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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent
Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 7:56 pm
by Canoerebel
Six of the seven fleet carriers have Hellcats. The seventh will upgrade at the next port of call. Many of the carriers are carrying extra F4F squadrons, as are all the CVEs.
Thanks for the nice words. I do think things are going well. But I know that if certain elite players (Nemo, others) were to weigh in now, they could point out a zillion flaws in all I've done and what I'm doing. To be honest, I'm glad they're not weighing in. I'm having fun, I'm learning (not as fast as I might be, but learning nonetheless) and it's just been nice to play the game without elite folks trying (with best of intentions) to, in effect, ghost write the script.
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent
Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 8:40 pm
by catwhoorg
Hokkaido would clearly have been a bridge too far.
This is a nice limited (and sucessful) operation that has drawn the KB out and burnt more fuel.
Against the AI Hokkaido would have been easy. not so much against a player.
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent
Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 9:00 pm
by JeffroK
I'm surprised that so many think the CR detailed a plan, fair enough to rebase into centre field (PH) which allows further ops, but a generalised Gilberts and/or Marshalls isnt a plan.
What you have learned is more about JIII, for all of his experience and knowledge of the mod all he has done is a mad bull rush across the map, picked off a small number of minor shipping and performed an expensive raid on your strongest point.
He has a Claymore and swings it like a Club!!
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent
Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 9:20 pm
by Canoerebel
It's not a plan on the order of Operation Circus - it didn't take four months of planning and moving assets across the globe. But it's more than you're crediting, I think. Real detailed planning began a month ago, when I positioned 7th Australian Division here and switched prep on many of the Circus units at Pearl for Marshalls and Gilberts locales. Then 6th Australian and 40th USA Div. were diverted this way. Finally, as Circus got underway, late-arriving ships were diverted to Pearl. This process continued throughout Circus and up to today. And then, as Circus in chief wound down, all extra troops, the best empty transports, and the combat ships and carriers began steering this way. By the time this next operation unfolds, some of the key infantry units should be prepped 50% to 60%. That's not great, but that's good enough if the Allies have a week or so free of KB (that's the exact recipe Circus followed).
This is a plan, but it's one of opportunity, where I did some things to allow me to jump at the chance should it work right.
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent
Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 9:33 pm
by JohnDillworth
KB, which probably needs to stop to refuel, replace aircraft, replenish sorties
Don't overestimate Johns losses. 60 dive bombers (a dozen for each CV?) is nothing in this mod. He needs to reload, not rebuild. a few days he is at 100% with healthy pools. You flicked the KB on the nose, nothing more. 60 air frames in this mod is a long afternoon
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent
Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 10:43 pm
by Canoerebel
In a carrier fight the Jill losses would make little difference. But they weigh on John's mind in such a way that it could be material. John went into this fray with Shiny Brass KB and 900 aircraft (just guessing here - maybe 400 Jills?) KB launches a port raid, uses up some sorties and loses maybe 15% of ita Jilla. To us, KB remains basically as potent as ever. But in John's mind the brass is tarnished. He'll go into battle as is if necessary, but already he's thinking about retiring to port to replenish. If that takes him out of his way to Home Islands, then the Allies do get the inside track.
None of this is certain or set in stone. But it's details like these that go into the decision about how to proceed.
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent
Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 10:57 pm
by Canoerebel
6/10/43
Battle of Sumatra: Seven BBs bombard Sabang. Then five IJA divisions deliberate attack and get a 1:1, which comes as an unpleasant surprise. Most of John's bombardments haven't touched infantry, but these seem to have (possibly because there is only infantry in the hex - so I'll try moving some other units there from the adjacent hex). But their are big cracks in the ice now. John will be jazzed (and with good reason - today is D Plus 7 months, so he's ready for the conquest and now). The base could fall on the next attack. A frightening prospect. But his seven BBs will not be involved in any action in the Pacific in the next two or three weeks, which is the last small dividend of a big operation coming to a sad end.
Operation Circus: KB is moving slowly west with the TFs separated, breaking apart like a weakening hurricane that has spent its fury. It seems like John has experienced some kind of dash of cold water that's awakened him from his passion. He sent KB dashing across the Pacific; his emails were full of bluster; he promised a massive and bloody thrashing; he came charging in like a mad bull; he ripped into some shipping; he blunted his Jills against a flak-trap; and now he's just drifting west in desultory fashion. I can only think he's realized suddenly that the Aleutians are fairly strongly held; that there are no easy or quick conquests here; and that he needs to figure out what comes next.
