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RE: October 1944
Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2017 3:28 pm
by Lowpe
ORIGINAL: Chickenboy
ORIGINAL: John 3rd
October 15, 1944
Osaka
Thought this screen might show what you need. Everything was fully repaired PRIOR to the attack.
All fires are now out on the 16th.
From a modest raid:
10% of LI damaged
5% of HI damaged
10% of refineries damaged
5% of resources damaged
7% of manpower damaged
60% of your Ki-100-I production damaged
Anything destroyed?
Without doing the math ("damaged resource points= X VPs/point"), this appears to have been a worthwhile raid for CR. Any idea (KAFF-Tracker-KAFF) how the VP picture changed as a result of this strategic bombing?
After Tokyo there is no more important city to safeguard with respect to supply generation...and as such should be heavily protected. These results for a loss of a mere 10 B29s (and a large portion of the losses attributable to balloons and not night fighters or AA) is not hopeful for Japan with respect to a dedicated night bombing campaign.
Of course there is more to the story than what I see.
Destroyed items are very difficult to see after the fact except with tracker.
RE: October 1944
Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2017 3:50 pm
by zuluhour
When you play past August '45, You will have plenty of B29s. Groups arrive on top of production. I did not get
them into range of the HI (normal range) until September.
RE: October 1944
Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2017 3:53 pm
by Lowpe
ORIGINAL: zuluhour
When you play past August '45, You will have plenty of B29s. Groups arrive on top of production. I did not get
them into range of the HI (normal range) until September.
Your post said sept of 44?[&:]
RE: October 1944
Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2017 3:58 pm
by zuluhour
ooops! (typing this from secret "office" location where any type of personal reflectance is frowned upon by corp big shot with stock options)
RE: October 1944
Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2017 8:35 pm
by John 3rd
Can I have stock options?
Please...
RE: October 1944
Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2017 8:40 pm
by John 3rd
OK. Serious question. He came in low. I mean LOW--2,000 Ft--and my fighters had no chance at interception. How do I deal with this? Have laready ordered some of the 20MM AA units, who are normally useless, to both Osaka and Tokyo.
Other ideas?
RE: October 1944
Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2017 9:41 pm
by Lowpe
20mm AA units are not worthless...
Make sure all your ENG units are upgraded (toe upgrade).
Make sure some night fighters are down low...usually 4K. You always need to stack you night fighters, I usually like 4K, 8K, and 13K. Most are at 8K, but the low or high cap will catch them and it seems to me to that it give time for the other NFs to join the fight or the next wave.
Another tactic is to put some regular fighters down low at 2K...If I do this I usually use a 10 percent CAP as I want the planes to keep showing up for each wave. By far and away my favorite plane to do this with is a fighter Dinah...which is a dog in every other use. The regular fighters are there to disrupt the bombers and not really slug it out with them...if you have them you might want to try Georges and they might actually down some bombers. I was never in a good enough position to try them...m-m has had good luck with Randy fighters and you could also try fighter bombers.
Plus count your radar sets...make sure you have lots.
Down low sucks, but it also is a lot harder on Allied bombers...
There is at least one unit (a Chinese HQ SNLF named after a base there) that has 40mm June of 45 AA guns in it, spend the 50PP to buy them out and send them to Osaka or Tokyo or Nagasaki. Those guns are great!
Check the leaders in your AA units
RE: October 1944
Posted: Tue Aug 01, 2017 10:05 am
by zuluhour
"...If I do this I usually use a 10 percent CAP as I want the planes to keep showing up for each wave."
This may be great advice, when I had large raids the first wave or two would overwhelm the CAP, but I would
subsequently score some nice results with 6-12 plane "late comers" often driving the fires up significantly.
I wish I had saved some CRs as I recall 50% of the raid or more may show up late.
RE: October 1944
Posted: Tue Aug 01, 2017 12:38 pm
by John 3rd
October 16, 1944
It would appear that China is the Allies choice. GREAT! It will take a couple of months to get to Shanghai so we'll fight the delaying battle while the Homeland strengthens.
There is a Combat Assault by two IDs at Pescadores. The CD chews up a number of Allied ships and warships but the base falls on the 16th. Here is the screen:
RE: October 1944
Posted: Tue Aug 01, 2017 1:00 pm
by John 3rd
October 15-16, 1944
Naval Battles in the Formosa Strait
As detailed earlier, two STF departed Foochow on the 14th looking to try and penetrate the Allied STF screen hoping for fat, juicy targets. As expected, they cannot pierce the 547 STF that guard the good stuff. It is a NASTY night where every fight began at 2,000 Yds!
