Matrix Games Forums

ORIGINAL: geofflambert

I'd say you'd have to scratch an early Phillipines invasion and/or call off the Malaya invasion. Oahu is too far away from support bases of any significance. I wouldn't advise it.

Sorry about that, I was responding to this earlier post:

ORIGINAL: MakeeLearn

ORIGINAL: geofflambert

I'd say you'd have to scratch an early Phillipines invasion and/or call off the Malaya invasion. Oahu is too far away from support bases of any significance. I wouldn't advise it.

Sorry about that, I was responding to this earlier post:

90% of my reading and studying of WW2 has been on the ETO. WitPAE has whetted my appetite for the PTO.

True, changes would have to made elsewhere - PI left to be dealt with later, etc., in order to take Midway and the Hawaiian Islands.

However, was this not the ultimate goal, set in motion by the Midway attack?

The biggest benefit to Japan in taking HI would have been in the political and military hurt it would have caused America. It may have resulted in what the Japanese were trying to achieve in the Pearl strike.

The original strike on PH was just to keep the Pacific Fleet from interfering with Japan's conquest of the Southern Resource Area (DEI) and Burma. At the time most of the IJN was battleship-centric (just as most Western Naval officers were) so knocking out the battleships at PH was seen as essential. They also hoped to catch the two CVs there but didn't.

The Midway operation was not in the original expansion plans but "Victory Disease" from the early conquests and the Doolittle raid on Japan led the Japanese government to believe that they could capture Midway easily and that they needed it to close a gap in their air search (that let the Doolittle raid approach the home islands).

I have not seen anything to suggest the Japanese planned to take the Hawaiian Islands at any time, IRL.

ORIGINAL: MakeeLearn

The original strike on PH was just to keep the Pacific Fleet from interfering with Japan's conquest of the Southern Resource Area (DEI) and Burma. At the time most of the IJN was battleship-centric (just as most Western Naval officers were) so knocking out the battleships at PH was seen as essential. They also hoped to catch the two CVs there but didn't.

The Midway operation was not in the original expansion plans but "Victory Disease" from the early conquests and the Doolittle raid on Japan led the Japanese government to believe that they could capture Midway easily and that they needed it to close a gap in their air search (that let the Doolittle raid approach the home islands).

I have not seen anything to suggest the Japanese planned to take the Hawaiian Islands at any time, IRL.

I'am reading "Titans of the Seas" (Belote).

In January '42 Yamamoto asked his staff to propose what to do next.

His chief of staff, Rear Admiral Ugaki favored an invasion of Hawaii. Having carrier superiority and an overwhelming advantage in battleships would make an occupation feasible. He proposed seizing Midway, Johnston,and Palmyra islands in June, followed by a invasion of the Hawaiian islands.

This was determined by the Japanese "Think Tanks" to be too ambitious. Surprise was gone, it would be difficult to dominate the skys over Hawaii having to deal with both US land and carrier aircraft.

Next he proposed seizing Ceylon and invading India. The Japanese Army No-Go that.

Admiral Nagano's Naval General Staff pushed for a invasion of Australia - again No-Go from the Japanese Army

Yamamoto recognized that the Doolittle raid was a stunt, but it reminded him forcefully of America's enormous potential.


Ugaki then devised a less ambitious plan of his original Hawaiian plan. He proposed a near simultaneous capture of the outer Aleutian Islands and Midway Island. This would enable them to keep American sorties from Pearl surveilled and blunted. Then Johnston,and Palmyra islands would be taken.

To Admiral Yamamoto this plan had a supreme advantage: It should force the inferior American carrier fleet into decisive battle. If the American carrier force was destroyed, then invading Hawaii might be practicable.



Game wise, in a opening move of trying to take Pearl, the battle itself may prove more beneficial to the Japanese than actually taking the land.

So basically, the Japanese "High Command" were not particularly good "JFB Players," is what I'm reading

ORIGINAL: MakeeLearn

So basically, the Japanese "High Command" were not particularly good "JFB Players," is what I'm reading

Well... Yamamoto was a Harvard man.

ORIGINAL: Anachro

Yamamoto also got a D on his class paper and almost failed the courses he took there. I know; I saw the paper while doing research in the Harvard archives. [:D]

ORIGINAL: Anachro

Yamamoto also got a D on his class paper and almost failed the courses he took there. I know; I saw the paper while doing research in the Harvard archives. [:D]

But it appears that some AFBs are unwilling to accept even the smallest additional challenge (OTOH they have no problem accepting the unhistorical advantages given to the Allied players). Let's face it, it is a game, it has necessarily some limitations and both sides get their share of "unhistorical" advantages and disadvantages.

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

ORIGINAL: MakeeLearn

ORIGINAL: geofflambert

I'd say you'd have to scratch an early Phillipines invasion and/or call off the Malaya invasion. Oahu is too far away from support bases of any significance. I wouldn't advise it.

Sorry about that, I was responding to this earlier post:

90% of my reading and studying of WW2 has been on the ETO. WitPAE has whetted my appetite for the PTO.

True, changes would have to made elsewhere - PI left to be dealt with later, etc., in order to take Midway and the Hawaiian Islands.

However, was this not the ultimate goal, set in motion by the Midway attack?

The biggest benefit to Japan in taking HI would have been in the political and military hurt it would have caused America. It may have resulted in what the Japanese were trying to achieve in the Pearl strike.

The original strike on PH was just to keep the Pacific Fleet from interfering with Japan's conquest of the Southern Resource Area (DEI) and Burma. At the time most of the IJN was battleship-centric (just as most Western Naval officers were) so knocking out the battleships at PH was seen as essential. They also hoped to catch the two CVs there but didn't.

The Midway operation was not in the original expansion plans but "Victory Disease" from the early conquests and the Doolittle raid on Japan led the Japanese government to believe that they could capture Midway easily and that they needed it to close a gap in their air search (that let the Doolittle raid approach the home islands).

I have not seen anything to suggest the Japanese planned to take the Hawaiian Islands at any time, IRL.