Matrix Games Forums

Posted: **Fri Sep 30, 2011 2:30 pm**

Home early on acct of a power cut. I took a look at some old photos and apparently the NSW Dock didn't have a drydock, just slipways - so actually not really a repair shipyard in game terms, I think. There seem to be a few small but potentially useful Australian auxiliary ships not represented - I'll see if I can source them and make a little list.

A slightly stretched Bathurst; this one has 2x4in guns, but making a 1x4 would be trivial:

Posted: **Fri Sep 30, 2011 5:52 pm**

I'm game for some additions. Keep doing your research and then--if you can--Post a comprehensive list as above.

I've asked Misconduct in the RA Thread to compile a list, by Allied country, of all the changes we've apparently agreed upon for the Mod. I need the ships, aircraft, LCU, and base changes we have agreed upon in ONE place. Need it all correlated so when I get the files I can simply click stuff off. Hope he can say YES.

Posted: **Fri Sep 30, 2011 7:40 pm**

This is what happens when you give nerds days off:

I can't figure out what's going on with the Indian ML flotillas. In theory we're missing:

Half of the 49th Motor Launch Flotilla - No. 829, 831, 832, 840

55th Motor Launch Flotilla [12/1942] - No. 438, 439, 440, 441, 474, 475, 476, 477

56th Motor Launch Flotilla [1/1944] - No. 412, 413, 416, 417, 419, 843, 844, 872 (No. 390 is in-game)

I say in theory because the number of Fairmiles that show up currently are about right for the RIN-manned ships - but the ones we have in-game mostly show up earlier and are nominally Brit-manned. I suspect at least some of the above listed should be added, but I'm not sure - there seem to be very few Internet records of much beyond

http://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar///UN/In ... IN-13.html
http://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar//UN/Ind ... N-A16.html

that stuff and heaven knows that although someone's probably written a book on the things I certainly don't have it, so it's all I got to go on.

The HDMLs are easier - there simply aren't any in-game beyond the ones that start out in Malaya and Burma, and there's a complete listing of them including when and where they were built and deployed at:

http://www.hmsmedusa.org.uk/HDML_Archive.html

which I'm assuming is reliable, so they're simple adds. It's a long list, though:

HDML 1057, 4/42 [at Mombasa]
HDML 1061, 5/43
HDML 1073, 5/43
HDML 1079, 5/43
HDML 1080, 4/42
HDML 1082, 4/42 [at Mombasa]
HDML 1084, 4/42
HDML 1086, 4/42
HDML 1087, 4/42
HDML 1088, 4/42 [at Mombasa]
HDML 1109, 5/44
HDML 1110, 5/44
HDML 1111, 6/44
HDML 1112, 12/44 [Calcutta]
HDML 1113, 12/44 [Calcutta]
HDML 1114, 1/44 [Bombay]
HDML 1115, 6/43 [Calcutta]
HDML 1116, 4/44 [Bombay]
HDML 1117, 3/44 [Bombay]
HDML 1118, 11/44 [Calcutta]
HDML 1119, 7/44 [Calcutta]
HDML 1120, 7/43 [Calcutta]
HDML 1125, ?/44
HDML 1148, ?/43
HDML 1151, ?/44
HDML 1248, 10/44
HDML 1261, 11/45 [Bombay]
HDML 1262, 11/45 [Bombay]
HDML 1263, 1/45 [Bombay]
HDML 1265, 9/44
HDML 1266, 11/44
HDML 1267, 3/44
HDML 1268, 1/45 [Bombay]
HDML 1272, 4/45
HDML 1275, 9/44
HDML 1288, 8/45
HDML 1299, 9/44
HDML 1303, 9/44
HDML 1304, 9/44
HDML 1336, 7/45
HDML 1337, 7/45
HDML 1368, 9/44
HDML 1376, 7/45
HDML 1377, 11/44
HDML 1385, 7/45
HDML 1398, 7/45
HDML 1424, 5/45
HDML 1425, 5/45
HDML 1430, 10/45 [Bombay]
HDML 1432, 12/45 [Bombay]
HDML 1456, 5/45
HDML 1462, 5/45
HDML 1463, 5/45

All at Karachi unless otherwise mentioned. Also:

HDML 1167-1170 inclusive [Destroyed under construction at Singapore 15/2/42, ETC unknown]

HDML 1213-1220 inclusive [Destroyed under construction at Singapore 15/2/42, ETC unknown]

HDML 1183-1188 inclusive - RNZN, Auckland no later than 9/43

HDML 1190-1194 inclusive - RNZN, Auckland ~12/43 assuming a couple months for shipping

Ships at Mombasa seem to have been in and out of the Indian theatre from early 42 but mostly ended up there. You could have them arrive in 4/42 at Mombasa (requiring a long trip on-map) or bring them in at Karachi at some unspecified later date.