The Allies have begun the tedious process of redistributing troops, especially from the hub that is Dutch Harbor. LSTs and an xAP loaded 15th Marine CD, took it to nearby Umnak, unloaded it, and almost made it back to Dutch in a single turn. Other troop and supply TFs are moving forward from Kodiak. Some fighters are moving forward. And one fairly stout combat TF remains at Kodiak to protect against enemy combat TFs.
An IJN sub picked off another TK near Kodiak. That's two "good" ships in two days. A USN sub picked off what seemed to be a big xAP nearing the Sea of Japan.
Elsewhere: The American carriers are steaming south and will separate to allow the fleet CVs to spend a few more days in port. 7th USA Div. aboard mostly APA just left San Fran for Pearl. So the Allies are swinging south. John may well catch on to this threat. If that happens, I won't move into the teeth of a gale yet. KB is too strong. But in a month, Death Star will be strong enough to face down KB someplace close to any sizeable Allied base. I'm thinking an invasion of Amchitka would work since Allied-held Adak and Ulak are right there.
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent
Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 11:18 pm
by crsutton
ORIGINAL: JeffK
I'm surprised that so many think the CR detailed a plan, fair enough to rebase into centre field (PH) which allows further ops, but a generalised Gilberts and/or Marshalls isnt a plan.
What you have learned is more about JIII, for all of his experience and knowledge of the mod all he has done is a mad bull rush across the map, picked off a small number of minor shipping and performed an expensive raid on your strongest point.
He has a Claymore and swings it like a Club!!
Don't underestimate JohnIII. I'm sure he had a plan as well. Neither plan came off as expected.
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent
Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 12:06 am
by Grfin Zeppelin
ORIGINAL: JohnDillworth
KB, which probably needs to stop to refuel, replace aircraft, replenish sorties
Don't overestimate Johns losses. 60 dive bombers (a dozen for each CV?) is nothing in this mod. He needs to reload, not rebuild. a few days he is at 100% with healthy pools. You flicked the KB on the nose, nothing more. 60 air frames in this mod is a long afternoon
1st. The Jill is a Torpedo plane.
2nd. How many do you think he produces each month ? Thats alot of planes and pilots thrown away for nothing.
3rd, the Japanese economy is
weaker in this mod not
stronger.He has more ships yes but for that the started with less resources.
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent
Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 12:29 am
by Canoerebel
Hey, quit exposing my weaknesses! Those planes attacked with bombs, ergo that were dive bombers....
It's been so long since I've played a game into 1943 that I've forgotten which planes do what (as a youngster loving the Pac war, every Japanese plane was a Zero, Kate or Val; I never knew anything else). In fact, this may be the first AE game I've played into '43. I've played three that ended in late '42 or Jan. '43. My last game into '43 may have been WitP vs. Miller back in '07 and '08.
So, Jills are torpedo planes. No wonder I haven't seen any Kates from KB.
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent
Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 1:04 am
by ny59giants
Japanese airframe range - I'm not sure if it was Stanislov (FatR) or maybe Symon, but the air strike range of the Jill and Judy is more than stock. This will not effect CV versus CV encounters, but it will allow John to stand off at greater range to hit transports unloading.
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent
Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 1:30 am
by witpqs
ORIGINAL: ny59giants
Japanese airframe range - I'm not sure if it was Stanislov (FatR) or maybe Symon, but the air strike range of the Jill and Judy is more than stock. This will not effect CV versus CV encounters, but it will allow John to stand off at greater range to hit transports unloading.
No - those are still in TF. But certainly to hit bases, including ships disbanded in port.
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent
Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 11:45 am
by Miller
ORIGINAL: Canoerebel
Hey, quit exposing my weaknesses! Those planes attacked with bombs, ergo that were dive bombers....
It's been so long since I've played a game into 1943 that I've forgotten which planes do what (as a youngster loving the Pac war, every Japanese plane was a Zero, Kate or Val; I never knew anything else). In fact, this may be the first AE game I've played into '43. I've played three that ended in late '42 or Jan. '43. My last game into '43 may have been WitP vs. Miller back in '07 and '08.
So, Jills are torpedo planes. No wonder I haven't seen any Kates from KB.
Our AE game ended in mid 44 iirc....
