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You're wrong. You certainly can invade. With a level nine airfield just a few hexes from the beach, with massed LRCAP, and with 4EB hitting enemy airfields, you certainly can.

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

Wow, you had me worried there for a moment. I thought something had gone badly wrong.

About the only thing that could really hurt you at this point is if you lost most of your fleet carriers and/or most of your good landing ships. You didn't, so you're fine. Even losing a zillion CVEs (which is a big morale hit, naturally), isn't going to really hurt you. You can work around it. You can be creative.

Unless I missed something, I see no reason you can't invade Honshu on schedule. So, am I missing something?

How many aircraft did rader lose on the day?

Now, before you turn turtle and withdraw into your shell, is there an opportunity to strike here? Did rader lose so many aircraft that he's neutered for a bit? Can you attack his fleet?

No, my CVs are in the pacific hunting ghosts....what we thought was the KB probably was just a CV division composed around the CV Akagi....bugger!

And, obviously, the shots at Shinano missed.... :-/

How am i supposed to land without the CVEs and against these odds??? Have you seen his numbers????...have you seen how much his raids were immune to my CAP?

Think of it from his perspective - he'll know an invasion is coming, but he won't know exactly when. With two day turns, he'll have to guess exactly right. If he unleashes his aircraft too soon, they impale themselves on your LBA and he'll lose hundreds or even thousands of aircraft. So he has to guess just right. It's hard to do that.

By playing him carefully, feinting and the like, you can try to set up a massive flak trap. You can move some of your ships closer and then back. And then, when you throw his timing off, you use the two day turn sequence to land.

Or, perhaps you count on him being unsure and you go right in.

But you can do it.

ORIGINAL: Cribtop

Yikes!

It's always hard to absorb a whupping. You can take some comfort in the fact that Rader has now focused you on the need to win by strat bombing, at least for now. An invasion of Honshu is still possible but obviously not any time soon.

From an analysis perspective, how did Rader sneak up on you? It seemed you had an extensive sub screen, patrol aircraft in the Kuriles and your CVs lurking to provide overwatch. You mentioned recently that your CVs were near Pearl, so perhaps you deviated from the CV overwatch plan? Was this done knowingly or as a result of the decoy CVs way south (of course it is only now obvious that they were decoys).

I've always learned more in defeat than in victory. Analyze this situation and determine how to modify doctrine to avoid it next time.

Finally, remember that you are still in great shape for ultimate victory.

Yes, the Akagi was a decoy and my CVs are at Christmas right now...my subs screen didn't work...as you can see our subs did try a couple of shots and got unlucky...his CVs came from the Bonins...unseed till the very last day...and stopped 8 hexes south of Uruppu....

yes, i know i haven't lost...but for sure now Rader is closer to a "draw" than he were yesterday...my CVEs are essential for a landing at Honshu....

however we'll need few days to get back from this black morale and to be able to see the situation in an objective way....

However Rader did a great job....and was also a bit lucky with the coordination he got (his strikes didn't go after my BBs at Bihoro first but go directly and with an incredible determination against my CVEs at uruppu...and my CAp had its darkest day...

However...we'll have now to use my CVs to defend my supply convoys...which is a very bad task for them if you ask me...

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

Think of it from his perspective - he'll know an invasion is coming, but he won't know exactly when. With two day turns, he'll have to guess exactly right. If he unleashes his aircraft too soon, they impale themselves on your LBA and he'll lose hundreds or even thousands of aircraft. So he has to guess just right. It's hard to do that.

By playing him carefully, feinting and the like, you can try to set up a massive flak trap. You can move some of your ships closer and then back. And then, when you throw his timing off, you use the two day turn sequence to land.

Or, perhaps you count on him being unsure and you go right in.

But you can do it.

Not so sure about that...but you know what? we went so far with this game that i think we both deserve a fireworks ending to this match.

Honshu invasion won't be stopped! It's decided! No matter how it will end...we will have our fireworks[:D]

And don't tell we aren't providing you an exiting game[:'(]

Not to carry on two different conversations at once, but CR is right. An invasion of Honshu is still possible once you reorganize. The biggest loss is the air groups but even that can be overcome with PPs in time.

As to my earlier post, it seems the analysis is becoming more clear. Your stated plan was to have CVEs and LBA on close escort with the CV death star blocking KB and intervening if KB showed up. This was a sound plan and in context of said plan the decision to try to use your CVs to chase enemy CV sightings elsewhere removed a key leg in the stool defending your fleet.

This is not criticism, it's analysis. Rader went with a feint and that allowed him to get KB into range. Live and learn.

PS to cheer up, go look at the Allied reinforcement queue!

GreyJoy, anything you decide to do is good with me...as long as you never, Never, NEVER show that dadgum penguin outfit again. You have ruined my eyes, my equilibrium, my desire to live a productive and admirable life.

Yes, but even if i didn't go after the Akagi in the southern seas my CVs would have been out of position no matter what....Rader arrived unseen and i thank God that i didn't have my CVs in the area...imagine my CVs targetted by those waves of bombers....have you counted them? hundreds of torpedo bombers....all at once...with 5/600 fighters on escort...these are numbers not even the allied Death star can hope to counter....think Rader did well with his feint...but also think even if i kept my CVs at PH or at Midway now the situation wouldn't be changed

ORIGINAL: Cribtop

Not to carry on two different conversations at once, but CR is right. An invasion of Honshu is still possible once you reorganize. The biggest loss is the air groups but even that can be overcome with PPs in time.

