Matrix Games Forums

I suggest u check your scenario more carefully. Just download your sce and check ships. When I check soviet destroyer stalin the screen suddenly becomes black and the game automatically quit. Never met such things before. CHS is always very stable.

Well trollelite, it works perfectly on my system. I would suggest that the main reason it wouldn't work on yours is that you may not have the art file in the correct directory...

Make sure to place the art files included in the download pack into the correct directory. if there's a problem I can email you the necessary art files.


So as to our rules:

1. Soviet Union NOT activated. Can be activated by Japanese attacks or by the Manchurian garrison falling below 8,000 points as per the stock game. While the Soviet Union is NOT active Allied forces CANNOT transit through it or refuel/re-arm at its ports.

2. No dive-bomber attacks on naval shipping above 25,000 feet. This is to prevent Helldivers diving on IJN CVs from 31,000 feet above the Tojo CAP in 1943.

3. In return NO IJA or IJN kamikazes will go in above 25,000 feet in the late-war period.

4. NO Aerial mining by Allies as the Japanese cannot intercept these missions.

5. G9Ms CANNOT be used for port attacks - their torpedoes would simply hit the harbour bottom as they are much larger than the normal 18" torpedoes.

6. Me-264 Behemoths CANNOT be used to bomb below 20,000 feet - it is a code and accuracy-related issue.

7. Aden is off-limits to invasion as are the bases along the Southern Map Edge which simulate the Allied ability to ship resources across the Pacific and Indian Oceans to Pakistan. Allied ships in the shipping corridor running along the southern and western map edges are immune from attack. Again this helps the Allies if Japan were to take the entire Pacific in an attempt to divide the UK and US forces off from eachother.


No limitations on use of four-engined bombers in the anti-shipping role, no limitations on ASW TF size, no limitations on use of PT boats, no limitations on movement of Chinese forces etc.

Trollelite is allowed to limit HIMSELF in use of four-engined bombers, ASW TFs, PT boats and Chinese force movements as much as he feels is necessary to be historically accurate and I would ask him to post any limitations he intends to follow so that I can tack them on to the rules above.



Trollelite - If you have any further questions let me know... The only significant change to the mod version you have are as follows:
1. Date into service of a couple of IJN CVs is delayed a bit to give the Allies more chance to fight back in early 1942.
2. I've delayed the date into service of some of the IJA bombers again to delay the increase in strength of Japan.
3. I've increased the strength of some Allied forts so that they will fall less easily to Japan and free up more Allied troops for offensive action.
4. I've increased the replacement rates of P-40Es, Pe-2s, MiG-3s, SBDs by about 50% each.
5. I've reduced the replacement rate of the Avenger from about 140 per month to 90 per month to compensate for the other increases.
6. I've given the Allies an Me-264 equivalent in the B-19... Think of it like a slightly less durable B-29. You start with 16 on-map and get 12 per month. So it isn't a huge amount but it is enough to cause Japan some trouble as it has a range of about 43 hexes ( extended ), 33 hexes normal, carrying 8,000 lbs of bombs and mounting an extremely heavy defensive armament.



So, all in all I've weakened Japan a bit and increased the Allied fighter strength significantly to give the Allies a better chance than they have in my game against jagdfluger.


If that's all OK then let me know and I'll begin planning...

P.s. Last thing --- in case either of us have to drop out and to ensure the game can continue I'd ask that we both give our passwords to someone else ( maybe Hoepner ??? ) so that if one of us has to drop out that 3rd party can give the password out to whoever might take over that side.

P.p.s. I also suggest that we agree that obviously these rules cannot be changed or added to without both parties agreeing to said change

And what is Nemo-san class...??[:D][:D]

As you already have hellcat equivalent no Jack or George then should be allowed to operate on carriers.

Trollelite,

Well the Jack and George aren't carrier-capable in this mod so even if one wanted them to operate from carriers they wouldn't. Its taken care of in the mod design.


Hehe... It is the "Designer Class" of CAAA. Japan gets 6 or 8 of them ( I forget which ) throughout the war. They are specialised anti-torpedo bomber designs aimed to escort the Shinano class CVAs which are specially designed to be proof against dive-bombers... I also have the "Player Class" of DDAA for the Japanese and most of their CLs upgrade to CLAAs. The idea is that Japan IDed carriers as the decisive weapon and began designing ships and planes and CVs to win massed carrier battles. Unfortunately they have had to go to war 1 year too early and so only one of their CAAAs and none of their CVAAs are ready for action. Over the course of the first year though they come on-stream and be the end of 1942 KB should till be terrifying if it hasn't taken too many losses.

So you'll see names like the Woods-san, Grigsby-san, Billings-san for the Designer class and then for the "Players class" you have "Pauk-san, PzB-san etc." I basically named them after the players whom I thought were most famous for AARs OR played the best in AARs. Most of the names should be pretty familiar to anyone who has read the AAR sub-forum.

