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Wouldn't a modular LRM design be more reasonable? The basic control and guidance system would be a fixed size and weight, and each set of 4 tubes/loaders would add a fixed amount to that. Reload times would be the same, heat per tube would be the same (plus a small amount extra for the controller), and cost would be the same per set (plus the controller). The large racks would benefit from economies of scale, dividing the cost/weight/heat of the controller over more tubes, but have no other size/weight/heat advantages.

Throwing a higher volume of shot should increase the odds of a hit, which you could simulate by having each set of 4 tubes resolved independently, but adding them all up before assigning and displaying the total damage done.

Any other system assumes different technology and/or quality of components between sizes. You could instead add a "Light LRM" system, with a shorter range, lower cost per tube, less slots, and poorer heat efficiency or reload times, for use on lighter Titans.

That "other" game had similar irregularities, where multiple LRM 5s had less weight and heat output than corresponding larger racks.

ORIGINAL: Burzmali

Someone remind me not to start a debate with debate Thorgrim over hypothetical technology next time this come up [;)]

I'm going end the debate at this point anyways, arguing when the Powers that Be haven't provided a complete breakdown of what technology is and isn't available is just silly. For the time being, I have decided that all of the ATs armor, frame, weapons, and components are made from Balancium, a substance that always has the weight, volume and heat dissipation that is best for balancing the game. Conviently, balancium can only be used in vehicles built with 2 legs, arms and a head, so only ATs can be cool enough to be important, have a nice day.

As a side note, I like the fog of war idea, maybe with FoW on, the player would be forced to get a yellow or green scan before an opposing AT is identified. Variations would be cool too (i.e. a lock determines that the opposing AT is a Guru, but a yellow or green scan reveals that it is the Guru H, which has had it's MGs traded in for FTs) but alot more work...

Variation is more difficult to pull off than you think. In the example you gave, you swapped MGs for FTs. In order to do so, you need to take off the MGs, which free up 2 tons, but that's not even enough for one FT which is 2.50 tons + .50 tons ammo.

In order to implement such a feature, a system of "grouping" titan designs into design archetype and variants. I think that would take too much programming.

Btw, the fastest recon is the Chassis 4 recon. It's topspeed is 150 km, which is around 93 mph.

ORIGINAL: Kovax

Wouldn't a modular LRM design be more reasonable? The basic control and guidance system would be a fixed size and weight, and each set of 4 tubes/loaders would add a fixed amount to that. Reload times would be the same, heat per tube would be the same (plus a small amount extra for the controller), and cost would be the same per set (plus the controller). The large racks would benefit from economies of scale, dividing the cost/weight/heat of the controller over more tubes, but have no other size/weight/heat advantages.

Throwing a higher volume of shot should increase the odds of a hit, which you could simulate by having each set of 4 tubes resolved independently, but adding them all up before assigning and displaying the total damage done.

Any other system assumes different technology and/or quality of components between sizes. You could instead add a "Light LRM" system, with a shorter range, lower cost per tube, less slots, and poorer heat efficiency or reload times, for use on lighter Titans.

That "other" game had similar irregularities, where multiple LRM 5s had less weight and heat output than corresponding larger racks.

LRM6 weigh less but LRM12 occupy less slots. Depending on the design, this 1 slot over 2 tons could mean a big difference. Anyway, the missiles have already been readjusted and will come out in the next patch release. The only real trouble is the SRMs...

ORIGINAL: Kovax
Throwing a higher volume of shot should increase the odds of a hit, which you could simulate by having each set of 4 tubes resolved independently, but adding them all up before assigning and displaying the total damage done.

Any other system assumes different technology and/or quality of components between sizes. You could instead add a "Light LRM" system, with a shorter range, lower cost per tube, less slots, and poorer heat efficiency or reload times, for use on lighter Titans.

Well, that is pretty close to what I told Larkin. Glad to see someone else is using his head. [:D]

ORIGINAL: aquietfrog
In order to implement such a feature, a system of "grouping" titan designs into design archetype and variants. I think that would take too much programming.