I would add one caveat - the HDML ship class (#198-201) should probably have its maneuver value bumped up or something - as it is these ships (50t wooden launches!) are ridiculous torpedo magnets - I'm not absolutely sure it'd be physically possible to hit one with a torpedo, except maybe by dropping it on top of the thing like a bomb, but I'm pretty sure it'd be bloody difficult. They are slow - cruise 7kts, max 12 - which I assume accounts for the current low maneuverability, but they're tiny little things designed for extreme maneuverability and shouldn't really be getting blown out of the water the moment they take to it. The HDMLs and Fairmiles also both seem to have somewhat minimised range in-game, though that's not a huge problem given their role.

Ok. Some actual Australian ships we don't have:

SS River Burdekin (12/1943) [Evans Deakin, Brisbane]
SS River Clarence (5/1943) [Cockatoo, Sydney]
SS River Fitzroy (11/1944) [Evans Deakin, Brisbane]
SS River Derwent (9/1944) [BHP, Whyalla]
SS River Glenelg (3/1944) [BHP, Whyalla]
SS River Loddon (12/44) [HM Australian Dock, Melbourne]
SS River Mitta (11/1945) [HM Australian Dock, Melbourne]
SS River Murchison (2/1945) [BHP, Whyalla]
SS River Murray (11/1945) [BHP, Whyalla]
SS River Murrumbidgee (7/1945) [BHP, Whyalla]

These are semi-standardised freighters of about 5000t; they probably fit the Dominion M Cargo (class #2524) more so than anything else.

###

SS Iron Monarch (1942) [BHP, Whyalla]
SS Iron Duke (1943) [BHP, Whyalla]

- BHP Ore Carriers, approx. 6000t; probably best fit as Dominion L Cargo (class #2523).

SS Orungal (approx. Dominion L Cargo, class #2423

SS Mackarra
SS Macumba (approx. Pacific M Cargo, class #2426)

SS Baralaba (approx. Coastal Cargo, class #2428)

SS Buranda
SS Bulimba
SS Babinda (approx. Wilcannia xAKL, class #2766)

- These are pre-war AUSN merchants; some of the fleet has been included in-game already, but these haven't. Maybe there's a reason - if there is, I don't know what it is.

HMAS Terka
HMAS Tolga
HMAS Toorie (approx. Castle AMc, class #195)

- Adelaide Steamship Co ships of about 500t, requisitioned by the RAN on outbreak of war and serving variously as minesweepers, support ships etc.

SS Morialta (approx. Coastal Cargo, class #2428)

SS Kapara
SS Goondi
SS Broadway (approx. Straits/Island xAKL, class #2442)

- Adelaide Steamship Co ships of about 750t, in commercial service. Same disclaimer applies as to the AUSN ships - might be left out for a reason.

SS Muliama
SS Mamutu
SS Matafele
SS Lakatoi (approx. Straits/Island xAKL, class #2442)

SS Tulagi (approx. Pacific M Cargo, class #2426)

- Burns Philip ships on the Australia-New Guinea runs. Same disclaimer...

I have no idea where exactly they'd all by on Dec. 7, so I guess you'd distribute among Sydney, Newcastle, Melbourne etc as felt appropriate.

Posted: **Fri Sep 30, 2011 9:37 pm**

I still have not figured out what to do with the ML,s and HDML's. I have put the ML's into SAG's and patrolled out side of harbors hoping they would drop a DC on a sub but no luck.

Posted: **Sat Oct 01, 2011 8:25 am**

Fit another one in?

When this mod is ready, I should be able to fit another game in. One PBEM has just ended.

Posted: **Sat Oct 01, 2011 8:27 am**

I still have not figured out what to do with the ML,s and HDML's. I have put the ML's into SAG's and patrolled out side of harbors hoping they would drop a DC on a sub but no luck.

They are good targets for Jap subs!

Posted: **Sat Oct 01, 2011 4:02 pm**

ORIGINAL: khyberbill

Fit another one in?
When this mod is ready, I should be able to fit another game in. One PBEM has just ended.

Sounds Good-- Who is the Dark Side? I will be willing to see how the other side lives.

Posted: **Sat Oct 01, 2011 8:55 pm**

Hmm looks like people are already picking opponents.  Well I will throw my name in the hat.  I can fit one more game in.
 
doc

Posted: **Sun Oct 02, 2011 12:38 pm**

Well...I am glad we have players. We NEED the Mod first however. Skyland: How goes the work with finishing the French and Thai Forces?