CA Tone and Chikuma + 4 DD encounter 4 American DD. DD Thatcher is sunk and two American Dds damaged in exchange for 2 TTs planted into the tender side of Chikuma. This pretty much puts the CAs out of further fighting. Though they only move 4 hexes back towards home, they are not attacked by aircraft on the 15th or 16th. It appears that Chikuma will survive--yet again as this is her third torpedoing--as she heads for Port Arthur with two damaged DDs.
CL Sakawa and Isuzu have four DDs with them as well and duke it out with multiple TFs. First the TF finds 2 US DD and sinks DD Wadleigh for little damage to themselves. The 2nd fight is then with 2 CLs and 8 DDs. CL Miami takes a Long Lance and 5 Shell hits and DD Halligan is sunk. Five other American Dds are hit and damaged. Sakawa and a DD are sunk in return.
As Isuzu attempts to retire she is sunk by SS Redfish. A--to this point--rare sinking by American SS of a Japanese warship.
The remaining 3 Japanese Dds fight four more engagements with various Allied units includingthe one pictured yesterday with BB Richeliu. Two of three DDs are sunk. The saddest example is DD Shiranui who dodges not ONE, NOT TWO, NOT THREE, but FOUR TT attacks by American Subs only to get hit by the FIFTH attack by the Tantalus. Too bad. After the third attack I was rooting her home!
Summary
For the loss of 2 CL and 4 DDs, the Americans lose 3 DDs and see damage to a modern CL and 7-9 DDs.
As stated when I sent these ships into Harm's Way, I did not expect any survives. Instead, we do get 2 CAs and 4 DDs back.
RE: October 1944
Posted: Tue Aug 01, 2017 1:07 pm
by John 3rd
As requested, here is the current VP Screen:
RE: October 1944
Posted: Tue Aug 01, 2017 8:19 pm
by John 3rd
October 17, 1944
Here we go with the Allied juggernaut beginning to MOSEY along looking for a soft spot to land troops. Not going to happen this time.
RED: Troops shuttled up from the DEI continue to get landed at both Changkwonan and Hong Kong. I shouldn't be allowed to do this but another 15,000 troops will off-load over the next 2-3 days.
PINK: Damaged CA and 3 DDs moving up to Port Arthur
ORANGE: Major landings of reinforcements either going on or occurring tomorrow.
YELLOW: Allied Fleet
RE: October 1944
Posted: Tue Aug 01, 2017 8:27 pm
by John 3rd
Tanker Task Force Update:
FREE: THREE Tanker Task Forces are now clear and moving either towards or past Iwo Jima. They are carrying 108,000 Fuel, 72,000 Fuel, and 72,000 Oil: 257,000 Total that WILL MAKE IT Home!
Two AK TFs carrying 49,000 Fuel to Babeldoap and Saipan to re-fuel the Fleet. Unloading today and tomorrow.
Nearly Free: Two task Forces with 89,000 Fuel and 132,000 Oil.
Loading: Two Task Forces with up to 140,000 Oil and Fuel.
Coming to DEI: One AO Task Force with the potential load of 80,000 Fuel.
CRAZY and I love it!
BANZAI!
RE: October 1944
Posted: Tue Aug 01, 2017 8:36 pm
by John 3rd
Wanted to thank several contributors. I had not done a hex-by-hex check of the Home Islands and found many LCU available to take upgrades but had not turned it on. Have done that over the last two turns (a CRAPLOAD of clicking) and saw 50+ units upgrade yesterday and another 30-40 today.
THANKS!
RE: October 1944
Posted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 3:55 am
by adarbrauner
ORIGINAL: John 3rd
October 15-16, 1944
Naval Battles in the Formosa Strait
As detailed earlier, two STF departed Foochow on the 14th looking to try and penetrate the Allied STF screen hoping for fat, juicy targets. As expected, they cannot pierce the 547 STF that guard the good stuff. It is a NASTY night where every fight began at 2,000 Yds!
CA Tone and Chikuma + 4 DD encounter 4 American DD. DD Thatcher is sunk and two American Dds damaged in exchange for 2 TTs planted into the tender side of Chikuma. This pretty much puts the CAs out of further fighting. Though they only move 4 hexes back towards home, they are not attacked by aircraft on the 15th or 16th. It appears that Chikuma will survive--yet again as this is her third torpedoing--as she heads for Port Arthur with two damaged DDs.
CL Sakawa and Isuzu have four DDs with them as well and duke it out with multiple TFs. First the TF finds 2 US DD and sinks DD Wadleigh for little damage to themselves. The 2nd fight is then with 2 CLs and 8 DDs. CL Miami takes a Long Lance and 5 Shell hits and DD Halligan is sunk. Five other American Dds are hit and damaged. Sakawa and a DD are sunk in return.
As Isuzu attempts to retire she is sunk by SS Redfish. A--to this point--rare sinking by American SS of a Japanese warship.
