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Thanks Cap Mandrake!
Actually the 2 days turn has also some good aspects... cause the enemy is usually slowed down in his reaction...but you're right about CD guns and BB ammos...that is a big issue!
 
My BB guns are almost useless against that concentration of CD guns...same goes for my bombers against those AAs... but i'll try to keep on pounding the place.
 
Unfortunately my TFs aren't composed only by APAs...i only have 50 APAs so i have to use everything i have...xAPs included...[:o]
 
It's gonna be really bloody [:D]

ORIGINAL: Nemo121

Just to be clear: I have no idea what Rader has there and due to recent events I won't even speculate.

What I will just say though is that if the IJA has double the AV then it CAN defeat an amphibious invasion even into 1945 ( when the firepower disparity is even greater ). Before someone claims I'm cheating or drawing from something in Rader's thread I'll just say that I know this ONLY because I've defeated an Allied amphibious invasion comprising just under 1,200 AV ( before landing ) with a defending force which eventually measured 1800 AV around Okinawa. My initial 1,000 AV destroyed some 300 AV as he landed and he never got more than 900 AV functioning on the base. Aerial bombing to disrupt his ground forces combined with repeated attacks eventually forced the surrender of the Allied forces.

There are obvious implications of this maths ( from another similar game ) for your game. I give no suggestions as to how you should proceed. I'm just pointing out my personal experience from a game in which I had to face Allied amphibious invasions.

and might I add ... turned the tables and took back Naha ...[;)]

ORIGINAL: Nemo121

Just to be clear: I have no idea what Rader has there and due to recent events I won't even speculate.

What I will just say though is that if the IJA has double the AV then it CAN defeat an amphibious invasion even into 1945 ( when the firepower disparity is even greater ). Before someone claims I'm cheating or drawing from something in Rader's thread I'll just say that I know this ONLY because I've defeated an Allied amphibious invasion comprising just under 1,200 AV ( before landing ) with a defending force which eventually measured 1800 AV around Okinawa. My initial 1,000 AV destroyed some 300 AV as he landed and he never got more than 900 AV functioning on the base. Aerial bombing to disrupt his ground forces combined with repeated attacks eventually forced the surrender of the Allied forces.

There are obvious implications of this maths ( from another similar game ) for your game. I give no suggestions as to how you should proceed. I'm just pointing out my personal experience from a game in which I had to face Allied amphibious invasions.

Nemo, i'm sorry but i still don't understand your "tone"...your last message here in this AAR was pretty criptic and you never came back to explain what was happening.
Did i say anything wrong?

Anyway...i know what you've done there...i've tried to study that campaign... i know i have very tiny % of success here...but i think it's worth and fun trying.
I have no other options at the moment strategically speaking and i don't wanna keep on strat bombing...let's see how it goes...[:)]

ORIGINAL: JohnDillworth

I Landed at Fukadoma once in downfall.  I had to go through the Tsushima with a bunch of 40CM CD gun's.  The invasion work, I cut Japan in half but I got messed up.  Sank 2 old BB's couple of CA's and any aka hit by a single shell evaporated.  Took it in the days but it was tough going.  I did notice that the big guns really want to dual with the big ships so if you have an old BB in your invasion task force it will draw a lot of attention.  I believe big port air attacks suppress these guns to some extent so what ever you can spare, including dive bombers and TBM's might want to run port attacks.  Can't confirm this though.

Yes, i'm adding 6 old BBs to the invasions and a lot of DDs and CAs...hopefully they will absorb the bulk of CD guns ammos...

Aboard USS New Jersey, 160+ miles east of some unpronounceable Japanese ville:

Ser Greyjoy, as to you not understanding Nemo's "tone"....not to worry. I am certain you are not the source of his "tone". Nemo is a person who prizes his integrity and it has been bruised more than once in these forums. He bristles easily as a result whenever there is even a question that someone might challenge it.

However, as we all know, he knows this game as well as anyone, if not better. It is a wise man that listens carefully to his advise on strategy and tactics. He is saying the invasion is likely to fail. Funny that...seems several have tried to discourage this frontal assault to no avail. But, the Gereagle (you) has chosen its course. So....to glory and that your name will never be forgotten!

Now...my 2cents on the feint/CAP trap......it is war. Cpt Mandrake said it about as well as it could be stated. princepBolton goes on record as a +1 to Mandrake's comments and that you did nothing wrong. If a house rule resolves it...good.

Now...let's go sink something.

GJ, No, nothing you've said at all. Just someone with an agenda, a lack of moral fibre, a large dollop of paranoia and an equally large failure of common sense elsewhere. Forget about it and focus on your game - which appears to be reaching an interesting point in time ( based solely on what you are saying in this thread ).


Princep, GJ,
Just to be clear though. I've not said the invasion will fail. I've given no advice or indication as to my assessment of its chance of success either way.

I've simply pointed out a datum point from another game which GJ may wish to consider in his own, independent, considerations. I've indicated that I believe that the datum point is applicable but I haven't gone into any detail outlining any of my own detailed conclusions from my experience in a similar situation.