This is going to be fun. I have always wanted to try this senario, but was too chicken.

Trollelite,

So, any further questions or requests? If not I'm going to lock it down and begin plotting my orders + releasing the release version of the mod for others to download and try out. I'll wait until I hear back from you... At that point in time we can take our time with the first turn as you have praktikums in about 10 days time and that, obviously, takes priority.

Can't wait to see the duel between the two [&o]biggest gamers of the design.

Constructive feedback as always... One day I'll see you post something useful and polite --- and then I'll know someone else is using your ID and login [:D]

ORIGINAL: Nemo121

Constructive feedback as always... One day I'll see you post something useful and polite --- and then I'll know someone else is using your ID and login [:D]

Hey Nemo. I wasn't being impolite. Wasn't my intention at the very least...my apologies if I came across that way. I just remember reading your first AAR and you were masterful at using the first turn movement bonus in the no holds barred game you were playing. If anyone can kick some humility into Trots it will be you. I'm not a fan of his "weaker player" schtick. Good luck with the game and kick butt!

Ron,

Clarification accepted. I suppose that:
a) I've come to understand the need for some house rules above and beyond what I thought was necessary when I first started playing WiTP.

b) I would strongly argue that there's a massive difference between a no hold's barred game where pretty much the only rules are not to exploit game code and being " a gamer of the design". The first move bonus is one of those grey areas which some people see as gaming the design and others see as allowing them to massively change the thrust of Japanese offensive operations as though they were in charge for the past couple of years.

I would hold that I don't do anything which was impossible given physics and the nature of war - e.g.  Sure I send ships to CONUSA and I invade anything and everything on the map but apart from the first move bonus I get there one hex at a time, paying a price in fuel, time and blood and then I fight my way ashore in the face of enemy air attacks etc.

Sure I don't have any problems with coming ashore across an open undefended beach instead of invading the city hex next door featuring 4 x 16 inch CD guns and 40 CD guns of other calibres BUT, in reality, given poor Japanese amphibious doctrine this is what they should have been doing anyways. I don't, however, argue that dropping 10 men behind a 250,000 man strong army to stop the entire 250,000 man strong army moving is anything but fantasy.

That's what I would view as a crucial distinction between my style of play - "no holds barred but no exploitation of code" and those who exploit the code. It may not seem all that much of a distinction to most but I think its an important one. I know my style isn't for everyone but you should check out my latest AAR - "Stopping an Invidious Empire". At least you can't say I bitch when I have the no holds barred style of play used to its fullest against me . I'm BARELY holding onto CONUSA, Oz, the rump of China and Siberia and India/Burma in mid-42 and am enjoying the hell out of the game.

If anyone can kick some humility into Trots it will be great Nemo (and only under his great mod).....

Shamelessly shall I take this as a great praise...[;)][:D]

Troll, well I'm sure you can take it however you choose to take it. In the meantime let me know when you are satisfied and/or wish to discuss further rules and I can begin plotting my first move. I nominate AndyMac as a holder of our passwords if that's agreeable to you.

Why should we need some others to take our passwords?

Well, I suppose if I dare to ask GH not to air mining at all then I would be subjected to a new round of heavy barrage for extremely unfair and mistreat him...though u know Japs is much weaker in CHS than in your good mod...[:D][:D]

ORIGINAL: trollelite

Well, I suppose if I dare to ask GH not to air mining at all then I would be subjected to a new round of heavy barrage for extremely unfair and mistreat him...though u know Japs is much weaker in CHS than in your good mod...[:D][:D]

I've never gone that far with the allies, but i'm following the debate in the general forum...if the devs say that no interception may occur because of a flaw, be sure that i won't mine anything at all pan[:)].

We would go a long way before that, still enough time to hear what others say about this. However I don't wish to totally ban it. If Japs not be able to intercept it perhaps a limitation of number and scale would be discussed.

Trollelite --- Well, as I said above, its a guarantee that the game can continue if one of us drops out...
 
As to air mining... I am unsure what you are saying here or if it is directed at Hoepner or me. My basic take is that if air mining is uninterceptable then it should be banned. If it CAN be intercepted then it should be  allowed with no limitations whatsoever. It all depends on whether the code is flawed or not. If the code is flawed then it is banned, if the code isn't flawed then feel free to use it as much as you want.
 
Right now though I think the general consensus is that the probability is that the code is flawed.

OK...when do you guys start pounding upon each other? Biting and insults allowed?[:D] This AAR is going to be fun...a WITP smackdown.

The interesting thing is the code is not flawed, but I really feel that the design is flawed. AndyMac says the code is working the way is is supposed to - there are no intercepts possible of aerial mining flights. So - what now?

deja vu Ron? [:D]