Matrix Games Forums

ORIGINAL: fenrislokison
However, i'm not sure about one thing: are you sure you get the science bonus of a location if the type of your research station doesn't match the bonus type?
I mean, does it really work if you put a high tech station on a energy location for example?

I never tried before and i can't right now since i'm at work but i will asap :p

Yes, you do.
One thing I did notice though is if let's say you have one of these generic research stations at each type of bonus site but only 1 scientist with all 3 skills then you will lose the site bonus from the unmanned sites (at least if the skill bonus is higher than the site...I had some crappy sites lol).

Wait, your scientist can provide all three bonuses without having access to all three kinds of labs? I did not know that. Edit: And as it turns out, I didn't know it because it's not the case.

I did some testing with with a +23% weapons research bonus, an energy research station, and a multi-school scientist.

Energy station with no weapons lab on weapon research bonus = no bonus at all.
Energy station with 1 weapons lab on weapon research bonus = +23% research bonus.
Triple-school scientist at energy station with 1 energy lab and 1 weapon lab = +18% weaps, +49% energy, +0% HT.
Triple-school scientist at energy station with 1 of each lab = +18% weaps, +49% energy, +23% HT.

So there you have it. A scientist needs access to at least one lab of the right kind to provide a bonus. Any kind of research station with at least one lab of the right type can provide a location bonus.

Hi!

as per the suggestion from this guide, i use a variation on the universal small space port. but in later game, when i need to get a space port up and running quickly, it is not quick to build. any guidelines on a quick to build, relatively secure space port?

Also, what is it, about the design of that universal space port that makes it take so long to build, is it the labs? also, is it wise to have labs on every space port?

thank you

Hi mdbeebz.

Research is weirdly implemented in this game - read my explanation on it and also read up others guides on research.

You basically need just enough labs to be equal to or just over the total possible research for your race at that moment. Whether the labs are in spaceports, space labs OR (blowing your mind here, [;)]) private mining bases or private ships, is up to you.

My constructors build stuff pretty quickly; it depends how many manufacturies you put on that ship I think.

So there you have it. A scientist needs access to at least one lab of the right kind to provide a bonus. Any kind of research station with at least one lab of the right type can provide a location bonus.

So only one lab is needed for a scientist to have his bonus in play then? Confirmed?

Cool.

Yes I have seen that on my labs.

Thank you for this guide, but...

700 stars with full manual control : are you CRAZY?!

I restarted a game with 100 stars, and even then, I expect it to last for several hundred hours... (though mostly, it's true, because learning how the game works takes a lot of time)

my last 3 games, i went with huge galaxy (15x15), 1400 stars, plentiful colonies and 20 rivals

Its definitely not impossible to do nor is it overwhelming. You don't even have to know the game mechanics in details to succeed

But i have to say that nearing the end, it's more tedious than fun to gain the last 10-20% needed for a victory

All full manual of course

I guess I just get the most fun from understanding in detail how the game works... and then deriving strategies based on this information and playing with very high amounts of micromanagement. That's why I also restarted on highest difficulty with the harshest pirates, because I expect to be much more effective than the AI once I understand how everything is working.

OR i'm masochistic... still unsure about that...

ORIGINAL: BlueTemplar

Thank you for this guide, but...

700 stars with full manual control : are you CRAZY?!

Hyyyyyy hyyyyyy hyyyyyyeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaar :drool:

/wipes drool away and says in a voice full of gravitas:

Seriously, it is not that hard - in fact, it is easier to have it all on manual. How many fleets do you have on this many systems? 4? 5? 10? No problem to control all of them manually. Have some defensive fleets on border systems, have one Attack Fleet and one Invasion Fleet.

Constructor ships? Why have more than 5? I do not need to spam mining bases EVERYWHERE in EVERY system.

Explorers? These MUST be controlled manually for maximum effect to get to ruins ASAP because the lead programmer Eric grumble grumble hyyyyeeeeeeeaaaaa hyyyyyeeeeeeee :drool

Just check the left symbols for worlds to colonize, for research station locations and for space casinos wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee spin the wheel with your appendage, alien dude.... err.. dudedette..... say, do gizureans have different sexes..... 33 different sexes you say..... ahem... right....



In fact, in my experience, the game becomes much more tedious and annoying when ANY automation is turned on.


Edit: to that other dude, fenrislokison, who is manliness personified (not a whisker on that dude's neck!), yes, game is much more fun on full manual, but as usual in 4x games, the end game becomes tedious.

However, this game only becomes tedious on the last end stretch, perhaps the last 5% of the gameplay, while Civ IV, a game I love, becomes tedious for the last 40% (military conquest, for example, gets super tedious in modern era on any normal sized map planet).

