available for Unloading

Sorry if I just don't see this. Most searches in forum comes up with amph problem or speed of unloading, not total stop.

Edit:
at last I found this thread.
https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3903886

It also state in that htread
"Typically the xAK/xAP won't unload heavy equipment (radars, tractors, etc) unless it can dock at the base. If it can't dock, it won't unload them or may take an excruciatingly long time to do so w/ naval support at the base."
But in my case my ship is docked in a port 1.

The numbers are provided in the manual where I directed you to look up.

I don't provide useless information in my posts because I tend to recheck the source material to confirm it is on point before I answer. As this forum isn't good enough for you I suggest you direct your future questions to all those great YouTubers who are obviously brilliant in fully explaining everything about AE. Makes one wonder why anyone who watches them even bothers coming to this forum for anything.

Alfred

That was hard words Alfred, on someone just wishes to get some directions.
You did point me in the correct path and as you say those numbers can be used.

But it wouldn't hurt to be a bit nicer to folks fumbling around a great game trying to understand it.
That attitude is scaring away new players, which I think isn't any good. If help is needed one ask it and I know you always have very precis answers and 100% correct, but now and then in the deeper sense. It's a more casual answers someone now and then seek.
Did I really say this forum isn't good enough. You really got that wrong.

I have deep respect for the folks in this forum that have years of knowledge but I have never seen "The experts" in most gameforums almost beheading newbies.

This is a game Alfred and if you are kind enough to answer questions you could be nicer about it.
Not a very nice way to also behead some YouTubers that actually try to teach newbies the basic stuff in this game.

ORIGINAL: clamel

That was hard words Alfred, on someone just wishes to get some directions.
You did point me in the correct path and as you say those numbers can be used.

But it wouldn't hurt to be a bit nicer to folks fumbling around a great game trying to understand it.
That attitude is scaring away new players, which I think isn't any good. If help is needed one ask it and I know you always have very precis answers and 100% correct, but now and then in the deeper sense. It's a more casual answers someone now and then seek.
Did I really say this forum isn't good enough. You really got that wrong.

I have deep respect for the folks in this forum that have years of knowledge but I have never seen "The experts" in most gameforums almost beheading newbies.

This is a game Alfred and if you are kind enough to answer questions you could be nicer about it.
Not a very nice way to also behead some YouTubers that actually try to teach newbies the basic stuff in this game.

While I have not seen the youtube videos, I have read reports from experienced players on them. Therefore, I will not waste my time on those. You also need to look at the experience of the people making those youtube videos.

You would be better off reading past AARs from experienced players. Inexperienced players who have AARs have received good advice from people and it has improved their game play. If an experienced player starts an AAR, then I suggest that you join in. I do not believe that anyone would chastise you for asking questions about the whys and wherefores about what they are doing.

Also, I bumped a thread about searching the forums. I suggest that you read it if you have not done so. I also suggest that you bookmark threads that may have interest to you, especially ones that have links to other threads as well as ones that have descriptions of the various parts of the game and links to threads with more detailed discussions.

Public Service Announcement:

The Spreadsheet is easier to use if you sort the columns in the following order: First B, then D, then E, then L, then F.

That puts all the ships designated for the same TF together, so you can build the TF from the ships in port much more efficiently.

ORIGINAL: Professor Chaos

Public Service Announcement:

The Spreadsheet is easier to use if you sort the columns in the following order: First B, then D, then E, then L, then F.

That puts all the ships designated for the same TF together, so you can build the TF from the ships in port much more efficiently.

Why would a professor Chaos want to make things easier and more sensible?[8|]

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

ORIGINAL: Professor Chaos

Public Service Announcement:

The Spreadsheet is easier to use if you sort the columns in the following order: First B, then D, then E, then L, then F.

That puts all the ships designated for the same TF together, so you can build the TF from the ships in port much more efficiently.

Why would a professor Chaos want to make things easier and more sensible?[8|]

Doesn't make any sense does it. [:D]....GP

ORIGINAL: btd64

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

ORIGINAL: Professor Chaos

Public Service Announcement:

The Spreadsheet is easier to use if you sort the columns in the following order: First B, then D, then E, then L, then F.

That puts all the ships designated for the same TF together, so you can build the TF from the ships in port much more efficiently.

Why would a professor Chaos want to make things easier and more sensible?[8|]

Doesn't make any sense does it. [:D]....GP

Nope, not at all.

Then again, the only part of the government that does is the MINT!

So I am running through your spreadsheet and it's quite simply fantastic! Its kind of like a tutorial of sorts. I do highly recommend any newbie like myself to first read the manual (it took me about two and half weeks in Dec. to read through it at a leisurely pace), it answers and gives you a fairly good insight into the game. I tried the Coral Sea scenario while reading but just jumped into a CG in late Dec. I have a good friend named Larry who sent me two zip files with some answers to some questions I had plus a few email strings and that was also really helpful.

So using this great spreadsheet I sorted by region and stared walking through from A-Z. Things are very clear and your first page intro really helped out.