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent
Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 1:19 pm
by Lecivius
Another thing to bear in mind. You get Hellcats. But John has streamlined his fighter production as well. He has advanced fighters coming on line for his carriers, Hellcats are not The Thing. You must be careful [;)]
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent
Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 2:15 pm
by crsutton
ORIGINAL: ny59giants
Japanese airframe range - I'm not sure if it was Stanislov (FatR) or maybe Symon, but the air strike range of the Jill and Judy is more than stock. This will not effect CV versus CV encounters, but it will allow John to stand off at greater range to hit transports unloading.
I think that Japanese naval strike range from carriers is still limited to eight hexes vs all TF. Seven for Allies. I have heard nothing about this being changed in the code. This does not affect port and city strikes which can be launched from longer ranges. Someone will correct me if I am wrong.
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent
Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 2:18 pm
by witpqs
ORIGINAL: crsutton
ORIGINAL: ny59giants
Japanese airframe range - I'm not sure if it was Stanislov (FatR) or maybe Symon, but the air strike range of the Jill and Judy is more than stock. This will not effect CV versus CV encounters, but it will allow John to stand off at greater range to hit transports unloading.
I think that Japanese naval strike range from carriers is still limited to eight hexes vs all TF. Seven for Allies. I have heard nothing about this being changed in the code. This does not affect port and city strikes which can be launched from longer ranges. Someone will correct me if I am wrong.
You are correct!
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent
Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 2:25 pm
by poodlebrain
ORIGINAL: Lecivius
Another thing to bear in mind. You get Hellcats. But John has streamlined his fighter production as well. He has advanced fighters coming on line for his carriers, Hellcats are not The Thing. You must be careful [;)]
The qualitative improvement over the Wildcat is so dramatic that it changes how U.S. carriers can be employed. The improved fighters allow Americans carriers to seek combat in conditions that were just plain foolish with Wildcats for fleet defense. Hellcats aren't invulnerable, but they are superior to anything the Japanese are currently fielding, which was not the case for the Wildcats they are replacing. It is unlikely that Japan will field any carrier based aircraft comparable to the Hellcat until mid-1944. That is a pretty substantial window of opportunity for the Allies.
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent
Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 2:34 pm
by Canoerebel
You gents have given me a couple of helpful nuggets of information, first confirming that the old "eight-hex" range for IJ carrier strike aircraft is still the key to the game (I thought so, but wasn't sure), and that Hellcats, while not super-planes, nevertheless are signficant improvements that will level the playing field probably into '44 (I knew they were good, but I didn't have the slightest idea when the next generation of Japanese carrier fighters might appear).
Death Star is growing quickly now: two CVEs are on board; an RN CV that I think can carry 50 aircraft will be ready at San Fran in two days; two Essex class, two CVLs, and one more CVE arrive within 40 days. Assuming I have enough pilots in reserve to make all these squadrons veteran, then I think at that point Death Star need not quake at the prospect of a carrier battle. I won't go out deep into no-man's-land venturing, but I won't necessarily shrink from working on the margins or at places in close proximity to big Allied airfields.
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent
Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 2:47 pm
by Canoerebel
6/12/43
Battle of Sumatra: No attacks or bombardments today, but I expect them to recommence tomorrow (or, possibly, for John to wait for his infantry to recover from disruption in order to attack in a day or two or three). My troops have recovered pretty nicely, though more nuclear bombardments could unhinge them enough to fold. But probably they'll withstand one more attack since there are three forts remaining. After that, I bet John shock attacks and takes Sabang. More about that in a later post.
Operation Circus: KB has vanished into the west, where SigInt reports heavy radio traffic at Paramushiro, a level 5 port. Base building at several places in Hokkaido has stepepd up. Now the big question is: "what does John do with KB." Does he sense I'm moving south now? Or is he stilled concerned about NoPac? Or is he even planning a counteroffensive there? I have three plans: (1) if John commences a bold move south; (2) if he dawdles a bit but soon begins to move south; or (3) if he keeps KB posted in NoPac.
Some of the Allied plans are bold, some are conservative, and the internal weighing of info that I'll go through over the next week to arrive at a decision will be pretty boring, so I won't go into too much detail.
One of the satisfying things that I'm doing right now is repositioning troops in the Aleutians: matching cadres with parent units; shifting troops forward from the "hub" ports of Dutch Harbor and Kodiak; getting supply forward, etc. This would make awful reading for you guys, but it is important even if behind-the-scenes quality. So here again, I won't go into great detail. But just a for instance: DH has a 35k stacking limit. Two days ago it had 81k troops. I have that down to 70k and will continue to work that as quickly as possible.