Basically I've just said - "You may want to read x where the IJA drove the US off the beaches and draw your own conclusions". I've not given any analysis or advice.

20 Jap Divisions....4 long tons of Emperor Brand Kool-aide mix, plenty of fresh water and lovely mixing bowls...what could POSSIBLY go wrong. [:)]

Great entertainment.

Well, good luck, you have bigger cajones than me. I don't think I would try it.[;)]

Given GJ's past, maybe Kagoshima is the real target!

Well, good luck, you have bigger cajones than me. I don't think I would try it.

Rader has some good stuff there, he also has some mega-crap depot divisions. If Rader does not throw him out before the first wave he has trouble. What was in that second wave??????? Yeah, 4 USMC divisions. Like I said, I think it will be a problem getting ashore. but if GJ takes that port and keeps his CV's, Rader should bring a pen to Tokyo bay whilst we shop for a different AAR

Nemo, the community really appreciates you and trusts you from the posts I've read. While this is not a condemnation of that person you referred to I think you should feel free to, at least in this thread, to follow your own rules of honour. ^^

Greyjoy: I have no idea how important preperation is, but unless it's absolutely necessary for success then wouldn't it be best to land somewhere surprising? Though going by Operation Suddenly Hairy and the most recent diversion I can't say I'm sure you're actually going to land at Hachinoe and surrounds.

Good luck, whatever you chose/have chosen!

GJ: I really hope you are fooling us and landing the big one at Akita or even Niigata (nice doggies, those Akitas--that's it, "Operation Hairy Dog: The Akita Landing"). Your feint was hardly damaged and it seemed to only attract a lot of his troops.

Anyway, the suspense of this is killing me.

Cheers,
CC

Doesn't it make most sense to continue these feints for a month, to do more damage and disruption to the Japanese defense?

Just follow the new HR and add a bit of carrier and the same CAP trap and he'll lose tons of airplanes if the results were anything but an outlier.
Also, I should have said this two-three days ago, but this is probably a great time to switch and bomb his A/C factories a couple of times, provided they're far enough away from Tokyo.

I am guessing he will pull a fast one on us again... [:D]

Yea, it's starting to look like that isn't it? Especially since it's the weekend, and in Europe here it's mid-afternoon but no post yet about developments since early last night. Hmmmmm.

ORIGINAL: obvert

Yea, it's starting to look like that isn't it? Especially since it's the weekend, and in Europe here it's mid-afternoon but no post yet about developments since early last night. Hmmmmm.

ahahah, no mate...it's not like that. Rader had a busy week end and so no turn flew in my mail box since yesterday morning...and however i had my GF staying by me last night so i couldn't even read the forum[:@]...and today i'm already at work[:(]

Anyway...i understand your feelings and your fears guys...don't think i'm so crazy not to fear this operation...we're landing right into the lion's jaws and Rader still has the most powerfull war machine we have ever seen...so yes, i'm scared and yes, i know the implications of a defeat...which remains a very plausible possible outcome... but we all know that this is what everybody wants...we all want to see this titanic battle...we all want to see if my divisions will be able to hold the ground untill the second wave arrives...we all wanna see if the allied CAP will be enough to absorb the punishment of 5/6000 japanese planes... this is the moment of truth...this is where we're gonna fight and die....this is where we're gonna enter into the pages of history books for decades to come...our names will be written with blood and glory into AE Records.
That's what we want.
Immortality.
Victory and defeat doesn't matter.
Glory and Pride do.

I'm starting to feel all tingly and patriotic! We're just so used to your proclivity it feels odd when there is no note for more than a few hours! GFs do take time, I know all about it!

Anyway...as you all know...the first hours will be decisive.
If the CD guns and the waves of torpedo bombers will kill our men directly on their boats, the invasion will be a disaster. To hold a chance we must arrive in combat shape on the beaches and estabilish a foothold strong enough not to be pushed back into the ocean... he has the streght to push me out. I know. Our bombers will have to pound his troops the hardest possible...our fighters will have to fight at their best to clear the skies above the landing site...our surface assets will have to hold the water perimeter and keep his BBs and CAs away from my TFs...
If it all fails...well, we'll have to swicth back to strat bombing...[>:]

Aboard USS New Jersey, somewhere east of Honshu:

princepBolton laid down his whetstone and turned off the blade grinder. He wiped his hands clean of grease and oil and carefully rubbed his eyes. It had been a long night of preparation. But he was ready. Now he would say his goodbyes to Admiral Ser Greyjoy and his friends among the crew. Soon, he knew, he would likely enter the maw of sure death. But princep did not demur. He smiled briefly. Having known so much death, his own demise held little fear.

For glory....Forward.

I suppose this is pretty obvious but make sure the weather is good over the friendly airfields on D-Day...even if you have to do the Eisenhower thingy.

Also, am I to understand that the 2nd "wave" has to use what is left of the transports from the 1st wave? [X(] It will take them at least 3 and more likely 4-5 2 day turns to get back..and many will be damaged or swimming with the fishes. Can you not create landing craft in Hokkaido? Seems like there would be enough for a few divisions.