Matrix Games Forums

[font=calibri]I have just bought the game yesterday and made 4 turns as German in the scenario Uranus against AI. [/font]
[font=calibri]In Uranus scenario you immediately understand how desperate is the German situation.  The last unit of ersatz arriving as reinforcement becomes suddenly very important to hold a town in the middle of the steppe and try to delay the advance of the soviet cavalry and tanks. The OOB is very well represented with for example the 22eme panzer which has no tank because historically mice  eaten the electric system of all tanks of this division. [/font]
[font=calibri]I have been deeply impressed by the quality of the game which is ranking probably number one among the simulations covering this period. [/font]
[font=calibri]All details in this game have been adjusted to make a top simulation. [/font]
[font=calibri]-big map but good scale for the time (2 days/turn), for the size of units (regiment level) giving enough units but not thousands of them. Playing a turn does not take forever. [/font]
[font=calibri]-very simple logistic rules with no intervention of the player. [/font]
[font=calibri]What is the most impressive is the ability of the designers to have create all the conditions to simulate a movement war. [/font]
[font=calibri]I know 2 others simulations covering this period where the game turns quickly in a trench war. [/font]
[font=calibri]Mixing of tactical and strategic considerations is also a "must".  Play cards attached to the HQ needs careful planning and anticipation: is it better to encourage a unit to build a hedgehog defense or to spend a another card to  sustain a counterattack ? Simulation of the aerial war is simple enough but is very realistic with interception of raid by enemy fighters and destruction of tanks or guns  by the bombers. [/font]
[font=calibri]In brief a good compromise between playability , realism and complexity of the situation. [/font]

Well said MickeII, having fired up the Uranus scenario as well (have played this campaign numerous time during my W@W: Stalingrad days) I can say it plays very well.
For me the main difference of importance between WiTE & CB is the unit scale and time difference. 2 days turns do allow for a lot more interaction and time to react to the moves of your opponent without the risk of losing a complete Front in one turn, which is endemic in WiTE. The reduced mobility per turn makes for much more fun and a much more historical feel of the game.

It's a pitty WiTE will not evolve towards a 2-3 day turn system.
Also of note is that although WiTE is supposed to be 10Km/hex as is CB, the map for CB is many hexes largers for the same area. This extra "room" allows for more fluid play. Anyway, these are just my first impressions and I do enjoy WiTE a lot. I'm sure both games can be enjoyed at the same time as they are different.

Great comments. I like the shorter turns as well. I got my Panzers about halfway towards pocketing at least 10 Soviet divisions but had to watch the Sov AI extricating half its troops before I could close the pocket. Very realistic.

And then, once you do close it, the AI breaks in or breaks out, if it can. Excellent modelling here.

ORIGINAL: glvaca

...Also of note is that although WiTE is supposed to be 10Km/hex as is CB, ...

Nope. WitE is 10 miles per hex.

ORIGINAL: elmo3

ORIGINAL: glvaca

...Also of note is that although WiTE is supposed to be 10Km/hex as is CB, ...

Nope. WitE is 10 miles per hex.

Ah, why do you barbarians insist on using miles!

wite is a fine game but I wished I waited for the price to come down, wow that was expensive

You can still make pockets at this scale!

^ the german OKH will play the infamous 'Reverse Pocket' card next turn.

Gonna bag Kliest, too, maybe.

The horror of Stalingrad haunts me, more than an other battle I've read about. Seeing all those soldiers go into captivity and knowing only around 3,000 made it home most in the 1950's after working in led mines or at other gulags etc etc...the horror...

It's the conditions and hopelessness of it that is haunting added to the landscape and knowing they where so far from home..I understand they where the aggressor and all but still, most had grown up with Nazi propaganda constantly from a young age, some knew no different..you can't overlook the inter war years for the germans and how that had affected the country and the youth, who then went on to fight in WW2. That German generation wasn't a freak of nature, we'd all have had the same ideas and thoughts most likely esp if you'd only ever known Nazism and been fed it from birth. They also really where victims of the time they where born in. A sad tale for that generation more or less world wide.

ORIGINAL: glvaca

ORIGINAL: elmo3

ORIGINAL: glvaca

...Also of note is that although WiTE is supposed to be 10Km/hex as is CB, ...

Nope. WitE is 10 miles per hex.

Ah, why do you barbarians insist on using miles!

Ummmm, because we don't like the metric system? [;)]

Ummmm, because we don't like the metric system?

Exactly Batman. Why would anyone want to use the overly complex metric system.

Barbarians I say! [:D]

In Sweden 1 mile = 10km!!! Vikings!

Is an American mile the same as a British mile? How many yards, feet and inches? [;)]

Cheers

Sorry I even mentioned that WitE was 10 miles per hex. [:(] Maybe we can get back on topic and post some more reasons why folks might want to buy the game?

ORIGINAL: elmo3

Sorry I even mentioned that WitE was 10 miles per hex. [:(] Maybe we can get back on topic and post some more reasons why folks might want to buy the game?

Chill out m8. We're just having some innocent fun.

10miles or 10km doesn't detract from the point I was trying to make. You have more hexes, so more room to maneuvre, so perhaps more fluid play. It's all pretty early to say really.

I tend to agree with the OP after some early play with Case Blue and extensive play with WitE. After the initial OOB, WitE becomes pure fantasy and gaming exploits, whether talking crazy logistics, the air war, carpet of ants, questionable combat mechanics, NATO like Soviet C&C or design kludges to try and inject some semblance of historical reality. One is left wondering perhaps the baby should have been thrown out with the bath water. WitE does have GG's name, a nice map and ease of play however.

Case Blue feels more like an operational wargame and the player feels like he is making military choices that mirror real military choices. The UI is a little different initially in how attacks are made and will take some adjustment, but the information is presented in a meaningful manner. Also there is an op-tempo to the game that simply seems 'right' and I have barely scratched the surface. I know that's vague but there you go. Once I have learned the system some more against a decent AI I will make the jump into MP.

Ironically, I think the Soviets here are rather more capable than their WitE equivalents for this time period. Go figure.

ORIGINAL: redmarkus4

In Sweden 1 mile = 10km!!! Vikings!

U mean former vikings. Back in the day when sweds were vikings it wasnt quite 10 clicks, but a tad more.
Conform or perish! Maybe the barbarians could learn some thing [;)]

Rasmus