As I am going through the list (I still don't quite grasp the concept of the four types of restricts, but gather I must spend PP to change the HQ at one point to move them to other bases), I have come to Australian and Adelaide and the spreadsheet instructions say to move the '6th Australian Brigade' but I see the 3rd Australian Bde and the 6th Aus Cav Bde.



So are the instructions for the 6th Aus Cav Bde or the 3rd Aus Inf Bde?

This is a PBEM game with my buddy Larry, and on first load it had me update the database. So not 100% if the stock scenario was changed or if he setup a special scenario so if that is the issues then no worries and that is on me.

Anyway thanks Kull for such an awesome tool!

ORIGINAL: Zovs

So I am running through your spreadsheet and it's quite simply fantastic! Its kind of like a tutorial of sorts. I do highly recommend any newbie like myself to first read the manual (it took me about two and half weeks in Dec. to read through it at a leisurely pace), it answers and gives you a fairly good insight into the game. I tried the Coral Sea scenario while reading but just jumped into a CG in late Dec. I have a good friend named Larry who sent me two zip files with some answers to some questions I had plus a few email strings and that was also really helpful.

So using this great spreadsheet I sorted by region and stared walking through from A-Z. Things are very clear and your first page intro really helped out.

As I am going through the list (I still don't quite grasp the concept of the four types of restricts, but gather I must spend PP to change the HQ at one point to move them to other bases), I have come to Australian and Adelaide and the spreadsheet instructions say to move the '6th Australian Brigade' but I see the 3rd Australian Bde and the 6th Aus Cav Bde.



So are the instructions for the 6th Aus Cav Bde or the 3rd Aus Inf Bde?

This is a PBEM game with my buddy Larry, and on first load it had me update the database. So not 100% if the stock scenario was changed or if he setup a special scenario so if that is the issues then no worries and that is on me.

Anyway thanks Kull for such an awesome tool!

Not having used the spreadsheet nor even opened it so I can't be sure of what the intent is but just ask yourself "What is the purpose of moving this unit to another location?" If it is for defense, then send the infantry. If you want to smash and grab things, and then depart the AO, then send in the CAVALRY!

+1 lol

We always send the cav first!

Scouts Out!

LLMF

ORIGINAL: Zovs



As I am going through the list (I still don't quite grasp the concept of the four types of restricts, but gather I must spend PP to change the HQ at one point to move them to other bases), I have come to Australian and Adelaide and the spreadsheet instructions say to move the '6th Australian Brigade' but I see the 3rd Australian Bde and the 6th Aus Cav Bde.

So are the instructions for the 6th Aus Cav Bde or the 3rd Aus Inf Bde?

I've noticed in the past that there are discrepancies in Australian unit locations in the Kull spreadsheet. The 6th Australian Brigade (ID #6032) actually starts the unmodded campaign game in the Australian town of Portsea near Melbourne. Not Adelaide. So, basically if you run into a discrepancy just use Search all ground units (hotkey G) to find the unit and then move it according to the spreadsheet.

ORIGINAL: Zovs

+1 lol

We always send the cav first!

Scouts Out!

LLMF

DAT's right!

Thanks @ platoonist!

😂and thanks @ RangerJoe

Remember that you can start an AAR and get some assistance and ideas there. The one thing that you want to avoid as Allies is battles like these:

Ground combat at Nanyang (85,45)

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 19541 troops, 290 guns, 841 vehicles, Assault Value = 774

Defending force 24893 troops, 109 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 89

Japanese adjusted assault: 501

Allied adjusted defense: 76

Japanese assault odds: 6 to 1 (fort level 1)

Japanese forces CAPTURE Nanyang !!!

Combat modifiers
Defender: experience(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
57 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 5 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled

Allied ground losses:
18119 casualties reported
Squads: 979 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 1394 destroyed, 56 disabled
Engineers: 134 destroyed, 2 disabled
Guns lost 99 (96 destroyed, 3 disabled)
Units retreated 6
Units destroyed 2

Defeated Allied Units Retreating!

Unfortunately, two Chinese Corps that had retreated to this base surrendered![:(] That means that they will come back to defend Chungking.

ORIGINAL: Zovs

(I still don't quite grasp the concept of the four types of restricts, but gather I must spend PP to change the HQ at one point to move them to other bases)

In the context of the spreadsheet, there's only three:

1) "Unrestricted": These units are free to move anywhere. As you surmise, that's because their HQ is also unrestricted.

2) "Can buy out w/ PPs": All restricted units have the same limitation, in that you can't move them by sea nor even by air except to a limited group of bases. In this case however, you can spend "political points" to reassign these units to an unrestricted HQ. However, unless I specifically suggest that you pay the PPs to "unrestrict" them, it's just information.

3) "Fully restricted": Same as #2 except these units can NEVER be "bought out" with PPs. They will always be restricted.