Posted: **Sun Oct 02, 2011 12:53 pm**

Misconduct: What I need is a nation-by-nation breakdown of the decisions that have been reached within this thread. I did one about midway through the Thread and would like it recompiled including ships/classes, LCU, base changes, and other pertinent thing we have agreed upon. It will then become my 'to do' list for the Allied side.

Posted: **Sun Oct 02, 2011 12:55 pm**

ORIGINAL: John 3rd

Misconduct: What I need is a nation-by-nation breakdown of the decisions that have been reached within this thread. I did one about midway through the Thread and would like it recompiled including ships/classes, LCU, base changes, and other pertinent thing we have agreed upon. It will then become my 'to do' list for the Allied side.

I am going to start a new thread this way I can read and write at the same time, I will post the change logs as well depending what needs to be added/deleted

Posted: **Sun Oct 02, 2011 4:25 pm**

Instead of adding more ships to the allies, other than those in misconducts list. Lets look at some of the upgrades the Brits gave their escorts and never bothered to add to the dominion ships. Eg; the British Grimsby class had several changes that are not done to the Australian ships and are left out of the game. It will take a little research but if there is interest I can crack a few books.

Posted: **Sun Oct 02, 2011 4:35 pm**

ORIGINAL: John 3rd

Well...I am glad we have players. We NEED the Mod first however. Skyland: How goes the work with finishing the French and Thai Forces?

It's done. I am now re-checking the datas and i will send back the files to FatR tomorrow.

Posted: **Sun Oct 02, 2011 6:46 pm**

YEA!

FatR: How do you want to divide the scenario work?

Posted: **Mon Oct 03, 2011 10:06 pm**

ORIGINAL: oldman45

Instead of adding more ships to the allies, other than those in misconducts list. Lets look at some of the upgrades the Brits gave their escorts and never bothered to add to the dominion ships. Eg; the British Grimsby class had several changes that are not done to the Australian ships and are left out of the game. It will take a little research but if there is interest I can crack a few books.

I really like the upgrade options for the Omaha Class CL's, I am curious by this - if its not to far out the realm of possibilities, could we have more options for conversion like the bristol class destroyers to become DE's (removal of some of the 4 inch for more ASW options and AAA)?

I would be interested to see an extra few Omaha CL's added, although no historical reason for this, it just gives the Allied player a few extra ideas to decide to make them raiders or CLAA's (which of course I would LOVE to see more CLAA's)

However not entirely sure it will do much, I played a few games beyond 1944 and I haven't seen the big kill numbers I was hoping with AAA upgrades, although I don't believe I had more then 1 CLAA in each TF, with a single BB - would be interesting to see what 4-5 CLAA's can do in a TF.

Posted: **Mon Oct 03, 2011 10:11 pm**

I was thinking. Some of those older DDs were adding could you add them as the clemson class or what ever class that can be converted to DE or APDs. I like what misconduct stated. Oh yea I think the West Virginia would be a great ship to have on the WC for repairs for Dec 7th. No particular reason for this request or thought.[8|]

edit: what about a few more treasurey class PCs and of the Erie class PG

Posted: **Tue Oct 04, 2011 1:39 am**

I saw on the summary page that the battleships Nevada and Oklahoma would be placed in the Philippines.

Isn't this just free points for the Japanese?

Historically, I would question this as well. There really wasn't the infrastructure in place to support the battleships. The heavy cruisers were rotated through the Asiatic Fleet due to support problems, this would be worse for large battleships.

I would recommend against having them in the Philippines... as much as I would love to have the extra firepower for disrupting the Japanese landings.

Posted: **Tue Oct 04, 2011 2:54 am**

We decided to NOT place the BBs out there. I think it would be fun but you are correct. They would be dead meat.

Skyland: How is your review of the additions going?

Posted: **Tue Oct 04, 2011 9:28 am**

ORIGINAL: John 3rd

We decided to NOT place the BBs out there. I think it would be fun but you are correct. They would be dead meat.

Skyland: How is your review of the additions going?

Hi John, i sent back the files to FatR yesterday.
I hope everything is ok, i have checked the entries but not tested in game.
The french aircrafts upgrade path may need some adjustments, but it can be done quickly later.

I will work now on the missing arts (mainly BC Dunkerque and AS Jules Verne and some planes with french markings).

Posted: **Tue Oct 04, 2011 12:13 pm**

YES! Well done Sir and thanks for the work. Looking forward to seeing the artwork once you've got it complete.

Stanislav: How about what I suggested earlier? You continue working on the ship files and I'll work on Allied air, LCU, and base stuff. WE can then switch when finished and I can work on Allied ships and you do the other for the Japanese. How does that sound? If good, send my the updated files when you get the chance. THANKS!

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