The remaining 3 Japanese Dds fight four more engagements with various Allied units includingthe one pictured yesterday with BB Richeliu. Two of three DDs are sunk. The saddest example is DD Shiranui who dodges not ONE, NOT TWO, NOT THREE, but FOUR TT attacks by American Subs only to get hit by the FIFTH attack by the Tantalus. Too bad. After the third attack I was rooting her home!
Summary
For the loss of 2 CL and 4 DDs, the Americans lose 3 DDs and see damage to a modern CL and 7-9 DDs.
As stated when I sent these ships into Harm's Way, I did not expect any survives. Instead, we do get 2 CAs and 4 DDs back.
Very ggod results indeed, considered the odds!
But, ideally: could have been brought more raiding parties/fleets, including heavies, possibly even Musashi? And the greatest possible number of PTs flottillas; with the heaviest CAP you could gather?
Ideally, fleet commanders could have been choosen with low aggressivity, to aid to a "hit and run" raiding tactic; alternatively, a search pattern/line could be set with first end "inside" enemy's nest and the other further off toward home, mission or full speed and "low" threat setting;
and why not with night air attacks as well as dressing?
would you also consider one/more than one kami strikes of 100+ fast airplanes each, escorted by very big fighter formation (300-400 or more Franks/Georges/Sams), from high-very high altitude?
RE: October 1944
Posted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 6:45 am
by modrow
ORIGINAL: John 3rd
Summary
For the loss of 2 CL and 4 DDs, the Americans lose 3 DDs and see damage to a modern CL and 7-9 DDs.
As stated when I sent these ships into Harm's Way, I did not expect any survives. Instead, we do get 2 CAs and 4 DDs back.
It may be just me, but I think you should look at your victory -if it is one- either as
"For the loss of 2 CL and 4 DDs, the Americans lose 3 DDs."
or as
"For the loss of 2CL and 4DDs and damage to 1 CA and 3DDs (or is it 4?), the Americans lose 3DDs and see damage to a modern CL and 7-9 DDs."
Just my point of view.
Hartwig
RE: October 1944
Posted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 8:26 am
by Timotheus
I am reading this.
Fantastic literary work this, and as a bonus a decent player of the game shows us how it's done.
Controversy: I am a big fan of the game engine squashing any "gaminess". The game allows civilian ship "pickets" - I think the game engine should prioritize the biggest threats as targets for the carrier air... so that 100 Kates wouldn't go for an AKL while 5 Kates go for the Lexington...
In fact, I am shocked that there isn't an extra setting on "Preferred Targets" for each naval task force (and their air component): you could want to prioritize civilian, carrier or standard (everything targetted)...
I blame the game engine - this should have been addressed.
Oh yeah: I have not caught up to the latest post, it will take me some time. Refuse to read so no spoilers for me until I get here.... to 2017 (am a few years behind [:'(]).
RE: October 1944
Posted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 10:30 am
by JohnDillworth
Unfortunately, you could also look at it as the IJN lost 25% of their remaining cl's and 5% of their dd's and the allies lost some pocket change. 1:1 exchanges are not wins at any point in the game, much less now
RE: October 1944
Posted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 10:37 am
by adarbrauner
ORIGINAL: Timotheus
I am reading this.
Fantastic literary work this, and as a bonus a decent player of the game shows us how it's done.
Controversy: I am a big fan of the game engine squashing any "gaminess". The game allows civilian ship "pickets" - I think the game engine should prioritize the biggest threats as targets for the carrier air... so that 100 Kates wouldn't go for an AKL while 5 Kates go for the Lexington...
In fact, I am shocked that there isn't an extra setting on "Preferred Targets" for each naval task force (and their air component): you could want to prioritize civilian, carrier or standard (everything targetted)...
I blame the game engine - this should have been addressed.
Oh yeah: I have not caught up to the latest post, it will take me some time. Refuse to read so no spoilers for me until I get here.... to 2017 (am a few years behind [:'(]).
Timotheus, you know the game engine and AI prioritize air attacks on valuable targets. Particularly unvaluable targets are object of a strike, in AI logic and processing, only if no other more worthy target is available, and many times not at all. But I think you this very well indeed.
RE: October 1944
Posted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 10:40 am
by adarbrauner
ORIGINAL: hartwig.modrow
It may be just me, but I think you should look at your victory -if it is one- either as
"For the loss of 2 CL and 4 DDs, the Americans lose 3 DDs."
or as
"For the loss of 2CL and 4DDs and damage to 1 CA and 3DDs (or is it 4?), the Americans lose 3DDs and see damage to a modern CL and 7-9 DDs."
Just my point of view.
Hartwig
You could see it in this way also, that Japan traded ships which soon may become useless for money worth targets.
Where ever have you seen a Japanese minor surface fleet confront vis a vis main American surface battle group at the end of 1944 and get results?