As to my earlier post, it seems the analysis is becoming more clear. Your stated plan was to have CVEs and LBA on close escort with the CV death star blocking KB and intervening if KB showed up. This was a sound plan and in context of said plan the decision to try to use your CVs to chase enemy CV sightings elsewhere removed a key leg in the stool defending your fleet.

This is not criticism, it's analysis. Rader went with a feint and that allowed him to get KB into range. Live and learn.

PS to cheer up, go look at the Allied reinforcement queue!

Halsey fell for such a diversion .. but luck and the God's prevented a disaster .. but Cribtop is right . I take a look at the queue every day as I am taking beatings in mid '42 [;)]

Make yourself a martini, put the headphones on, get in a comfy chair and put on the slow movement of Beethoven's Pastorale Symphony. Close your eyes (after you memorize where your drink is)...you will see newborn fawn gamboling in a meadow and soon.....all will be forgotten....well....it might take 2 martinis.



An invasion with support of land based fighters is absolutely possible,

Actually, I think with the Death Star and the CVEs and the BBs and the merchies as targets, those raids get split and your CV counter strokes sink half of KBs CVs. Especially if your CVs are positioned out of LBA range, which should have been the case.

That said, I'm not piling on or arguing, but I like to review an action to determine whether I had a bad plan, failed to execute a good plan, or was really the victim of bad die rolls. Often I find the fault lies with me rather than my stars (with apologies to the Bard).

I'm afraid Greyjoy has made the KB up into some sort of mythical creature that cannot be killed, which might be true in 42 and the first half of 43, but not now. By this stage of the game in a purely CV vs CV fight the very best the IJN can hope for is a 1:1 ratio of losses.......which is a disaster fo them. Sure those CVE losses hurt, but you get something like 100 plus in the game................Japan gets 6 (of any value).

I don't fear the KB right now...in fact i was hunting her (or her ghost)...i fear those LBA masses...
 
What would have happened if....
 
 A6M3a Zero x 114
      A6M5 Zero x 103
      G4M1 Betty x 120
      G4M2 Betty x 28
      N1K1-J George x 541
      P1Y1 Frances x 113
 
arrived over my DS...followed by the KB raid? How many of my CVs would have survived?

Those CVE losses wont hurt as much as you think GJ... I realize your down in the dumps, but we're the ones who still see the penguin outfit....(as Dan said)...

You can certainly invade Honshu with LBA, especially from Hokkaido...

Anyway guys...my morale is back again...i have a chinese dinner with my GF...everything went fine...we talked about job and other stuff and i managed to forget my CVEs for some minutes....but now i feel better....Rader has lost nearly 1200 planes and, he said, 600 very experienced pilots....i'm still in a position to threaten his industry and my army is still strong...it's a defeat, obviously, but it's not a KO...
 
...and, in a certain way, i'm also happy that Rader got his moment of glory here...a game should be fun for both the players...
 
I'll be more cautious now...but not to the degree of turtle back in my penguin (it seems you liked it CR[:D]). Don't be afraid...we'll carry on!

I'm just throwing this out there GJ.. but I'm guessing I would not be let down after an evening of partying with you...... When we go over to the ol' Boot, I'll have to come knockin'

ORIGINAL: GreyJoy

I don't fear the KB right now...in fact i was hunting her (or her ghost)...i fear those LBA masses...

What would have happened if....

A6M3a Zero x 114
     A6M5 Zero x 103
     G4M1 Betty x 120
     G4M2 Betty x 28
     N1K1-J George x 541
     P1Y1 Frances x 113

arrived over my DS...followed by the KB raid? How many of my CVs would have survived?

I would never suggest going head to head with them within range of his LBA. However you seriously attrited his KB airgroups during the Tulagi/New Guinea campaign in 43, a perfect time for your CVs to strike.........but they were sitting in PH at the time "Upgrading". BTW (as you will have probably realised after the last bad turn) ship AA upgrades are pretty much pointless as Flak in the game is about a tenth as effective compared to the real war.

BTW- I would call your invasion of Honshu....Crouching Tiger, Fuzzy Penguin..

ORIGINAL: jeffk3510

I'm just throwing this out there GJ.. but I'm guessing I would not be let down after an evening of partying with you...... When we go over to the ol' Boot, I'll have to come knockin'

What's an "Ol'Boot" ?[X(]

However...whenever it will come the time, i'll do my best to satisfy you [:'(]

ORIGINAL: Miller

ORIGINAL: GreyJoy

I don't fear the KB right now...in fact i was hunting her (or her ghost)...i fear those LBA masses...

What would have happened if....

A6M3a Zero x 114
     A6M5 Zero x 103
     G4M1 Betty x 120
     G4M2 Betty x 28
     N1K1-J George x 541
     P1Y1 Frances x 113

arrived over my DS...followed by the KB raid? How many of my CVs would have survived?

I would never suggest going head to head with them within range of his LBA. However you seriously attrited his KB airgroups during the Tulagi/New Guinea campaign in 43, a perfect time for your CVs to strike.........but they were sitting in PH at the time "Upgrading". BTW (as you will have probably realised after the last bad turn) ship AA upgrades are pretty much pointless as Flak in the game is about a tenth as effective compared to the real war.

I would agree with that 100%