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Posted: **Sun Dec 19, 2021 12:54 am**

ORIGINAL: Hardradi

I did some testing yesterday based on older versions of the game compared to the current version.

This testing showed that Ops losses have reduced about 29% while flak losses have increased by 200%.

Even running small 12 bomber attacks on weak Soviet forces have about a 12% loss ratio usually around 50% ops and 50% flak. Same ratio as PeteJC mentioned.

This may be true and accurate; however, just so you guys know, Germany has gotten by (in the game) with very modest bomber losses as compared to historical numbers.

I personally noticed it a couple of months back.

Our bomber losses has been trivial up until now. That definitely spoiled us.

What I am concerned/confused about is if suddenly turning up FLAK losses is the correct way to address it.

Posted: **Sun Dec 19, 2021 1:09 am**

And seeing stuff like this pisses me off as well...

It isn't that I took 9 FLAK losses that is so irritating, it is that they were isolated and only had 16 AA guns.

Those are some of the best FLAK gunners in human history!!!

Posted: **Sun Dec 19, 2021 1:21 am**

And this is annoying...

Why in the world is WiTE2 even using MaxCeiling?

Especially when the "Effective" Ceiling for the 37mm 61-k AA Gun has been cited at 9,842 ft.

https://military-history.fandom.com/wik ... 939_(61-K)

grr....

and the associated CSV file is comical in the way it doesn't log crap detail of FLAK losses...

So, everyone is off running personal simulations trying to figure out what the hell is going on, while Matrix is keeping all their cards close to their chest...

Posted: **Sun Dec 19, 2021 2:35 am**

In comparison to the Soviets, the German Luftwaffe has complete imbeciles as their FLAK Gunners.

Close to 40 LW FLAK guns and not a single kill?

Following is CSV log related to this combat:

NOTE - even the following SB-2s damaged by FLAK do not show up as FLAK damaged in any of the Combat Tabs...
Are they ultimately converted to OPS losses?

71,4,SB-2 damaged by FLAK
71,4,SB-2 damaged by FLAK
71,4,SB-2 damaged by FLAK
71,4,SB-2 damaged by FLAK
71,4,SB-2 damaged by FLAK
71,4,SB-2 damaged by FLAK
71,4,SB-2 damaged by FLAK
71,3,12 x SB-2 bombing 31st Infantry Division
71,4,50mm GrW 36 Mortar destroyed by 100kg GPHE Bomb
71,6,Support disrupted by 100kg GPHE Bomb (air)
71,4,Rifle Squad 40 damaged by 100kg GPHE Bomb
71,6,Rifle Squad 40 disrupted by 100kg GPHE Bomb
71,3,12 x SB-2 bombing 31st Infantry Division
71,4,Rifle Squad 40 destroyed by 100kg GPHE Bomb
71,4,Rifle Squad 40 destroyed by 100kg GPHE Bomb
71,6,Pioneer Squad 39 disrupted by 100kg GPHE Bomb (air)
71,3,12 x SB-2 bombing 31st Infantry Division
71,3,7 x SB-2 bombing 31st Infantry Division
71,6,Support disrupted by 100kg GPHE Bomb (air)
71,6,Rifle Squad 40 disrupted by 100kg GPHE Bomb (air)

In comparison, this was the CSV section from the Soviet Ace Gunners:

67,4,Bf 109E-7 damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Bf 109F-2 damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK
67,4,Ju 88A damaged by FLAK

In comparison, the Luftwaffe is staffed by a bunch of Bozos. [&:]

Posted: **Sun Dec 19, 2021 6:59 am**

Sauron_II
Thanks for a testing. Soviet AA are just insane.

Posted: **Sun Dec 19, 2021 7:09 am**

Could it be depends of that unit in defence/attack state? Like AA weapons gain extreme bonus if they are defending against enemy air-strike.

Posted: **Sun Dec 19, 2021 11:24 am**

There is a defensive bonus and/or an offensive penalty for flak. Also, Germans 20mm flak is pretty useless compared to 37mm. 88’s are very strong, and shred level bombers on defense.

Posted: **Sun Dec 19, 2021 11:52 am**

ORIGINAL: jubjub

There is a defensive bonus and/or an offensive penalty for flak. Also, Germans 20mm flak is pretty useless compared to 37mm. 88’s are very strong, and shred level bombers on defense.

historically, the quad 20mm AA Flak were very good.

But nobody knows for sure what is going on until Matrix gets around to updating their log file contents...

I am guessing some undocumented attack/defense penalties are indeed occurring.

Do you have anything to support this?

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