Matrix Games Forums

ORIGINAL: PaxMondo

I'm not seeing a problem.  Jap commits it's entire national force against Singapore in a surprise attack.  Why doesn't that work?  It's PH only smaller.  

In any case, it is just a trade-off and one that I think is entirely within the realm of options of the JAP player for day 1.  You potentially get the SRA secured about 1 month earlier, BUT you let the USN off the hook entirely.  That means the Allies counter-offensive can start almost one year earlier.  I don't see this as a winning strategy for the JAP player, but I guess we can watch an AAR play out and see how it works.  Be interesting to watch.  I think this is what AE is about, neh?

ORIGINAL: WITPPL

Question:

Results were funny but the important question for me is:

What the heck should i do now?

Ive lost WEEKS of family life preparing whole operation. Not only it is fully disclosed but I am a sitting duck.
What the hell am I about to do with this damn situation?

Should I compose my TFs by my best and invade again (probably with similiart results)?
Maybe just give up a game or what?

How much loses will look GOOD?

I am really puzzled here!

[:@]

ORIGINAL: WITPPL

Pax: We are talking about looses in ships and men during such invasions here.
Not about possibility to take one location or not.

ORIGINAL: PaxMondo

ORIGINAL: WITPPL

Pax: We are talking about looses in ships and men during such invasions here.
Not about possibility to take one location or not.

Ahhh, sorry. I thought JWilkerson already addressed that above ... sounds like any invasion force of greater than say about 200 ships (maybe 100?. maybe 300? not clear yet) is outside of the game engine design parameters. I've already adjusted my house rules that no "monster" invasion forces after Dec 10. We are still dickering on what constitutes "monster" but taking direction from above.

ORIGINAL: WITPPL

Question:

Results were funny but the important question for me is:

What the heck should i do now?

Ive lost WEEKS of family life preparing whole operation. Not only it is fully disclosed but I am a sitting duck.
What the hell am I about to do with this damn situation?

Should I compose my TFs by my best and invade again (probably with similiart results)?
Maybe just give up a game or what?

How much loses will look GOOD?

I am really puzzled here!

[:@]

ORIGINAL: WITPPL

We have already turned back time.

ORIGINAL: Bluebook

Actually I have thought about it and I think we should go back to the game as it was and forget the "go back in time"-thing.

I dont mind losing Pearl if that is what happens. It will just be a longer way for me to Tokyo, but the game will be just as fun anyway. So the CD-routines does not really work and that meant a very easy landing at Pearl, I can live with that. I will get enough reinforcements in the future anyway.

And, like you say, what are you supposed to do? You are super-committed to the Pearl invasion with 10 divisions in the centpac. Not your fault that the game cant handle that invasion properly.

Also, it will be interesting to see what happens. So I think we should just continue our game from where we were.

ORIGINAL: Grunt

I have read the first 4 or 5 pages of this thread closely and skimmed the rest...so sorry if this has been done and commented upon already; but I loaded up the first turn of scen 1 as IJN and, using the forces destined for Kuantan, formed an invasion TF similar to this PH invasion in composition. I then set Bataan as the destination. Bataan, of course, has some serious CD defenses. I saw similar results in that the escorts (PBs, SCs and some DDs...9 or 10 total) soaked up almost all of the fire. Only one xAKL was hit out of approx 60 transports. Did the same with scen 2 and saw the same thing. In each case troops got ashore easily and captured Bataan with the first shock attack.

Definitely apparent to me that the firing routines for CD guns are to target the escorts. Six PBs took multiple heavy caliber hits but remained afloat with 95-99 flt damage.

ORIGINAL: John Lansford

So would it be considered "gamey" to put together a massive invasion fleet and take Bataan and Singapore on December 8?  Or will someone finally acknowledge that the CD/invasion routines aren't working as intended?

ORIGINAL: Drambuie

Hmm this is one case where I think i'm glad I'm playing the AI! [;)]

The thought of a game where you can't rely on anywhere - including the major bases etc- being relatively secure from an amphib operation is not something I'd relish much.

Actually what stops the AI from trying this? Is it hard coded routines of invasion priorities and targets or does it assess targets based on their AV or defense values (especially later in the game)and this calculates that CD defenses etc are too tough to attack?

ORIGINAL: Grunt

I have read the first 4 or 5 pages of this thread closely and skimmed the rest...so sorry if this has been done and commented upon already; but I loaded up the first turn of scen 1 as IJN and, using the forces destined for Kuantan, formed an invasion TF similar to this PH invasion in composition. I then set Bataan as the destination. Bataan, of course, has some serious CD defenses. I saw similar results in that the escorts (PBs, SCs and some DDs...9 or 10 total) soaked up almost all of the fire. Only one xAKL was hit out of approx 60 transports. Did the same with scen 2 and saw the same thing. In each case troops got ashore easily and captured Bataan with the first shock attack.

Definitely apparent to me that the firing routines for CD guns are to target the escorts. Six PBs took multiple heavy caliber hits but remained afloat with 95-99 flt damage.

ORIGINAL: John Lansford

So would it be considered "gamey" to put together a massive invasion fleet and take Bataan and Singapore on December 8?  Or will someone finally acknowledge that the CD/invasion routines aren't working as intended?