OmniTitans, eh? [:D] It doesn't make sense in the ToS universe, since there's only 4 different chassis in each weight class. The chassis are not "personalized" for each design. The only thing that differentiates externally one R4 design from another is the weapon config. So Omni tech is already the basis of titan construction in a way. All the equipment is already modular in concept.

Btw, the fastest recon is the Chassis 4 recon. It's topspeed is 150 km, which is around 93 mph.

Heh, he forgot to check. He also forgot that a few *recons* do have only one main weapon, but that that's only a small fraction of the database.

ORIGINAL: Burzmali
Someone remind me not to start a debate with debate Thorgrim over hypothetical technology next time this come up [;)]

I wasn't talking about hypothetical tech, I was talking about the tech used in the game, in the terms used in the game. You called it hypothetical. In the universe of the game, it's not hypothetical. As a game, and in those terms, it can be discussed. It's not like we're trying to develop new tech around here.
I can't even understand why you stepped into the discussion if you knew you were going to say "I'm not going to argue because that's hypothetical" everytime you run into a corner...

I'm going end the debate at this point anyways, arguing when the Powers that Be haven't provided a complete breakdown of what technology is and isn't available is just silly.

Maybe you shouldn't even have started then? It was a discussion about a game, not a life and death matter.

For the time being, I have decided that all of the ATs armor, frame, weapons, and components are made from Balancium, a substance that always has the weight, volume and heat dissipation that is best for balancing the game. Conviently, balancium can only be used in vehicles built with 2 legs, arms and a head, so only ATs can be cool enough to be important, have a nice day.

Nope, a lot of work went into making the game as balanced as possible. So it wasn't fully achieved it seems. Still there's no need for Balancium or other crappy excuses. Some tweaks and testing, even if it doesn't get perfect, it'll get better.

As a side note, I like the fog of war idea, maybe with FoW on, the player would be forced to get a yellow or green scan before an opposing AT is identified. Variations would be cool too (i.e. a lock determines that the opposing AT is a Guru, but a yellow or green scan reveals that it is the Guru H, which has had it's MGs traded in for FTs) but alot more work...

I think the idea was not to use the FoW switch, but a switch *like* the FoW one. ID doesn't really have to do with FoW, but with scanner range, and active scans.
Variants, well, making variants of an energy-based design (or the other way around) really screws the logic. Major overhauls needed, HR and engine at least.

Hmm, I just realized... no need for vague names... just delay ID until a yellow scan. If you're really aiming for a challenge, delay ID until a green scan. In both cases, an ID would be achieved if the enemy titan is in the same hex as your titans. By that time, it would've fired all its weapons and you could've guessed what that titan is.

ORIGINAL: Kovax

Wouldn't a modular LRM design be more reasonable? The basic control and guidance system would be a fixed size and weight, and each set of 4 tubes/loaders would add a fixed amount to that. Reload times would be the same, heat per tube would be the same (plus a small amount extra for the controller), and cost would be the same per set (plus the controller). The large racks would benefit from economies of scale, dividing the cost/weight/heat of the controller over more tubes, but have no other size/weight/heat advantages.

I just reread this and I think I get what you mean... However that would imply changing weights resulting in database design incompatibilities. From how I understand it, either the smaller racks get heavier or the larger racks get lighter... Smaller racks getting heavier would screw a lot of designs due to being overweight. Larger racks getting highter would then result to free weight.

Speaking of weight, LRM6 weighs 5 tons, LRM9 weighs 8.5, LRM12 weighs 12. What's with all that weight gain?

Thorgrim, if you want to debate the "Real" tech in this game please explain the presence or absence or extent of development of the following technologies, and why they are deviated from modern expectations.

Cold Fusion

Antimatter Reactors

Room Temperature Superconductors

Quantum Computers

Artifical Intelligences

Materials Science

Nanotechnology

EM Field Projection (i.e. "Shields")

For a start. See I really have no point to agrue from since the level of advancement for these and other technologies determines what is possible. Their deviation from modern projections explains why ATs supercede conventional military forces. Debating anything, anywhere, fictional or not, when a foundation hasn't been set is silly!

I wish this discussion will continue as private mail. Each time I check for some interesting additions I just find the same two usual suspects arguing about stuff I don't care at all.

ROTFLMAO