Hm, I'm still going to play my first real game on a 100 star 16 sectors map (I'm probably going to micromanage much more than you) - I'll consider raising the size for the next games. I'm a bit worried that Very Many Strong Respawning pirates on Extreme difficulty might have been a bit too much...

Explorers? These MUST be controlled manually for maximum effect to get to ruins ASAP because the lead programmer Eric grumble grumble hyyyyeeeeeeeaaaaa hyyyyyeeeeeeee :drool

Additional changes from 1.9.5.1:

EXPLORATION
- Exploration ships now scan for resources more quickly, moving on to next exploration target immediately once resources and ruins investigated
- increased amount of automated Exploration ships that are assigned to simply scout systems for colonization targets and ruins instead of performing full resource scan of system and all resources

Looks like he's working on these issues. [;)]

Hopefully I won't derail this discussion too much, but did you try Civ4 mods Rise of Mankind : A New Dawn 2 and Caveman to Cosmos ? I find them awesome, though C2C is perhaps a little too much...

Previously the most efficient approach to Exploration was to use the "move to" command, scan every Exploration ship every few game days, and manually select targets. This is a micromanagement nightmare even for players that like to play full manual but the benefits of doing so were massive.

The change Matrix have made to the Exploration Ship AI is fantastic as it means the AI is reasonably efficient at exploring individual systems. However, the AI is still pretty daft at exactly where it sends those Explorers so there is still a massive difference to full automatic. Manual control using the "explore system" command, system by system, may now be close enough to optimal, although ruin prioritisation could still be better.

Codeforce (they're the ones developing this game, right?) might want to look into the solutions that have been found to optimize the "travelling salesman" problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Travellin ... an_problem

AI still sucks very badly at exploring ruins. Passes right by them. I micromanage my first few explorers, but once I've got my immediate sector done and start cranking them out I typically set them to explore entire sectors.

ORIGINAL: BlueTemplar
Codeforce (they're the ones developing this game, right?) might want to look into the solutions that have been found to optimize the "travelling salesman" problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Travellin ... an_problem

I'm sure there are already aware of it ... it's rather well known. Maybe some of the Approximation Algorithms are useful but Exact Solutions would slow the game down to a crawl.

ORIGINAL: Timotheus

Edit: to that other dude, fenrislokison, who is manliness personified (not a whisker on that dude's neck!)

Maaaacho macho maaaaaan! I waaant to be a macho maaaaaaan!

QUESTION FOR EXPERTS: Game gives me an option to actually retrofit a gas mining/mining station; I assume that it does not work as it is a Private Sector Base?

ANSWER:

It does work. You can redesign private sector stuff and the retrofits take place as supply and constructors are available. I"m not an "expert" (but have taken part in some beta testing), however I arm the crap out of my mining stations and gas mining stations -- surprises the heck out of pirates when they come raiding.

ORIGINAL: BlueTemplar

Codeforce (they're the ones developing this game, right?) might want to look into the solutions that have been found to optimize the "travelling salesman" problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Travellin ... an_problem

Yeah, one of the problems with games like this is you can't really use the best algorithms for any sort of spacial awareness type stuff on the whole, it's just too expensive because you've got potentially hundreds of ships to deal with simultaneously. You have to use very, very basic algorithms that work, sort of, most of the time, but cost next to nothing to run.

Famous example of this is X3's autopilot algorithm, aka the autopillock. It works approximately like this:

1. Plot vector to target.
2. If obstruction detected for first time ahead within 1Km, turn 90 Deg in random direction, proceed for 1Km, store evasion vector chosen with timeout and go back to step 1.
3. If obstruction detected ahead and previous evasion timeout still running, turn 90 deg to on stored evasion vector, proceed for 1Km, reset timeout and go back to step 1.
4. If at any time obstruction detected ahead within 1Km on evasion vector, kill timeout and go back to step 2.

There are many hilarious results from this algorithm, hilarious so long as you have a recent save handy that is, but it is dirt cheap and it does work 99% of the time. Trouble is we humans are very good at understanding 3D spacial relationships and the player can see see the whacking great asteroid sitting directly in the path to the space station they want to dock at and can't understand why the autopilot doesn't just turn 5 Deg to port and avoid it all together instead of flying straight at the thing at full speed and suddenly, sickeningly, veering at 90 Deg at the last moment (if you're lucky that is) followed by a further series of sickening 90 Deg turns as the ship keeps turning back into the rock face to try again and again in vain to get round the damned thing.

Anyways, an i7 doesn't have 100 billion node neural network trained for billions of years to do the job unfortunately (or perhaps fortunately if half the sci-fi cannon is to be believed).