8.1.1. in the manual talks about this in the context of HQs (probably where you got the "four types" from), but from the perspective of the spreadsheet I'm only talking about the units these rules apply to, and using the color codes to help you understand there's a reason why certain units can't be moved.

I have come to Australian and Adelaide and the spreadsheet instructions say to move the '6th Australian Brigade' but I see the 3rd Australian Bde and the 6th Aus Cav Bde.

Unfortunately some scenarios have different starting locations for the same units. For example, the December 8th scenario places 6th Brigade in Adelaide as the spreadsheet indicates. That's probably not the only one, but Platoonist gave the correct answer on how to find "missing" units, so please follow his advice the next time this happens.

ORIGINAL: Kull



Unfortunately some scenarios have different starting locations for the same units. For example, the December 8th scenario places 6th Brigade in Adelaide as the spreadsheet indicates. That's probably not the only one, but Platoonist gave the correct answer on how to find "missing" units, so please follow his advice the next time this happens.

Yeah, for example there are four Australian units that start the December 8th grand campaign scenario in Broken Hill. In the December 7th scenario Broken Hill is empty and they are all elsewhere. But, if you hit the "G" key and filter by nationality they are not hard to find and are likely near a rail line ready to go.

There are a few others like that but not many.


Awesome spreadsheet by the way. I can't the imagine the hours it took to compile. [&o]

Thanks again all. Just found another shortcut that helps the list all bases. When setting TF destination or patrol or waypoints. Setting routing and finding the exact hex is trial and error since I can’t display hex coords and only bases display them when you hover over a hex. I have to find a hex coord and manually count the hexes to find it in the sea for example.

ORIGINAL: Zovs

Thanks again all. Just found another shortcut that helps the list all bases. When setting TF destination or patrol or waypoints. Setting routing and finding the exact hex is trial and error since I can’t display hex coords and only bases display them when you hover over a hex. I have to find a hex coord and manually count the hexes to find it in the sea for example.

Unfortunately there isn't an easy way to determine non-base hex coordinates. Happily there's nothing magical about most of the spreadsheet "recommended coordinates", and you won't go far wrong by following a few simple rules in setting your own:

1) Submarine Patrol Zones: I name each one, so use the "patrol around" button and click an ocean hex in that area. You'll get much the same result as the manual settings, and - if desired - you can always go back and tweak the individual settings later. But that will keep you from getting bogged down in sub patrol zones. It really is "no fun" to try and get them all perfect.

2) ASW TF patrols: The idea - almost always - is to set a triangular zone in which the final leg is the home port, where the patrolling ships can rest for one turn and refuel. As for the other two points in the circuit? They could be anything, but should be within your Air ASW patrol range because ASW works MUCH better when air and sea are looking at the same area. Also, the length of the "patrol path" should not exceed the endurance range of the patrolling vessels, and in fact should always be 2 hexes or so lower than the max. For example a group of patrolling YPs have a max range of 12 but the patrol zone shouldn't exceed 10. Otherwise your ASW patrol TFs will be doing a lot of "return to base and disband", which is no fun since you'll have to constantly reset them.

3) Supply/fuel/troop convoys: For the Allies, the general plan is to run your convoys through regions that are unlikely to experience Japanese SCTF raids and submarine patrols. Obviously there are certain nexus points that can't be avoided (such as convoy origin and destination ports) but in between you have a lot of options. The majority of your early war convoys (and for this purpose we'll ignore the chaos unfolding in the regions subject to direct Japanese attack) are needed to run supply and fuel from the US to Australia, and bases in between. Although many players run these convoys from San Fran and through the Hawaiian islands, the spreadsheet does not do this specifically because of the "Japanese avoidance" principle noted earlier. So almost everything is going to/from LA. And that means a diagonal path in a SW direction, with a jog toward Sydney, Australia roughly at Flint Island. This even works for supplying Pago, Suva, Noumea or any points north or south of that line. It also puts your convoys well behind the air search perimeter established at Pearl-Palmyra-Christmas-Canton-Pago-Suva-Noumea. Which means that any hostiles heading south or east of those points should be detected in time to make a pathing adjustment. And, since we're talking about "waypoints", we'll ignore convoys originating in Capetown or Aden/Abadan since their destinations are obvious and there's not much routing required.

Anyway, if you follow those simple guidelines, the process of setting waypoints - now and in the future - should be a lot less onerous and cumbersome.

Kull,

Thanks again so much for that insightful and very helpful info, especially on all three of the numbered points and on waypoints, patrol zones etc.

I know I have said it before but your spreadsheet is really like a hands on tutorial of sort. I really thank you for that.

Really reading the manual front to back is not that hard and fills in a lot of the gaps, using your spreadsheet is like a hands on tool and you discover what and why things are they way they are and it makes the manual make even more sense.

My recommendations to any new folks is to take the time to read through the manual, try a small scenario but then just jump in to the campaign and use this spreadsheet as a guide and helper. You'll be rocking and rolling in no time.

Thanks a million for this and for the effort it must of took to create it.

Don't forget to look at what the changes were in the updates as well.