There is danger out here, of coure. An IJN combat TF can rip these merchants. And IJN subs are active (today putting a torp into a big xAP that suffered moderate damage). But the Allies aren't toothless. SBDs stationed at Adak hit Amchitka harbor, damaging two or three xAKs (Allied escorts met modest CAP over the island).
I'm also busy re-working prep since many units were targeted to Hokkaido bases. Some of the prep is now for the forward Aleut bases. John has a nest of four big ones - Attu, Amchitka, Buldir and Shemya. They are all strongly held with big airfields. But given the proximity of the big Allied bases, this will be a worthwile campaign going forward.
As for the new Allied bases, John will have a very hard time taking the big ones: Ulak (USA RCT at 110 AV); Adak (9th Aus. Div. reinforced at 650 AV); Umnak (2nd Marine Div. reinforced at 400 AV); Dutch Harbor (two Marine regiments reinforced at 300 AV); Akutan (100 AV); and Cold Bay (40th USA Div. reinforced at 300 AV). Most of these garrisoned will grow stronger as disablements recover.
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent
Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 3:09 pm
by Canoerebel
Sumatra Campaign
There is a fitting line in one of the Lord of the Rings movies: "Here at tthe end of all things."
Indeed, the Allied position at Sumatra will fall within the week. John has earned the right to celebrate his victory. He will (and probably already has) posted in detail what's going on, so I probably don't need to go into great detail as to what's there and the like. Yet, if I'm going to take pleasure in reporting my victories, fairness demands that I disclose my defeats.
You already know that the Allied army in Sumatra is immense. It was built around seven divisions: one Indian, 18th UK, 1st Marines, and four USA (27th, Americal, and two in the "30s"). These were reinforced by elements of two marine regiments, a few parachute fragments, some tank units and combat engineers, and a few arty units. There is also a massive amount of support, including AA, base force personnel, and HQ units including some US airforce commands and SWPac.
I haven't counted troops, but this army might be 100k to 150k. At the same time, it has been whittled through fighting and campaigning over the past seven months. I turned off replacements long ago as supply was my limiting factor. So most of the divisions are now at half strength or less. Americal (broken into it's three RCT) is nearly full strength. But 18th UK, for instance, is 118 AV, and 1st Marine is 222 AV (and neither unit has a single disabled squad, so that's a true number).
In the real war, of course, losing an army like this would be unacceptable. You couldn't do it nor could you expound on the "silver linings." Fortunately for me, this is a game and I get to continue. That's good, because I'm having the most fun imaginable.
Could the Allies have succeeded? Yes. They held for seven months against everything John could throw at them (he controlled the air since early January and the sea since mid February). It's not hard to come up with scenarios in which the Allied army could have fought much longer (given 100k more supply, I wouldn't have turned off renforcements, so my army might have been 2.5k instead of 1.5k, etc.) or sent in relief convoys, etc. We'd have been fighting into mid summer or later, so the Death Star would have been substantial enough for the Allies to force reinforcements and supply in.
The biggest thing I did wrong was to enter the game (and the campaign) not having a real clue as to how Allied fighter pools worked. With modestly highter replacement rates the Allied invasion probably would have succeeded. The second biggest thing I did wrong was to not establish at least one very strong base in the Nicobars. And there are lots of other things too (not bringing in CD guns, etc.)
There were lots of things I did right, too, commencing with achieving total suprise, bringing the kitchen sink, and fighting a very tough defensive campaign. The strongest evidence of that is the seven month duration.
And that's probably the strongest evidence that John didn't do some things right. I still think he should have risked an invasion of Sabang or Langsa months ago to stop the "time and resource suck" that this campaign became for him.
But this isn't a time to focus on what went wrong for him. He's justified in taking well-earned satisfaction in vanquishing a massive Allied army. To the victor go the laurels.
And what happens now? Does he begin working on his defensive network since it's mid 1943 and since the Allies are showing signs of aggression? Or is he emboldened to take action against Ceylon, NE India, SW Oz, or some other place? (The absence of KB in the first two places suggest he won't move there).
Two predictions I will make: (1) after Sabang falls, John will post words to this effect in his AAR: "Thank goodness. Now I can focus on prosecuting the war;" and (2) he will send me an email with words to this effect: "Thank goodness that's over with. It was a very tight thing. If you had just done x, y, and z, I would've been toast."
Bottom line: What fun!